|Commander / EDH||Legal|
Printings View all
|Shadows over Innistrad (SOI)||Mythic Rare|
|SDCC Promo 2017 (S17)||None|
|Promo Set (000)||Mythic Rare|
Combos Browse all
Jace, Unraveler of Secrets
Planeswalker — Jace
+1: Scry 1, then draw a card.
-2: Return target creature to its owner's hand.
-8: You get an emblem with "Whenever an opponent casts his or her first spell each turn, counter that spell."
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Jace, Unraveler of Secrets Discussion
2 weeks ago
Hi DarkStarStorm, Thank you for your kind reply.
and im looking forward on a new PW at upcoming RNA block Kaya, Orzhov Usurper
2 weeks ago
I realize that you have said that you're slowly building the manabase, insinuating that this is on a budget, but if you happen across a Captain Sisay, I would trade for or buy it.
2 weeks ago
With regards to your questions on the Legend Rule, the questions do not make sense. You refer to "legendary" as a subtype, when it is, in fact, a supertype. You further do not seem to understand what Mirror Gallery does, and your question is a tad nonsensical as a result. Still, in the interest of helping you, I have written a mini lecture on the Legend Rule, with a particular focus on how it interacts with planeswalkers.
The Legend Rule reads:
704.5j If a player controls two or more legendary permanents with the same name, that player chooses one of them, and the rest are put into their owners’ graveyards. This is called the “legend rule.”
Wizards has had some trouble getting "legendary" and the Legend Rule correct. This was further complicated by the similar "Planeswalker Uniqueness Rule" which has subsequently been removed. Planeswalkers now fall within the confines of the regular Legend Rule:
306.4. Previously, planeswalkers were subject to a “planeswalker uniqueness rule” that stopped a player from controlling two planeswalkers of the same planeswalker type. This rule has been removed and planeswalker cards printed before this change have received errata in the Oracle card reference to have the legendary supertype. Like other legendary permanents, they are subject to the “legend rule” (see rule 704.5j).
Rules out of the way, how does this work for Planeswalkers?
First, all planeswalkers have received the "Legendary" supertype as errata. So, where Narset Transcendent previously said "Planeswalker - Narset" her Oracle text, which controls, reads "Legendary Planeswalker - Narset".
Next, it's the same rule as with creatures, artifacts, or other legendary permenants - if you control two legendary permanents with the same exact card name, one is sent to the graveyard as a state-based action. The subtype (i.e. the planeswalker type) is irrelevant. This might be a change from the Planeswalker uniqueness rule, but it is in line with other permanents--after all, you can control two "Legendary Creature - Elf Warrior" so long as the card names do not match (ex. you can control both Grand Warlord Radha and Radha, Heir to Keld).
So, looking at planeswalkers specifically, this means you can control both Jace, the Mind Sculptor and Jace, Unraveler of Secrets at the same time. However, you would not be able to control two Jace, the Mind Sculptor.
Mirror Gallery is an odd card that says Rule 704.5j no longer applies--permanents are not sent to the graveyard as a state-based action if you control two copies with the same name. With Mirror Gallery in play, you (or your opponents) can have as many copies of Grand Warlord Radha on the battlefield as you want.
Mirror Gallery does not remove the legendary supertype, or any cards that interact with Legendary permanents--it merely stops the state-based action from occurring.
As previously discussed, planeswalkers initially were not covered by the Legend Rule, but by the Planeswalker Uniqueness Rule. However, with this rule removed, Mirror Gallery applies to planeswalkers as well. With a Mirror Gallery in play, you (or your opponents) can control multiple cards named Jace, the Mind Sculptor.
With regards to the deck, you can cut Mu Yanling. She's a bad card to begin with, made worse by almost all your creatures being tokens.
3 weeks ago
Well, I offered a couple ideas at the top of the thread but at the time you were still trying to thin the deck down to 100. I’ll give you a bunch more ideas now:
- Rest in Peace + Energy Field or Web of Inertia. I ran this combo for quite awhile in my Zur deck till I discovered the solemnity/glen elendra/kithkin spellduster combos. After that I had to find a different immortality combo so I could have a graveyard. That led me to...
