|Commander / EDH||Legal|
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|Scars of Mirrodin (SOM)||Mythic Rare|
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Liege of the Tangle
Creature — Elemental
Whenever Liege of the Tangle deals combat damage to a player, you may choose any number of target lands you control and put an awakening counter on each of them. Each of those lands is an 8/8 green Elemental creature for as long as it has an awakening counter on it. They're still lands.
Liege of the Tangle Discussion
2 months ago
I'd say Liege of the Tangle in multiplayer is just a big target on your forehead once they know it's in your deck... but if your play group goes full degenerate, it's an option you can have
3 months ago
Nissa, Who Shakes the World and Omnath, Locus of Mana are great for tons of mana and it will never run out if not spent with omnath, and with the lands you have Liege of the Tangle to give you ridiculous amounts of 8/8 creatures that are also lands to hit people in the face with, otherwise love the whole deck and the concept, Yisan, the Wanderer Bard is one of my personal favorites just haven't gotten around to making a deck for him
3 months ago
Hi, I hope that at least some of what i'm going to put here will be useful, and even if you don't use any of my advice then maybe you will be able to see where I am coming from and use the logic to find your own improvements :)
As the previous commenter has suggested the amount of ramp spells that put lands in to play in your deck is a bit to low for a ramp deck especially one that has subthemes of landfall. Typical commander deck building suggestions say that you should have 10 pieces of ramp to tide you into the midgame. This goes for any deck, not just ramp decks. In ramp decks you will want more. At my count you have 12 ramp cards that are reusable (ie, aren't the one shot sacrifice elemntals) this will want to be more really, with a focus on them being ones that put lands in to play. Another of note, is that cards like Zendikar Resurgent don't really count as a ramp slot, as by the time we can cast it, we have a lot of mana already. 'Ramp' cards are ones that you want to see in your opening hand to get you into your game plan faster.
For this reason I would look into replacing some of the creature based ramp and some other low impact cards with this ramp that will get us executing our main game plan faster and better.
These can all be easily replaced with land based ramp spells as they don't get you any further ahead on mana than 1 land, or are one shot abilities when we want to be dropping big things multiple times over multiple turns.
Smokebraider Is unique because it produces 2 mana for only 2 investment, but only if we focus in on elemtals so can be left on a short list to be evaluated. We'll list other potential cuts later when looking at more over all deck evaluation.
The previous commentor has provided a list which at first glance seems to be comprehensive enough to provide some ideas for what to add.
More conventional commander wisdom suggests that you have at least 5 ways to directly interact with your opponents game plan. I personally nearly always play more than this, but you should have at least 5. This direct interaction is preferred to be the targetted simgle response cards that can remove threats in any shape or form. Of note, this removal count is seperate from the count of mass removal. At my count you have Song of the Dryads , the down tick of Domri, Anarch of Bolas and Ingot Chewer as easily accessable removal. Things like the trigger from your commander or things like Magmatic Force are more incedental as you can't rely on them doing what you want when you need it.
Cards that could be added in this slot are many. But it is a good idea to have as many as you can being generic answers to anything, but also you need to make sure that they are ones you can realistically weave into your game plan instead of leaving up those answers at all times. This is mostly a balncing act that is where fine tuning comes in from playing the deck. But potential recommendations for all purpose would be Beast Within and Chaos Warp . After that they become more specific but can be cheaper in mana,
- Nature's Claim
- Domri's Ambush
- Force of Vigor
- Krosan Grip
- Hull Breach
- Broken Bond
- Reclamation Sage
This may seem counterintuitive, seen as you are planning on being the big creature deck that wants the board presence. But sometimes the opponents boards just need answering (Not to mention that you might end up getting a lot of elemental death triggers from Omnath). As such having 2 or 3 creature wraths might be worth trying. And having 2 or 3 artifact and enchantment wraths will be good to have access to aswell. Something you already have so I assume you already know.
