Unclaimed Archetypes?
Standard forum
Posted on May 22, 2014, 10:39 p.m. by capriom85
Standard has been pretty well established right now with Mono B and U Devotion, UW variants of Control, Boros Burn, Junk Mid, etc.I'd like to take a minute to discuss any overlooked ideas. Anyone have any other ideas, no matter how janky they may be, that you would like to see made into a nice 75 card FNM contestant?
I have been looking for a deck to break through for so long. Most of my builds are along the lines of what you are looking for. I have even been toying with the idea of Jund Self- Land Destruction with the help of flyguy
So far i think my deck U/G Constellation shows the most promise
May 22, 2014 11:15 p.m.
This isn't anything against you, I've seen a lot of people do this, but I really don't like it when people just lump all U/W/x builds into one category. Bant is a completely different deck from Esper, and both run much differently from American. To call them all the same is just ignoring important aspects of each deck.
Now that I've got that off my chest, I think some kind of Junk Rock deck could have tons of potential. A deck that could string something like Soldier of the Pantheon into Voice of Resurgence /Fleecemane Lion into Brimaz, King of Oreskos /Loxodon Smiter into Advent of the Wurm /Desecration Demon and then top with Obzedat, Ghost Council , Blood Baron of Vizkopa and Elspeth, Sun's Champion could be really strong in the current meta. Just my 2 cents.
May 22, 2014 11:22 p.m.
InconspicuousPotato says... #5
@kmcree I also group them all as one because they have the same core and it's easier to group them all together. Currently, strait U/W and Esper control are doing best, but to just say that and leave out the others that perform decently doesn't feel right.
As for the forum answer, I love my GU Ramp deck,
I also want white weenie to succeed.
May 22, 2014 11:28 p.m.
Arorsthrar says... #6
Dredge is overlooked, and I played it at my last FNM and went 3-1, taking down a Minotaur Deck, Esper Control (2-0), and R/G Monsters. It is really overlooked, and I want to keep it that way so Rest in Peace and other hosers stay out of decks.
W/B and MonoBlack aggro are great decks that just don't see enough play due to MBD, which, IMO is ruining standard. There was a SCG article recently about how B/G Devotion is just the best deck in standard, and wizards has been gift wrapping black some extremely powerful cards, effectively homogenizing standard (5 of the 8 top placing decks are black, the others are MUD, U/W Devo, and R/W Burn).
I really hope another deck does arise that isn't just a pile of good cards (which is exactly what Junk Midrange is-next to no synergies) and maybe could knock B/G and MBD off of its throne. I think R/W Devotion is a potential taker. The devotion strategy with the white splash allows for more answers, and gives access to cards like Boros Charm and Legion's Initiative , which synergizes extremely well with Fanatic of Mogis and is good against removal.
Also, I hope Bant Flash or U/W midrange featuring Ephara, God of the Polis and Prophet of Kruphix or Brimaz, King of Oreskos becomes a thing.
May 22, 2014 11:31 p.m.
Yes they have the same core, but they can also be built drastically different. Bant has been running a lot of Sylvan Caryatid and Courser of Kruphix lately, in addition to Kiora. Esper relies primarily on spot removal, which isn't available to either of the other two, as well as cards like Blood Baron of Vizkopa and Obzedat, Ghost Council . American relies heavily on counterspells and burn, which obviously isn't available in the others. I'm just saying that they're very different decks, and just grouping into the same category because they all run Sphinx's Revelation , Supreme Verdict and Detention Sphere is just doing them a disservice.
May 22, 2014 11:34 p.m.
InconspicuousPotato says... #8
I think it's just best for simplicity. If you're naming specific archetypes and how they work, yeah group them differently. But if you're just listing top decks I think U/W/x variants is good enough.
May 22, 2014 11:37 p.m.
Yeah that's fair. I just see almost everywhere people just call them all U/W/x and make vast generalizations about them all, and it's a bit of a pet peeve. I wouldn't ever group Grixis, Jund and Dega all into B/R/x because they aren't the same thing.
May 22, 2014 11:40 p.m.
notamardybum says... #10
U/W/x control is good enough because they are all Sphinx's Revelation decks.
May 22, 2014 11:45 p.m.
MSU_Iced_Z says... #11
For an "FNM contestant" these are the two my girlfriend and I run, and they can pretty consistently go in the 3-1 range at a 200 person FNM. They're not remotely tier 1, but they're fun tier 2-ish decks atm. Maybe someone can kick them up all the way, so here they are.