- Phyrexian Unlife + Solemnity makes it so you can’t die either. Coupled with Necropotence you can pay all your life to put most of your library in your hand in one shot. Speaking of Necropotence...
- Necropotence + Zur's Weirding is a combo that will lock your opponents down by denying them acces to their libraries. You just pay the life to make them discard every card they draw. The way you get enough life to keep paying the life is Venser's Journal. And opponents can’t force you to discard squat because of Necropotence. You aren’t actually drawing cards.
- Riptide Chimera + Second Chance: this gives you infinite turns or enough to setup what you want. Just pay your life down to less than 5 with Necropotence to start this combo. Just put second chance’s ability on the stack then return it to your hand with the chimera before it is sacrificed. I have checked with judges on this combo and according to them it does work.
- Eidolon of Rhetoric or Arcane Laboratory + Riptide Chimera stops your opponents from playing multiple spells per turn but lets you cast as many as you want during your turn. And with your Grand Abolisher opponents wont be able to do anything about it.
- Eidolon of Rhetoric or Arcane Laboratory + Jace, Unraveler of Secrets: get to Jace’s ult and opponents are screwed the rest of the game.
If you use the Enchanted Evening, Greater Auramancy, Copy Enchantment combo I mentioned at the top of this comment thread then the only thing opponents can do to stop any of the above combos is use board wipes but with Glen Elendra and Solemnity that won’t be possible. Would also be a good idea to run at least 12 counterspells to protect against anything else they might be able to do. Also use a bunch of tutors to grab combo pieces that you are unable to Zur out. Plea for Guidance is a good one since you can grab 2 in one shot. Hope these ideas help you out. Good Luck.
4 weeks ago
Deck is honestly fine especially for starting out. You look like you did a reasonable amount of research into the direction you want to go.
So somethings, even on a budget- 4th Cryptic Command is a must. You need a sideboard, you seem like you're all ready to have a competitive deck, sideboards and options are what make a deck competitive. I think one of the fun things in modern is learning how to play the deck and exploring options, with that in mind Hieroglyphic Illumination, Dream Eater, Jace, Unraveler of Secrets, Detention Sphereand Timely Reinforcements will probably end up not staying around the mainboard (unless your meta has lot of fast aggro damaging decks for Timely), and while they were just reprinted Celestial Colonnade is probably the first major change you should try and make to add to the deck, then Flooded Strand. Lands increase consistency, and just help you figure out stuff later.
I hope that helps or gives your some validation to what you already knew or were looking for.
1 month ago
From that base, you could go more into turbo-stasis with Blind Obedience, Tangle Wire, Kismet, and Frozen AEther type cards, stax with Sphere of Resistance, Thorn of Amethyst, Grand Arbiter Augustin IV, and Thalia, Guardian of Thraben, or permission control with Counterspells, Swords to Plowshares, Terminus, Supreme Verdict, and other control cards.
In a playgroup filled with walker commanders, Pithing Needle and Sorcerous Spyglass are great removal, as is anything else that can do similar effects. Suppression Field forces the issue that Stasis asks:
Can you pay for that?
Other than that, more cards that fit here are:
Jace, Unraveler of Secrets, Tamiyo, the Moon Sage, Brago, King Eternal (flickers walkers to reset counters&activations for the turn), Azorius Signet, Cyclonic Rift, Fellwar Stone, Sol Ring, Chrome Mox, Brainstorm, Ponder, Preordain, Swan Song, Path to Exile, Damping Sphere, Rings of Brighthearth (doubles walker activations!), Inspiring Statuary, Sphinx's Revelation, Search for Azcanta Flip, Return to Dust, Fact or Fiction, Mystical Tutor, Arcane Denial, Teferi's Protection, Rewind, Reality Shift, Tragic Arrogance, Cleansing Nova, Treasure Cruise, Dig Through Time, Mind Stone, Sensei's Divining Top, etc.