Creature wraths to consider in green red include
- Blasphemous Act
- Chandra's Ignition
- Chain Reaction
- Savage Twister - This one is representative of X cost ones that are interesting to try as it gives you the oppertunity of clearing out small creatures while keeping yours alive if you would prefer. Another one that can also be used to finish of players is Rolling Earthquake
You already have the cards for mass removing artifacts and enchantments so I won't bother listing any more.
One of the most common recommendations I have to make to people about their deck is to up the amount of card draw or selection in their decks. There is no point in having sweet cards and synergies in here if we never get to see them! Normally I recommend having 10 ways of drawing cards in your deck, with some of them being repeating and some being one shot. At my count you currently have 7 (Or 8 if you count Praetor's Counsel which can do effectively a similar job), so you are nearly there but I would recommend adding a couple mr just to smooth out the deck running.
- Harmonize is the most obvious recommendation withit being notorious for its colour pie break with not haveing a restriction based on creatures or similar.
- Horn of Greed is universal, but we should be getting more value from it.
- Greater Good is amazing if you keep having big creatures to sacrifice. Thankfully due to our commander triggers, we do!
- Chandra, Flamecaller can cover multiple bases of what we need, it can be counted as both a wrath AND a card draw engine :) IT also even makes elementals (of note, they get exiled at end step instead of dieing so you won't normally get Omnath triggers. Sacrificing them to Greater Good though....... )
- Rishkar's Expertise can be great card draw as you don't need to take a full turn off to refuel, you still get to cast something that costs less, which could be that removal spell or something you needed!
These overview sections are recommendations for generic cards that could go in. From here on, we will be looking at more specific card options, and possible cuts from the existing deck
Now, again as the previous commentor mentioned, there are multiple ways you can take an Omnath deck. My take on them being
- RG Big thing Ramp. No specific synergies in mind except for incidental ones like, I need land to cast my big spells, and this card cards about land. Not a bad deck by any means, just less commander or theme focused.
- Elemental Tribal Ramp. This seems to be closer to what you are currently going for. Similar to the RG ramp deck, just with tribal synergies from elementals
- Landfall / Lands Matter. Here we are focusing on many landfall triggers, and keep cycling our lands round and round to get them. This deck will likke having access to things like Crucible of Worlds and many effects like Exploration
Here, i will suggest some cards for each of them and maybe later on if you want we could look more into one or a mix of these strategies.
- Ruric Thar, the Unbowed This card is very very powerful. Expecially as the decks around you get more and more powerful and wanting to do more combo and storm bsaed strategies.
- Gruul Ragebeast A good way of keeping the board under control when you play your 'large and incharge' creatures
- Vorinclex, Voice of Hunger We have mana, they don't. Enough said really. Just beware that with this creature, sometines the adage If you can't remove the problem, remove the player can be applied to just killing you.
Other than ones recommended here, perhaps a good idea would be to use Gatherer or mtg.wtf to find elementals in your colour. Or cards which reference elementals in your colours, the example in wtf would be this
- Chandra, Acolyte of Flame can rebuy your ramp spells and can make elementals that will die to trigger Omnath.
- Chandra, Awakened Inferno A wrath that doesn't kill elementals and can provide a reasonable clock on the game with her uptick.
- Omnath, Locus of Mana Store mana for a rainy day. Or for hitting your opponents upside the head with it. Both work.
- Parallel Lives Double the tokens, double the elementals, double the damage. We like.
- Tornado Elemental clears out any things like Dragons, or Flying Slivers or similar. Also good at picking of planeswalkers as it has sudo unblockable.
- Liege of the Tangle we can go REALLY all in on making all our lands elementals and meaning that if someone wraths us we can basically kill everyone from Omnath triggers
- Budoka Gardener Ramp early game, big guys late game.
This deck idea might have elements that are closer to a combo deck than the others, but will still mostly be a midrange deck.
