|Commander / EDH||Legal|
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|Oath of the Gatewatch (OGW)||Mythic Rare|
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Crush of Tentacles
Surge (You may cast this spell for its surge cost if you or a teammate has cast another spell this turn.)
Return all nonland permanents to their owner's hands. If Crush of Tentacle's surge cost was paid, put an 8/8 blue Octopus creature token onto the battlefield.
Crush of Tentacles Discussion
1 month ago
I have other ways to win without Battle of Wits , these are Guile , Thing in the Ice Flip, Torrential Gearhulk , Crush of Tentacles and Draining Whelk . These can win when played, especially as this is a counter/control deck opponent should have little board presence. this also means that Mystic Snake and Frilled Mystic can be very dangerous also.
While your advice to go the persist route would indeed make a better and more competitive deck, I wanted it to be a counter orientated deck, it is meant to be able to win games which i think it can, while intimidating the opponent with a massive pile of counters!
2 months ago
In playtest, the following cards shows up as black cards.
6 months ago
In EDH, when a player with a blue source and at least mana in other sources open on a field. It is a threat. It is a threat not because of a 7 mana spell, but a 2 mana spell, not a spell that deals damage, counters spell, destroys permanents, tutors, or cheats costs, but a bounce spell.
Cyclonic Rift , C-Rift, the big wave, whatever you call it, people know it as one of the strongest, most backbreaking spells in all of EDH, if not the best card in the format.
I am here to say that is isn't.
Part of my series on why other popular staples aren't good ( Phyrexian Arena , Rampant Growth ), or are simply not good in a specific way ( Rhystic Study ), I am not here to deny the power that a card like Cyclonic Rift has, but simply that it isn't a good enough card to warrant the hate or love that it receives.
Before I go over why it isn't good, I need to go over why at nearly every power level, it is good.
In casual EDH, the 50% or less, the Precons, the jank, lies it's the weakest state.
That is where all removal spells, sweepers, or countermagic is the weakest, especially bounce. If no one has threatening boards, why remove them. You'd rather spend 7 mana on a spell to improve yours most of the time, yet those games go long, the Cyclonic Rift acts as a Fog to save you, Sleep to get in for damage, or real removal if you use it on a player's end step if they have to discard just after.
Almost all cards that show heavy play at higher levels show some play at lower ones, and while the price-tag may limit it for most casual players, it does work.
At the 75% or the middle tiers of EDH, where I think EDH players mostly lie, it where it is the most powerful. IF it destroyed any number of target nonland permanents, it would be weaker, because of three reasons:
75% decks often use permanent-based engines to support their gameplan. Think Beast Whisperer along with a deck full of cheap elves, or Paradox Engine in a deck will a lot of Temple Bell effects and mana rocks.
These decks and their creators often expect opponents to remove threats, so have many threats to remove.
They try to protect against sweepers, the only punishing cards for going so wide, with anti-sweepers, think Heroic Intervention , or Boros Charm , and protect against some single-target removal with effects like Darksteel Plate .
Because of this, and because indestructible and hexproof don't protect against a mass bounce effect, along with Cyclonic Rift being the only mass bounce at instant speed that doesn't affect you at all, and doesn't target, it is truly the best anti-75% sweeper by many standards.
In the competitive setting, while not bad, it is mostly relegated to being a 2 mana Chain of Vapor or a Into the Roil that doesn't draw a card, that can let a combo deck get through stax locks once in a blue moon.
Don't get me wrong, being relegated to a slightly worse Chain of Vapor isn't an insult. Chain of Vapor is possible the best removal in cEDH, as decks like Kess consultation or P-Hulk variants Laboratory Maniac wins, and for 1 blue mana, or two in the case of Cyclonic Rift , you get to bounce their wincon as they draw off an empty deck, so they lose...
That is some powerful stuff.
So why isn't it the best EDH card, an efficient spell in nearly any metagame? 2 options for removal, one that crushes many lists and the other a sleek and useful trick?
Because it isn't hyper-efficient, nor is it unbeatable, nor is it irreplaceable.
To start, many cEDH decks that run it run consistent amounts of countermagic to protect it's possible great effect, and numerous cards could fit the spot. It isn't alone. Blink of an Eye , the second Into the Roil has been used over it in many combo lists that more mana-efficient options and many forget the slot all-together, in favor of a cantrip or other removal spell like Abrade or whatever. It isn't very dominant there, and so is easy to explain why it wouldn't be amazing there.
In casual lists, Cyclonic Rift costs about as much as half of many of the casual decks, or even more than some entire casual decks that I have seen. Bringing money-cards wins there, as would a Consecrated Sphinx that costs less money, and I'd wager would have more powerful an effect. Again, an easy argument, but I believe it works.