E's Second Rakdos Rakdos Aggro
B/W life -FNM suggestions please! I honestly don't even know what to call the archetype. Ethereal Armor is a really good card.
May 23, 2014 12:20 a.m.
ColdHeartedSith says... #12
Dredge isnt dredge but it is and its pretty good. Id play it if I didnt trade away all my O-TOMBS. I don't know if this counts because its devotion but uses land destruction to impair then desolate their land while being happy about having nykthos. Its called landhammer here is a prototype Red Green Land Hammer Nobody knows what to do facing this avenue of attack right now. I am trying to infect you with this idea, its real strong right now because those 3 color decks are popping up too and mutavaults get busted so rats die and swamps enchanted with connections die as a team get my drift.
May 23, 2014 12:51 a.m.
CommanderOfBolas says... #13
I am playing my Grixis deck (Gods of Grixis (Journey Gameday Deck)), and I feel like Grixis is well positioned in the format right now.
May 23, 2014 12:54 a.m.
Hjaltrohir says... #14
I would say that BG Constellation/Dredge could become a big archetype after rotation.
May 23, 2014 1:40 a.m.
notamardybum: Clumping decks together just because they play one same card isn't very logical.
Bant has decks like these that don't really do anything similar to what an Esper control deck does, except for playing Planeswalkers and casting Sphinx's Revelation .
My Zandl's RUG Midrange-y Control has Magma Jet , so by your logic, it's the same as Boros Burn.
May 23, 2014 1:50 a.m.
Nigeltastic says... #16
B/G Constellation Dredge is pretty potent right now, but people overlook it. By using Strength from the Fallen in conjunction with Pharika, God of Affliction 's ability, it's pretty easy to make a massive Lotleth Troll or sacrifice a creature to Jarad, Golgari Lich Lord for 30+ damage. Post rotation it will have a touch of trouble replacing those two, but it's very possible, and I think the deck is very strong currently.
May 23, 2014 1:50 a.m.
notamardybum says... #17
zandl it's not just one card. It's literally an archetype itself.
May 23, 2014 2:52 a.m.
Rev decks are decks that just sit, control, and draw a lot until they suddenly win. I get that.
But saying any deck with Rev is a Rev deck at heart? Preposterous. Based on the wildly varying deck examples that I provided, I'd kindly like to prove you incorrect now.
May 23, 2014 2:58 a.m.
kmcree, I only lump Esper, America, and Bant together as UWx builds to save on typing space. I have run each deck before on my own and agree theey run 3 different ways. That said, it was just easier for me to type UWx than Each individual archetype.Arorsthrar, I currently run WB Athreos aggro, and it has been running well; I am just getting bored with the meta and want to shake my LGS up a bit.One kid has been successfully piloting a BW Bogbrew Witch , Festering Newt , and Bubbling Cauldron combo deck. It actually gets there a lot and it is fun to see the face of guys piloting top 8 decks like Esper and MBD/MUD when they get hammered by a combo that by all rights should not be a thing against tier 1 decks.
May 23, 2014 12:14 p.m.
NashedPotatoes says... #20
i like to see peoples face when i top deck and win with corrupt. most people dont even know what it does anymore!
May 23, 2014 2:45 p.m.
NashedPotatoes says... #21
thats why i try to make really cheap decks with only commons and uncommons, but they still have lots of good combos and are always a threat. i played a deck that i posted at fnm and i went 3-1. check it out, most people could make right now. Black wins again.
May 23, 2014 2:47 p.m.
I Love plays like Corrupt for the win. They come out of nowhere and your opponent kinda goes blank, then tries desperately to find a way to contest it, then finally accept that they lost to a 5 cent common.
I also feel Brimaz is under utilized right now. He sees some play but the kitty king really gets it done. He is good aggro and mid and I have used him to finish in control as well. I think he will be built around pretty soon and when it catches on people will be glad they have their play set. Archangel of Thune is another I feel should be dusted off more right now. She works well with the kitty tokens
May 23, 2014 5:53 p.m.
Eduardogbg says... #23
R/U/G delver. Got this idea while I was sleeving my recently opened Keranos, God of Storms togheter with Courser of Kruphix , Kiora, the Crashing Wave and reading about R/G monsters after Domri Rade rotation.