- Perilous Forays With your commander out this card is bonkers. But if we are making other elemental tokens too then we can truly get going somewhere
- Crucible of Worlds , Ramunap Excavator , Life from the Loam Allow you to play the lands from your graveyard after we have sacrificed them for effects. Also makes always hitting your lands drops easier if you are playing and sacrificing a fetch land
- Exploration , Azusa, Lost but Seeking , Oracle of Mul Daya all ways to play more lands per turn
- Cavalier of Flame can be card draw and synergizes with lands in graveyard. As well as being an elemental!
- Scapeshift lots of triggers all at once
- Splendid Reclamation if we are sacrificing lands then this gets them all back. Very good after a scapeshift
- Amulet of Vigor makes some of our ramp a lot more effective, while at the same time providing a good combo with Perilous Forays and Omnath, Locus of Rage Of recommendation if you run a lot of land recursion effects then other lands that sacrifice themselves might be worth it. Like Wasteland Strip Mine etc
I won't re-list the cuts recommeneded in the ramp section. I will be evaluating cuts in the assumption that the deck is wanting to be a combination of an elementals ramp deck and a lands value deck. A lot of these recomendations for cuts will have very similar reasonings, which I will elaborate on first to be able to be brief later on. These recommendations will possibly sound rather brutal, however I find that it makes it a lot easier to have too many cards that are on the cutting block rather than not enough.
- Too Slow. If the card takes too many turns to start pulling its weight then it could be replaced with something that does what we need sooner. This is common in cards which have 'at the beginning of your upkeep' effects as they will normally have to wait an entire turn cycle to start doing something. Enters the battlefield triggers or similar things that have an effect the turn you play them are often preferred.
- Too expensive. This should be self explanatory. If the card costs too much mana, especially if the same effect can be achieved for less mana then it should be exmined.
- Doesn't do enough. While the effect might be interesting and maybe something we actually want in the deck, The card just doesn't pull its weight in whatever role it is supposed to be doing
- Doesn't contribute to our game plan This might be a good card, maybe even a great card in other decks. But perhaps the effect just isn't one we need in this deck
- Cytoplast Root-Kin Too slow. Doesn't contribute to our game plan.
- Dragonmaster Outcast Too slow. Doesn't do enough
- Grazing Gladehart Doesn't do enough. While we like landfall triggers. The life gain is small enough to be negligable unless we are massrecycling all lands from our yard multiple times.
- Magmatic Force Too Slow.
- Magmaw Doens't contribute to our game plan / Doesn't Do enough. We can run other sac outlets if we want ways to sacrifice our elementals
- Scute Mob Possibly too slow. But I love me a scute mob so I'm fine with this staying in :D
- Spawnwrithe Doesn't do enough. However this one can stay in if you have found that you realistically get to connect with it at least twice to have four of them
- Tendershoot Dryad Doesn't contribute to our game plan. Though it is very good at gummin gup the board
- Tyrant of Discord Doesn't do enough. However if you change to having some ways to knock your opponents off of lands then the chances of this hitting multiple nonlands go up and its value does too. However there are enough control players where the onlything this will do is destroy a land at random
- Undergrowth Champion Deosn't do enough. It's got all the right keywords but thats about it
- Retreat to Kazandu Doesn't do enough. THe landfall idea is good, but putting 1 counter an a guy once or so a turn isn't worth the slot really
- Sword of the Animist Too Slow. We want this effect, but we aren't attacking multiple times in one turn so there are better effects to get lands from our deck. We don't neccessarily even have than many small creatures to equip this too to get it active early enough for the ramp to be that useful as ramp
- Animist's Awakening As much as i want this spell to ever be good. It's just not really at all.
- Journey of Discovery Too slow. For this to be actual search out ramp you need to entwine it which is then 6 mana. Any of the 4 mana double basics would be better here. Or just Explore type effects that cantrip too.
