Mishra's Relentless Horde

Commander / EDH Pheardemons

SCORE: 18 | 28 COMMENTS | 2283 VIEWS | IN 9 FOLDERS


Gleeock says... #1

Necrotic Hex can do surprising work. Zariel, Archduke of Avernus has been effective for me & matches alot of your goals for this deck. Thieving Amalgam does some work (& it's an ape-snake). Alot of these options are not very mana-value friendly, so that will probably be the challenge for you going forward.

November 12, 2022 9:28 a.m.

Pheardemons says... #2

Gleeock - First off, thanks for the upvote and comment! Secondly, I am already playing Zariel, Archduke of Avernus. I agree completely that she is completely on them. Thieving Amalgam is a thought. It is mana intensive but stealing cards from my opponents while giving me fodder to attack with is solid. Necrotic Hex is a thing. I'll put that aside for when I playtest. Thank you!

November 12, 2022 9:38 a.m.

Gleeock says... #3

Maybe Captive Audience. Calculating Lich for political redundancy. Though, mana value is still an issue. Shiny Impetus is a pretty aggressive ramp, that works as pseudo problem-removal. Curse of Opulence is more of the same.

November 12, 2022 10:44 a.m.

Pheardemons says... #4

Gleeock - I see where Captive Audience could work, but I don't think I'm going to include it in this list. Despite how much I love that card in a different deck I have. I forgot all about Calculating Lich and I think I own one. I'll definitely look into that. Bitterblossom and Kazuul, Tyrant of the Cliffs were both cards I was looking at taking out because Bitterblossom is so slow and Kazuul, Tyrant of the Cliffs relies on my opponents. Most likely they won't attack me until they can pay or get rid of it. I'll keep that in mind as I playtest as well. Shiny Impetusand Curse of Opulence were both considered but I thought they were a bit too slow for the slow. I might do Professional Face-Breaker if I decide to add in some more ramp in that form.

November 12, 2022 10:52 a.m.

Gleeock says... #5

Yeah, Rakdos swing-wide seems like a "labor of love" probably will take some playtesting. They keep making good commanders for swing-wide in the midrange for : Karazikar, the Eye Tyrant, Garna, Bloodfist of Keld, etc... but not alot of low-end setup support to make a token hoard. I enjoy polymorphing tokens in the colors, but again not alot of low end base support for that, I typically do that more in the Jund colors. Tribute to Horobi  Flip is ok, but again, most often opponents will just swing rats into each other to just get rid of them.

November 12, 2022 11:19 a.m.

Gleeock says... #6

Haha, I will stop commenting eventually I think. But I was looking at He Who Shan't Be Named which does a whole bunch of token hoard dictate stuff. Szat's Will has variable results, but I have punched above the pricetag on that card quite a bit.

November 12, 2022 11:36 a.m.

Pheardemons says... #7

Gleeock - It wont hurt my feelings if you keep commenting. As long as you're not one of those shameful Azorious players 0.0

Actually that deck had a couple things I had not thought about. Molten Primordial and Reality Scramble aren't terrible options as far getting and/or using fodder. I think I'm leaning towards Reality Scramble to use a 1/1 token to get some of my big things.

November 12, 2022 12:44 p.m.

Aggroking80 says... #8

Why are u running marsh flats and wooded foothills? You don't need green or white mana so save money and run 2 more basic lands.

December 5, 2022 9:25 p.m.

Pheardemons says... #9

Aggroking80 - Thanks for the comment. They are there for consistency. I run three dual lands that are "fetchable" (Canyon Slough, Blood Crypt, and Smoldering Marsh) so running multiple fetch lands is viable. Also, even if I have all three out, fetching a basic isn't bad. It filters the deck a little bit and ensures I have my colors.

I proxy my decks first and buy later once they're a little tuned (none of my playgroups care). However, I have found that three fetchlands in any two-color deck is viable and helpful. By all means, though, if money is an object anyone can absolutely change them out for basics

December 5, 2022 9:38 p.m.

KBK7101 says... #10

Thoughts on Mogg Infestation as a potential board wipes or board doubler?

December 5, 2022 10:29 p.m.

Pheardemons says... #11

Thanks for the comment KBK7101. I see the potential for Mogg Infestation but I'm not quite sure it's viable. One sided board wipe isn't horrible, but either they have a lot of creatures rhat I couldn't deal with so I'm doubling them up, or they have a few powerful creatures that can be hit with targeted removal instead.

As far as a board doubler, again, I see the potential. But if I truly have that much on board it would be a "win more." Also, I don't want to destroy my non-token stuff unless I have too.

December 5, 2022 10:53 p.m.