See a land, draw a land, play a land, see a creature, draw a creature, see a land, OH you still can play a second land this turn! Play a land, now you have mana, cast the creature and your deck is so thin that fetches are crying.
Next upkeep? You played the land so 3 dmg to the face...
Nuff said.
May 23, 2014 11:44 p.m.
Named_Tawyny says... #24
There's lots of archetypes still available, especially at the FNM/Game Day level. Currently, I'm playing two decks (and bringing out a third for Game Day) - a Selesnya Angelic midrange, and a mono-red burn. (The new one is an Orzov sac/drain). Nothing over about $50 (for the deck) and winning more than I lose.
Of course, since I started the burn deck, last week's FNM had about a half dozen decks running a Guttersnipe playset. ;)
There's always new decks to disturb the local meta. There's dozens of decent archetypes.
May 24, 2014 12:50 a.m.
I think B/U/X has a lot of potential in the tempo department. In fact, I have a Grixis deck over at Attempt at Grixis Tempo, but it definitely needs some work to... work. Which is doesn't, for now.
I think it has potential because we all know mono-B Aggro by now. In addition to that there's now Riptide Chimera and Crystalline Nautilus making a splash (heh). I'm completely convinced Mogis's Warhound could be great with these cards, except they all - including Herald of Torment - occupy slot nr. 3.
May 24, 2014 3:26 a.m.
lord_of_the_snakes says... #26
I want to see if anyone can make Gruul or Jund land destruction.
May 24, 2014 7:30 a.m.
I'd love to see a land-destruction Jund featuring Spiteful Blow and Riddle of Lightning . I've seen a few, both Gruul and Jund (neither with those spells, though), and both seem pretty viable. Ember Swallower is above-curve even without the Monstrous ability, so the archetype just makes it an all-star.
May 24, 2014 7:39 a.m.
Someone posted a Gruul land destruction on here already. It looks like it can get there by taking your opponent off guard. If your draws are lousy though forget it.
I am thinking RW is overlooked right now is two aspects: RW Devotion should most definitely be a thing. I'm not really seeing it anywhere. Iroas makes things like Assemble the Legion really hard to deal with, especially if you have something like Legion's Initiative or Spear of Heliod or Hall of Triumph in the mix as well. Imagine an infinite number of 4/4 hastey soldiers bearing down on your opponent that can't be blocked unless its by 2 or more creatures and don't take combat damage!!!! Let's throw Door of Destinies on there , too. Ouch!
The second way I see RW being overlooked is at the aura level. Let's call it Boros Enchantments. I don't see awesome constellation stuff going on for RW, but when you look at things like Hero of Iroas and the Fabled Hero its hard to not want to abuse the hell out them.
I think I am going to try an make a Boros midrange that focuses on early board removal to keep baddies out of my yard. Then, the deck wants to win by starting to drop one or more Assemble the Legion later in the game when opponents' resources are low and exhausted. Use things like Brimaz, King of Oreskos and Boros Reckoner as alternate beaters since a single Deicide hoses this strategy, and I would say you have something that would compete at FNM pretty well.
I also think there is room for Bx Reanimator. White seems to be the logical choice right now, but I am not sold on what the 75 should look like just yet. I think that without the G splash its hard to fill your GY without using something like Pack Rat which tells me it would be a slow strategy.
May 24, 2014 9:27 a.m.
Dare I even mention Erebos's Emissary ? I'm not the only one underwhelmed by that cycle, am I?
Why White for reanimator, though?
May 24, 2014 8:28 p.m.
White gives me access to Obzedat's Aid and Angel of Serenity is a great target to reanimate. Some of the non white ways to reanimate available right now are a bit janky...the Aid is at least a sure shot.
ChrisHansonBiomancin says... #2
I pretty firmly believe that almost any well-constructed homebrew that is piloted well can contend at the FNM level on a consistent basis.
Personally, I have made Top 8's and 4's quite a few times over the last few months with GU Monsters, Bant Flash (which admittedly has a lot of the UW shell but plays much differently), and a Jund midrange deck that plays like the old Deathrite Shaman Modern deck.
A friend of mine has had a similar run playing a variety of "good stuff" brews. The joke with him is that he picks 3 random colors out of a hat (or cuts off a chicken head or something), puts the best cards from those colors into the deck, adds a one-of Aurelia, the Warleader if applicable, and calls it a day.
May 22, 2014 11:10 p.m.