1 month ago
I'm running a budget white/blue control deck that currently has 3x Sphinx's Revelation (no Teferi or Mind Sculptor. Like I said, budget.) However, I do have a copy of Jace, Unraveler of Secrets floating around. I'm considering swapping out 1x Revelation for 1x Jace. Thoughts?
1 month ago
The first thing I'll say is that with 21 lands, you probably can't expect to get the mana to launch Army of the Damned or a really powerful Mind Grind or Torment of Hailfire. Well, at least without Organ Harvest, of which you're only sporting one copy. (If you don't play with teammates, or if you don't play with silver-bordered cards, you might replace it with Culling the Weak.) For reference, the math on Army of the Damned is that about 1/3 of your cards are lands = 8/24, meaning you need to survive to turn 17-18 (have seen a total of 24 cards between your opening hand and your draws each turn) to hit that 8th land. That’s a long time in a Magic game.
Second, Mind Grind, while fun, is questionable here, since none of your other cards will mill your opponent. Many people play with 4 copies of many of their cards, so milling them might not cut them off from their game plan unless you mill them so much they might die. And for that, you would need more support for the mill plan or a LOT more mana. (This is possible, but a big change. Look for cards like Glimpse the Unthinkable and Mind Funeral. Otherwise, I'd cut it for cards that affect board-state or life-totals.)
Third, your overall game plan appears to be to stall in the early game for more powerful plays late, since your low cost cards are generally defensive. This means you'll want more lands in your deck so that you don't stumble on your way to those big plays. I'd remove Coral Atoll and put in four Dimir Aqueducts. It's not the ideal play, but it's cheap and there's a lot of upside if your opponent doesn't Ghost Quarter it or something. Anyways, that will take you up to 24 lands AND increase your average mana output a little more, letting you rely on 4CMC, 5CMC, and 6CMC plays to dominate the game.
Finally, on to individual cards:
Kraken Hatchling, Mausoleum Wanderer, Pharika's Chosen, and Will-o'-the-Wisp are all fine defensive one-drops, but they all do something a little different. Thornbow Archer is a little more aggressive than the rest of your deck wants, so maybe drop it and pick your favorite of those first four and add a second.
Fogwalker is okay on defense, though it's not the best two-drop out there. I'm not a fan of Olivia's Dragon, especially outside of madness/reanimator decks. Rancid Rats just doesn't offer enough oomph for the mana (skulk is not typically a very useful ability). Graf Rats is bad unless you have Midnight Scavengers, so it's really about how much you personally want to meld them. Ultimately, I'd rather replace them with better blockers like Wall of Tears, Wall of Souls, Contraband Kingpin, Dragon's Eye Savants, Gifted Aetherborn, or the absolute top-tier Baleful Strix. Other value options include Omenspeaker, Sigiled Starfish, and Augur of Bolas. Other fun options here are Surge Mare, Riptide Mangler, Lazav, the Multifarious, Fathom Feeder, and Ludevic's Test Subject Flip. Choose your favorites. Alternately, spot-removal like Doom Blade, Victim of Night, Cast Down, Go for the Throat, and sometimes Dimir Charm are pretty effective.
Wharf Infiltrator can be good sometimes. You can leave it in for fun or replace it.
Eternal Scourge has its uses, but I don't think this deck is optimized for it. Ideally you'd want a few things that can exile it from graveyard or hand, such as Gurmag Angler, Soulflayer, Tombstalker, Scavenging Ooze, Grim Lavamancer), Azor's Gateway Flip (from hand), or the most hilarious option, Serum Powder. As it stands, it's just difficult to kill outside of combat, like a bad shroud or hexproof. Honestly, I don't think you need a 3/3 to be immune to removal. Replace with a finisher, which I'll discuss in a bit. Alternately, one of my favorite defensive 3CMC creatures is Graveblade Marauder, since its offensive capabilities can rapidly increase.