KBK7101 says... #12

Fair enough. It's just a weird, old card I found while doing research for my Sengir/Kediss partner deck and I figured I'd bring it up in case you hadn't heard of it before.

Deck looks great, in any case!

December 7, 2022 12:53 p.m.

Pheardemons says... #13

KBK7101 - I didn't know about it, actually, but it is a weird, fun card. I really sat down and thought about it for the reasons I listed because I was thinking of trying to use it with Ogre Battledriver or something. I liked the idea, but I felt like in practice it would fall. I'll definitely try to keep it in mind for other decks. It would be a nice card to make my opponents go "what is that?"

Thanks for the compliment!

December 7, 2022 1:09 p.m.

Pheardemons says... #14

KBK7101 That would work really well in a rakdos control deck with Night of Souls' Betrayal.

December 7, 2022 2:32 p.m.

KBK7101 says... #15

Pheardemons Oh yeah! That's a great one!

December 7, 2022 4:02 p.m.

Crow_Umbra says... #16

I did a quick check through your comment archive and Notable Exclusions to make sure I wasn't listing something already covered in one of those.

I am a bit surprised you don't have Professional Face-Breaker. Kinda like a mono-red Tymna the Weaver if you squint hard enough lol.

Although you are excluding ETB and Aristocrats damage producers, Brazen Cannonade might be of interest. Adds an additional wrinkle for your opponents to decide on blocks, plus gives you some additional card advantage.

This a personal preference of mine I developed when playing Alesha, Who Smiles at Death, but I like Fervor as a Haste anthem a bit more than Anger. Mostly saves a couple extra steps to get the Haste online. Goblin War Drums is also an option if you wanted a generic Menace anthem. There's also Inquisitorial Rosette for menace and creature token creation.

Lastly, Zhentarim Bandit and Captain Lannery Storm are a couple more mana accelerants that work with the aggro elements of your deck.

December 22, 2022 4:56 p.m.

Pheardemons says... #17

Crow-Umbra - First off thank you very much for the comment, as well as looking back through old comments to see if things have already been mentioned. Definitely appreciated when someone is willing to do that.

Second, not sure if you meant that joke to be as funny as it was, but I definitely laughed loud enough where people were looking at me haha. Honestly, I truly believed I had Professional Face-Breaker in the deck. Not sure what kind of dream that was, or maybe I meant to put him in and forgot. I remember setting it aside to try and make the cut. He's not even in the maybeboard. Not sure what happened there.

Brazen Cannonade is a thought. I think I remember considering it but I believe I went with Kardur, Doomscourge instead since it was a body that can attack. "Hoping" that the creature dies isn't the most efficient strategy but not one to completely take out of the running. It is a thought thank you.

Fervor may not completely be out of the running but it isn't a priority. I get your meaning on the less steps than Anger, but also it is one of those cards that I could say "enter combat" and they respond by destroying it. I feel like the extra loops with Anger makes it a little better since it is harder to get rid of (in theory). Question though, in your deck as well as here, isn't Hammer of Purphoros strictly better? It gives the options of making creatures. Thought for both of us.

Goblin War Drums is not a bad thought, but I feel like I might choose War Cadence over it. I've actually been trying to find a place to put War Cadence in the deck as of recently.

Inquisitorial Rosette I didn't know existed; I like it though. That is definitely a thought. Captain Lannery Storm is one I put behind Professional Face-Breaker but you're probably right. They both deserve a spot for the ramp since the deck is a little higher on the CMC cost. Zhentarim Bandit I think is behind both of them so I'm not sure I'll consider that right now.

With these thoughts, what do you suggest I take out for Professional Face-Breaker, War Cadence, Captain Lannery Storm, and Inquisitorial Rosette?

Of note, I have been debating on switching out Kazuul, Tyrant of the Cliffs with Great Unclean One since most people simply won't attack me with Kazuul out, wait until the token doesn't affect their attack, or he'll just bait a kill spell. Grenzo, Havoc Raiser is also on the maybelist. He's there for me to get around infinite life. Taking their cards isn't bad either, but at least there is an option. I haven't playtested this deck enough to gauge whether he's a wasted spot or not.

December 23, 2022 5:07 a.m.

Crow_Umbra says... #18

I'm glad you liked the suggestions, Pheardemons. Lol yeah "Professional Face-Breaker is budget Tymna the Weaver if you squint hard enough" is my dumb joke. They have some similarities in how both reward you for spreading attacks out.

Brazen Cannonade is something I've had on my consideration lsit for my Isshin, Two Heavens as One deck, which is also very token aggro focused. I similarly had Kardur in considration at one point, but opted to leave him out of my list due to lack of blink or reanimation to reuse. Kardur does smack though with the right support. I have a Kardur deck in my meta that "plays for 2nd place", either finishes 2nd or winning because we have a hard time attacking them.