The really hard place to argue against Cyclonic Rift on the surface is the middle tiers. The 75% lists. Legitimately, I think it is because in the 75% players don't consistently a highly interactive 'metagame'. They just prefer to be interactive 'ingame'.
This comes down to theory, however, when a deck, for example, an elf list abusing the Llanowar Elves style effects along with untap effects to keep making mana, dumping it into something like Ezuri, Renegade Leader . All of that deck and many others get shut down by Null Rod . While that card may be less powerful than other cards against any random deck, as many players know exactly what decks they face, they can play to those decks.
This means general removal, like Anguished Unmaking may be worse if artifacts and walkers don't see much play, you'd rather Mortify . Or if instant speed doesn't help you much, as a lot of City of Solitude / Dosan the Falling Leaf effects exist in your meta, Vindicate , etc.
This is pretty basic knowledge, however, the point here is that there are many, many replacements for Cyclonic Rift in different metagames, and I want to share the ones, only in mono-blue, that in the 75% are why Cyclonic Rift is overrated.
This isn't to say it isn't the best, but that if many, many replacements cost way less $$$ and are occasionally better, that one card shouldn't be considered the best in every situation.
Aether Gale , sorcery, only hits six things, has to hit your things if you don't have enough targets of only your opponents, targets, etc. Yes, there are reasons this is clearly worse.
Why is it better? Politically, you don't have to hit cards from players you team with. Similarly, if you like the Howling Mine on someone's field, don't bounce it. Someone Banishing Light ed someone else's threat you can't deal with? Don't bounce it.
Also, 18 cents. Compared to ~20 dollars and I think it is a steal for budget lists.
Also, it is 2 mana cheaper, despite not being an occasional Disperse .
Evacuation , the downside is simple, it doesn't hit non-creatures, and bounces your own things.
The upsides are for decks that want their own things bounced. ETB effects like Mulldrifter (You can respond to the sacrifice on evoke if you want!), Archaeomancer (infinite sweepers by returning Evacuation , or just recur another card), Duplicant , Solemn Simulacrum , etc.
It is 5 mana too, still an instant, and is only 2-3 dollars right now.
Other options for this could be AEtherize , Whelming Wave , Inundate , Engulf the Shore , Profaner of the Dead , or Scourge of Fleets if you just want mass creature bounce, each with ups and downs, some that only hit opposing creatures, some that are instants, some with graveyard synergies, etc.
For mass nonland bounce that doesn't target? There are tons of options, plenty with lower mana costs than Cyclonic Rift .
Take Coastal Breach . It does a mass bounce for just 4 mana (with 3 opponents), leaving you enough to rebuild first, and being able to be cast much faster, making up slightly for the sorcery speed.
Or Crush of Tentacles , 6 mana? 5 mana and an 8/8, it needs to be in a deck with enough cheap drops to hit surge to be worth it, but an option.
Devastation Tide is a personal favorite, if you run Aminatou, Brainstorm , a lot of scry, Mystical Tutor , Long-Term Plans , Jace, the Mind Sculptor , or are lucky, it is a 2 mana bounce everything. Really strong, however, sorcery (unless you cast it with Miracle on an opponents turn.
Run really high mana cards? Displacement Wave can be better,
Like a big creature attached? Kederekt Leviathan . It even comboes with flicker effects, or can be repeated for 2 mana with an effect like Animate Dead or 3 mana at instant speed whenever with Necromancy in black/blue.
Only need to target one player for political reasons? River's Rebuke .
A lot of one color in the meta? Wash Out
Artifacts/Enchantments? Reduce to Dreams
Even outside of bounce effects, Ixidron can do work xD
Point is, there are options. Even outside of blue, sweepers that can get around the normal protection is seriously strong. Terminus , Hallowed Burial , along with most mass exile effects in white from Play of the Game to Final Judgement / Descend upon the Sinful to the new Urza's Ruinous Blast , etc. Mercilous Eviction in W/B, the -x/-x effects in black like Toxic Deluge or Black Sun's Zenith , etc. in any color, Perilous Vault exists.
These are half of why I think Cyclonic Rift is overrated. Not because it isn't great at what it does, but that it isn't that much better than the rest.
The other half is simple.
Every color (sorry colorless) has answers to Cyclonic Rift off the top of my head.
Black? Many lists abuse cards like Inquisition of Kozilek or other discard to remove powerful cards from opposing decks.
Green? Ugh... Yeah, I guess some colors don't have answers...