Markov Crusader isn't actually very good even in the rare case when you do have another vampire, and you only have one other one. Compare to 4CMC utility wunderkind Kalitas, Traitor of Ghet, 5CMC finishers (like Archfiend of Depravity, Glyph Keeper, Ob Nixilis, the Fallen, Vengeful Pharaoh, and maybe even Serra Sphinx), and 6CMC game-winners (like Noxious Gearhulk, Dread, Kokusho, the Evening Star, Wurmcoil Engine, Grave Titan, or even Vengeant Vampire, though that last one is much worse than the others). Sure, none do exactly what Markov Crusader does, but some are close and they all have incredible upsides. Even something like Shriekmaw might ultimately gain you more life by just killing something outright, plus it's super-flexible. Heck, Soul Ransom and Mind Control are strong cards too, at least against creature decks. Anyways, Markov Crusader is a card to replace.
Midnight Scavengers is okay, especially if you have a lot of disposable deathtouchers to bring back, but it still doesn't compare favorably to the above finishers unless you really want to meld it with Graf Rats. Remember, doing things you want to do is an important part of MTG. But if you don't care to meld, I'd look to replace it.
Ob Nixilis, Unshackled is fine. In most cases it doesn't compare favorably to the 6CMC critters above, but it has its uses. If you've got a lot of little deathtouchers (Pharika's Chosen, Typhoid Rats, Dire Fleet Poisoner, it can grow really out of hand. Also, Field of Ruin forces a library search.
Elder Deep Fiend is fine. Usually you play it in a deck that has plenty of creatures you don't mind (or are better off) sacrificing (for example, Priest of the Blood Rite, Relentless Dead, Doomed Dissenter, Stormbound Geist/Geralf's Messenger), then you emerge it early and tap down lands. That's not really your plan here, so it's probably not the best choice. Some good choices for replacements are above, but within the category of emerge creatures, I think Distended Mindbender fits your deck better.
Organ Harvest is a powerful card, but has some drawbacks. Most importantly, a lot of people don't play with or against silver-bordered cards. They're not legal in any official tournaments. Tournament legal variations are Dark Ritual, Culling the Weak, and Ashnod's Altar. Other than that, it's a card that is useless in many situations and completely changes what you're able to do when you actually can make use of it, and that can be awkward from a strategy perspective. If you don't have creatures, you can't cast it. If you don't have a big spell in your hand, you don't need to cast it and you'd rather have almost any other card. So it wants your deck to be full of disposable creatures and big spells, like an emerge deck or a zombie deck really making use of Army of the Damned and From Under the Floorboards. But for the most part that is not this deck, so unless you want to build around the card, I'd remove it, either replacing it with Dark Ritual which is always useful when drawn early, or something else that's cheap and effective: Dead Weight, Apathy, Doom Blade, Pharika's Chosen, or whatever.
Sorcerous Sight is worse than Peek and Gitaxian Probe, but I don't think any of those are particularly good in your deck. If you want to know what's in your opponent's hand, play Telepathy. Otherwise, there's better card draw: Preordain and Ponder are the best cheap spells, but it might be worth spending more mana for more effect with Sign in Blood or Chart a Course.
Cemetery Recruitment isn't particularly good with so few zombies. You can add more zombies, or switch to Ghoulcaller's Chant/Find / Finality/Recover/Disturbed Burial/Death Denied to simulate the effect, or just do card advantage the old-fashioned way, with stuff like Sign in Blood/Consult the Necrosages/Read the Bones/Notion Rain/Secrets of the Golden City. Alternately, shred your opponent's hand (and lose friends) with Hymn to Tourach or punch your opponent for cards with Shadowmage Infiltrator. If you're committed to bringing creatures back from the dead, look to Zombify, Extract from Darkness, or Isareth the Awakener, which can randomly run away with the game if your opponent doesn't have an answer. The most efficient reanimation spell is Unburial Rites, but you'd need to splash white for it to be better than the above options.