Turns out there is only slightly too much Nissa. (And not enough Chandra ;) ) All of the Nissas' contribute to our gameplan well except for Nissa, Voice of Zendikar . The general rule of Planeswalkers in commander is to assume that you will only get two activations if you are lucky. So with this one you will at best buff your team a little. Consider Garruk Wildspeaker instead maybe?
Other random Card Recommendations
- Boundless Realms All the rest of our lands from our deck? Yes please
- Sylvan Awakening We do this, then we overrun and nobody will be expecting it
- Genesis Wave As previously mentioned. It's the better Animist's Awakening
- The Mending of Dominaria More mass land recursion.
Well I hope some of this helped at least a little :)
5 months ago
5 months ago
So my initial thoughts are: You've got WAY too many ways to get extra lands; while each one of these is: "tap: draw a card, gain 1 life" in Tatyova (with something like Simic Growth Chamber ) it doesn't mean that you need nearly that many.
The large number makes this feel like a land-ball style, where you just keep balling lands until you hit a win condition ( Storm Cauldron + Stasis / craterhoof). That's great, but quite cyclical. So my initial suggestions look at the following factors:
1: You'd like this deck to have a lot of replay value and be strong. 2: You don't want this deck to be -too- strong that it gives you a bad rep.
With both of those factors in mind, I'd like to ask: there are many types of Tatyova builds you could go for, what playstyle/archetype suits you and your playgroup best?
For example, Tatyova works with a lot of archetypes.
You've built the 'Land-ball' which is combo-y, but mostly just a fast land-loop 'til you play a win-condition.
Another is control, wherein you use lands and catch-all cards to slow opponents down while you find/grind a win (find/grind meaning - you either find your combo or win con, grind meaning that you go in for the beat-down strat with Tatyova and value creatures).
Traditional lands is another archetype that plays similar to control, using silver-bullet land cards to hinder or stop your opponents, while you find your engine/win condition and end the game from there. Classic win conditions include: Dark depths + thespian stage. Azusa + crucible + strip mine.
Storm is a simple way to play Tatyova - you play a midrange until the turn that you're ready to go off, and at that point you get to really show some explosiveness (this is often dull for opponents if you're not fast/well versed with storming off alone).
Stax is my personal favourite and what I built before moving to storm, as stax-yova allows you to run cards like Mana Vortex alongside Crucible of Worlds and Life from the Loam in order to create a boardstate where your opponents are suffering beneath tax effects and you are creating a gap of disparity that is insurmountable.
There's others I'm sure, but these are the first few to come to mind.
7 months ago
Oh, [], I also had Liege of the Tangle on my maybe list, but essentially dropped it for mana curve.
7 months ago
One of my favorite cards to use in a land deck is Liege of the Tangle . If you want more fetch, Ulvenwald Hydra seems like a good fit for this deck. Also, since the goal is to get a big commander, Selvala, Heart of the Wilds can provide huge ramp. And Titania, Protector of Argoth can help get more benefit from graveyard interaction with your lands. As for defending yourself, Constant Mists works really well with graveyard land decks. Groundskeeper and Overlaid Terrain are also really good, but the latter can be risky if you’re not prepared when casting it.
7 months ago
One thing to note: see how as we add more cards a mana curve naturally starts to form? That happens just about every deck. I try to maintain the curve that forms unless I have a reason to adjust it. So we'll be cutting cards that disrupt the curve. For example, at this moment we would want to cut cards that cost 6 cmc. But we're not done.
Nissa, Vastwood Seer Flip Tunneling Geopede Yavimaya Elder Oran-Rief Hydra Akoum Hellkite Dragonmaster Outcast Greenwarden of Murasa Acidic Slime Terastodon Wood Elves Liege of the Tangle Grazing Gladehart Sporemound Budoka Gardener Zendikar Incarnate Vinelasher Kudzu Sylvan Safekeeper Embodiment of Fury Reclamation Sage Stone-Seeder Hierophant Embodiment of Insight
Liege of the Tangle occurrence in decks from the last year
Commander / EDH:
All decks: 0.0%