(Gutteral Response if they ever make hybrid legal in mono-colored xD)
That's all. Thoughts?
6 months ago
This past weekend saw my cube’s first seven player draft (eight had homework to finish). Now, some of them are filthy casuals but here are the deck lists drafted with (W-L) stats! No basic lands included, however.
Me – Mardu Angels (3-0)
Akroma, Angel of Wrath
Assemble the Legion
Bruna, the Fading Light
Cavern of Souls
Conqueror's Galleon Flip
Gisela, the Broken Blade
Nahiri, the Harbinger
Smuggler Captain (finds Reanimate )
Sphere of the Suns
Pritch – Golgari Midrange (2-1)
Go for the Throat
Herald of Torment
Heir of the Wilds
Liliana of the Veil
Liliana, the Last Hope
Rite of Belzenlok
Sidisi, Undead Vizier
Thrun, the Last Troll
Urborg, Tomb of Yawgmoth
Westvale Abbey Flip
Yahenni, Undying Partisan
Paul – Grixis Control (1-1)
Creeping Tar Pit
Force of Will
Lich Lord of Unx
Nicol Bolas, the Ravager Flip
Purphoros, God of the Forge
Tezzeret, Artifice Master
Thassa, God of the Sea
Thing in the Ice Flip
Unscythe, Killer of Kings
Abby – Bant Midrange (0-1)
Bow of Nylea
Courser of Kruphix
Crush of Tentacles
Elixir of Immortality
Kiora, the Crashing Wave
Mikaeus, the Lunarch
Sigarda, Host of Herons
Spirit of the Labyrinth
Sword of War and Peace
Matt – Four Color Good Stuff (1-1)
Arch of Orazca
Ayli, Eternal Pilgrim
Birds of Paradise
Brimaz, King of Oreskos
Elesh Norn, Grand Cenobite
Maze of Ith
Odric, Master Tactician
Path to Exile
Price of Fame
Sword of Light and Shadow
Teferi, Hero of Dominaria
Tetzimoc, Primal Death
Through the Breach
Ugin, the Spirit Dragon
Voice of Resurgence
Warden of the First Tree
Zacama, Primal Calamity
Ben – Temur Cascade– (0-1)
Akroma, Angel of Fury
Braid of Fire
City of Brass
Ghalta, Primal Hunger
Heart of Ramos
Kira, Great Glass-Spinner
Pact of Negation
Sai, Master Thopterist
Search for Azcanta Flip
Sword of Fire and Ice
Urabrask the Hidden
Volatile Chimera (I forget what was on it, never came up)
Courrtney – Green Black Delirium (0-1)
Avenger of Zendikar
Empty the Pits
Emrakul, the Promised End
Garruk Relentless Flip
Great Sable Stag
Greenwarden of Murasa
Ink-Eyes, Servant of Oni
Isareth the Awakener
Master of the Wild Hunt
Oracle of Mul Daya
See the Unwritten
Whip of Erebos
8 months ago
hkhssweiss what cards would you suggest I put in to help tune the deck then? I saw the card Blaze and that works just like a fireball for what I need. So from what I see stuff like Banefire , Comet Storm , Devil's Play and Electrodominance for those big final turn pushes. For defense I was thinking a lot of return spells such as AEtherspouts , Devastation Tide , Crush of Tentacles and Aether Gale please tell me what you think and if you have more ideas on how to help I would really like it.
8 months ago
I’ve been tinkering with my Tetsuko list recently - I added Mystical Tutor , Jeskai Elder , Scroll Thief , Consecrated Sphinx , Throne of the God-Pharaoh , and Deepfathom Skulker (cutting Crush of Tentacles , Nimble Obstructionist , Phyrexian Revoker , AEtherspouts , Surrakar Spellblade , and AEtherspouts ). Any other changes you’d suggest, or insight?
Commander / EDH
SCORE: 137 | 60 COMMENTS | 8415 VIEWS | IN 58 FOLDERS
10 months ago
10 months ago
for sure you gonna need Reiterate and Capsize to go with Mizzix. I'd take outShattering Spree and put in Vandalblast Seal of the Guildpact is not great in Mizzix deck, because thanks to him you gonna cast spell for cheap. All 3 enchantments what you run - I'd take them out because from my experience they get removed quite fast. You definitely want to put Brass's Bounty in there, comboing it with Reiterate for infinite mana in form of treasure tokens. Take out Nevinyrral's Disk. Run bit more control spells, type of Evacuation Crush of Tentacles Capsize Cyclonic Rift Curse of the Swine
Crush of Tentacles occurrence in decks from the last year
Commander / EDH:
All decks: 0.01%