Contingency Plan doesn't actually net you any cards in hand; you just control what you are going to draw later. Since you're not very graveyard-focused, there's little benefit. The more flexible version is Dimir Charm, and the more powerful version is Lim-Dul's Vault. If you want to stack the top of your deck for 2CMC without wasting a card to do it, there's Diabolic Vision, but the 1CMC Preordain and Ponder are worthy as well. Alternately, raw card advantage is an option. Any of the options I've already listed are fine, but here are some more: Chemister's Insight, Foresee, Deep Analysis.
Mind Grind attacks on an irrelevant axis. Recommend replacing it with a finisher unless you add more mill. If you want a non-creature finisher, Ob Nixilis Reignited is pretty cool. If you just want something that can't get Murdered, there's Sphinx of Jwar Isle.
Torment of Hailfire is possibly workable if you go to 24 lands with Dimir Aqueducts. X=3 is pretty much the bare minimum, and if they have cards in hand even that might not be enough. This is a possible swap for a finisher, as above.
Army of the Damned is hard to cast at 8CMC. Recommend replacing it with a cheaper finisher unless you're all about Organ Harvest.
Apathy is pretty decent at 1CMC. Probably not as good as just casting Doom Blade/Go for the Throat to kill the thing, but definitely more interesting and fun. It can stay in, though swapping it for something more reliable is technically the correct decision.
Strange Augmentation is bad in your deck. While +3/+3 for 1CMC is fine in a very aggressive deck, that doesn't seem like your game plan. Ideally, your finishers are big enough to win without the extra P/T. If they're not, these could be replaced with kill spells to make sure they are.
Tormod's Crypt is useless unless you frequently play against graveyard-based decks. Even then, with only one in the deck, you're in bad shape. I'd swap it for Relic of Progenitus or Sentinel Totem if you really need graveyard hate. If a creature is reliable against those graveyard decks, Deadeye Tracker, Nezumi Graverobber, or Withered Wretch can do some work. Agent of Erebos is another option. If the only things you need to exile are creatures, then Cemetery Reaper, Dimir Doppelganger, and the powerful Kalitas, Traitor of Ghet are options. Otherwise, cheap kill spells, counterspells, or even more expensive exiling removal (e.g. Sever the Bloodline, Silence the Believers) are options. Phyrexian Scriptures is another card I'll mention, just 'cause it does lots of stuff.
Nevinyrral's Disk is pretty good. Go ahead and keep that in there.
Gridlock is okay, but it's basically a Darkness you can use aggressively. I think Sleep is generally better at that. Alternately, if you want a mass-defense spell, Yahenni's Expertise, Languish, and Damnation are the go-to sweepers.
Outwit is way too narrow; most decks don't target players. (The primary exceptions are burn and mill, so if you play against them a lot, it might be fine.) If you want a dollar-cost-effective counterspell in that slot, play Counterspell or MAYBE Dimir Charm for flexibility.
Murder is fine. (Card-wise, not morally!) Technically Hero's Downfall is better if you can get one.
Liliana Vess is fine, but she's a little slow. I'm not sure whether she's better or worse in this deck than Jace, Unraveler of Secrets, Ob Nixilis Reignited, Ob Nixilis of the Black Oath, or even Ashiok, Nightmare Weaver. My inclination is that those are stronger as you increase the median quality of the cards in your deck (making Vess's -2 less important).
Here's one inexpensive, somewhat-boring take:
2x Glyph Keeper
1x Liliana Vess
2x Dimir Charm
2x Doom Blade
2x Agony Warp
3x Notion Rain
That's just one take on the general strategy. Ultimately, (I think) you're playing Dimir Midrange, and so you're looking for about 40% (24) lands, 30% (18) things that keep you alive until you have 4-6 mana, 20% (12) things that kill your opponent and are themselves hard to kill, and 10% (6) things that put you ahead on cards just in case you're not drawing the right part of your deck.