I wouldn't say that Hammer of Purphoros is a strictly better option for this deck. I'm not a fan of how Hammer is vulnerable to both artifact and enchantment removal. I personally don't want to pay 3 mana & trade a land for 1 3/3 creature at a time. For what it's worth, I did have Hammer of Purphoros in the 99 over Fervor for the Shanid, Sleepers' Scourge deck I was brewing, but mostly because it's Legendary.

War Cadence is a cool one. One of my friends suggested it to me a while ago and pointed out its political options to help someone else push attacks through on their turn.

I agree with you on Great Unclean One over Kazuul. I like that Great Unclean One has a beginning of End Step trigger, so you get the benefit immediately, whereas with Kazuul you may not get tokens. I've flip-flopped on Kazuul for my Isshin deck, but omitted it for not being proactive.

As for suggested cuts.... I find myself suggesting cuts less these days, as I think people know their own preferences and metas best. More generally speaking, I usually try to find cuts in:

  • Top heavy or mana intensive cards that don't give great payouts for the activation costs involved.
  • Cards that have you jumping through hoops for a pay-off. I pointed out Anger as one, but I can see why would want to keep it.
  • I usually compare cards at similar CMCs as a swap, or perhaps cards that are 1-2 cmc more expensive to help bring my curve down a bit.
  • Maybe you could cut a planeswalker or two, depending on if any under-perform for you.

I like your thoughtful response! You had me thinking first thing in the morning lol.

December 23, 2022 11:47 a.m.

Pheardemons says... #19

Crow-Umbra - No problem my good sir. Thank you for great suggestions that I'll consider when I can playtest my deck again (which will most likely be after the new year). Solid options I need to find places for. The deck is new, so I haven't had time to truly consider what the deck needs/wants and or doesn't perform. All of that will come with time.

December 24, 2022 2:33 a.m.

GrimlockVIII says... #20

November 18, 2023 3:15 p.m.

Pheardemons says... #21

Solid possibility GrimlockVIII. I'm reowkring the deck as we speak so it is definittely something I'll keep in mind as I'm tweaking the deck.

November 18, 2023 3:24 p.m.

Profet93 says... #22

Snow covered swamps + mountains to more easily trigger field of the dead. Or does it not matter given your high nonbasic count.

Den of the Bugbear - For those that may not know, you can activate the ability multiple times to get multiple goblins. Another card to "dump" a lot of mana into if the need arises. - How does this work exactly? I don't understand.

March 6, 2024 5:56 p.m.

Pheardemons says... #23

Prophet93 - That is a thought. I didn't consider it because of the high non-basic land count, but anything helps.

From Gatherer - "If Den of the Bugbear's last ability is activated multiple times in one turn, it will have multiple instances of the triggered ability that it grants. For example, if you activate it twice and attack, you will create two 1/1 red Goblin creature tokens that are tapped and attacking."

Simply, however many times you activate it (in the same turn before you attack), that's how many goblins you will create when it attacks.

Hope that helps!

March 6, 2024 6:11 p.m.

Profet93 says... #24

This deck is very well put together, it's hard to provide any meaningful suggestions.

I think you should put Dockside extortionist in > Black Market Connections. I know you are testing it but I think the treasure token value from dockside outweighs any benefit from black market connections, especially a 3/2 token. Your avg cmc is 3.77 with about 10 ramp pieces. If you were to increase your ramp, it could help you apply the pressure.

At the risk of being too much lifeloss, Carnival of Souls?

How has Anger been playing for you? You don't have a lot of mountains so I wonder, would a Hammer of Purphoros be potential swap?

March 6, 2024 6:31 p.m.

Pheardemons says... #25

Profet93 Thank you for the suggestions and kind words!

Carnival of Souls I don't think is a good and for here since I make so many tokens. The lifeless is negligible with Mishra's lifegain, but it's one of those I would probably need to won the turn it came down.

I do agree and like Dockside Extortionist, but not for Black Market Connections. I understand the ramp aspect, but all three modes of Black Market Connections works for this deck. I'd rather find another cut for it. I'd probably have to sit down after work and think about it.

Anger is relatively new because of the mountain aspect. Plus the lack of discard. He's good in general, but he really hasn't shown up a lot as of now. I do agree I probably want a couple more haste options. I have liked Roar of Resistance, but i have tried to add another haste option.

I have playtested the deck since I posted it on here. I just haven't updated the description so it looks like I just built it. What're two other potential options you'd think about taking out for Dockside Extortionist and/or a third haste option (right now Hammer)

March 6, 2024 6:48 p.m.

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