Views on infinite combos in EDH
Commander (EDH) forum
Posted on Dec. 11, 2011, 3:09 p.m. by SaberTech
I'm a combo player at heart, and I love infinite combos. For me, an enjoyable game is one where I'm constantly on the edge of my seat, forced to make tough decisions and fight my hardest until I manage to drop that last piece into place that seals my opponent's fate or I lose to my opponent's amazing play. However, even in EDH I generally play 1v1 so group games are a bit of a different beast for me. I'm curious to hear about how other people respond to the use of infinite combos within their EDH groups. Within my regular play group things are rather competitive so things like infinite combos, mass land destruction, and lock down strategies are pretty much the norm. In other groups I've played with things like infinite combos and tutoring are outright banned. Sometimes I've had to lay down a house rule that an infinite combo can't be looped more than three times between the beginnings of the controller's turns. I like to make the games fun for as many people as possible but that frequently requires a lot of juggling depending on who is playing at the table. So I thought that I'd toss the topic of infinite combos out to the Tapped Out community to see how you handle them within your own groups.
The main points that I usually consider regarding infinite combos are these:
Are the other players going to be playing combos as well? I'm part of a gaming club where it's basically my job to introduce players to different Magic formats, so I'm frequently dealing with new players. Usually I just loan out one of my own decks, point out the combos and explain how to play the deck, and let them dive in. All my decks are about the same power level so that usually works. But when a newer player brings their own deck to the table I have to take that into consideration. They may not have the collection or money to really stock their deck with powerful cards, but I still want them to feel at the end that their deck was an active participant in the game. Which leads me to my next point...
Early Game Combo Kills. Shuffling 100 card decks can be annoying, especially when you're having to do it again after someone combo kills everyone on the 5th turn. When you get a bunch of people together you're generally expecting a longer and more interactive game, so combos that end the game early are detrimental to the game experience.
Combos as Equalizers. Infinite combos aren't all responsible for bad games though. In a group there are bound to be decks of different power levels. For the people playing weaker decks, having an infinite combo or two gives them a better chance against the stronger decks. While it's true that running a less powerful deck that can still pull off one turn KOs can make you a pretty big target, I think that is usually balanced by the stronger decks constantly making bigger threats of themselves and diverting other people's attention.
Combos as a Time Saver. Group games can drag on for a very long time, especially if decks are fairly evenly matched. On of the worst things in that sort of game is to get knocked out early and them having to wait for everyone else to finish up so that another group game can start. When I'm trying to give new players to the format a chance to get a feel for it, it's not productive to keep them waiting for a long time if they get knocked out. Infinite combos can end a game that is dragging on really long or is suffering from a player who is stalling things out.
So those are my current thoughts on the topic. I'd love to hear what other people have to say from experiences within their own groups.
So just as another question on the side, what are your views on lock down combos that pretty much guarantee victory for the controller, but take much longer for the game to officially end than an infinite combo would? Do you throw them in the same boat as infinite combos?
December 11, 2011 6:04 p.m.
Epochalyptik says... #4
I see infinite combos as a legitimate inclusion in an EDH deck, but if it's all the deck is designed to do then it's not really fun to play. My mono-black deck, deck:korlash-mbc-the-edh-way can infinite Exsanguinate , but it's not something I go out of my way to do unless the game needs to end (say... 5-hour stalemate game where it was quite possible people would begin decking themselves).
Lockdown combos are probably one of the least fun things to play against. For example, Teferi, Mage of Zhalfir and Knowledge Pool . Basically, everyone is forced to sit there until the combo player can poke each of them to death, and it's not interactive. I feel the same about counterspell-heavy decks.
There used to be a player in my local group who would infinite combo and then pass the turn, basically having all the keys for victory but prolonging the game and negating any attempts to unseat him from his position. That was probably worse than the lockdown combos.
December 11, 2011 6:40 p.m.
1v1 sure the games are going to be fast with or without combos. Isamaru, Hound of Konda , Zur the Enchanter and lots of other generals beat efficiently to death.
But when it comes 5+ games I think it'd best to leave out combos that just end the game. All the 5 color upkeep triggers, bouncing artifacts infinately to kill everyone, endless mana Exsanguinate things that are a huge anticlimax to the hour+ game.
I have Sharuum the Hegemon who has an enourmous amount of combos available but I dont play that since such interactiveness feels boring to even play for me. Also with Geth, Lord of the Vault pretty fast endless mana combo is easy to make, don't play that either. Just got rid of discards from geth because I understand that someone's game pretty much ends after that. But when I go to the local store Im gonna put that back in, though not the combos and endless mana.
I think that combos can be countered once you know what's in a deck, but when playing in a local store the decks change often, if not the combo probably gets someone to hate them with their sideboard. That's why I don't get upset when someone does play a combo deck but I just choose to not play combos. I think this applies to one table circles but when talking about big events where you play to advance then don't ask me. Seems to me in that sort of tournament yeah I'd gladly play the most degenerate combos around to advance. The game wouldn't be as rewarding to the group but who doesn't like winning. So for me as a combo player winning would make up for lack of interacting.
December 11, 2011 7:46 p.m.
@ Epochalyptik
One of the people that I occasionally play against is like that last player you described. I don't mind playing against that sort of person 1v1, because if I get tired of it I just scoop and we start a new game. In a group game though, that type of personality is really frustrating. I like to play aggressively, and I have no issues with taking on control decks. But occasionally the two of us will end up in a 3 person game with a less experienced player and that's when his play style becomes really annoying. I know that I need to put him under pressure before he sets up, but the 3rd player will see me as the threat as I quickly build my board while Mr. Lockdown just sits back and waits. I get sideswiped by the 3rd player, and then my other opponent lays down his lock and sits back to gloat without finishing us off, innocently commenting that "Well, at least it's not an infinite combo. Those are cheap."
It takes all sorts of players and strategies to make Magic the awesome and challenging game that it is, but it terms of "Fun Factor" I have more of an issue with lock down strategies than I do with combos.
December 11, 2011 7:57 p.m.
I have played against decks with infinate combos and they dont usually bother me. Most of the decks that i play against are at least a few hundred dollar decks with crazy combos but what I have learned is that once you learn their combo and are ready for it you can screw them over completely by crippling the combo. They spent multiple turns and a lot of mana only to realize that when i remove an integral part of the combo they are screwed. Luring them into a false sense of victory is the best thing to do because they will be caring more about their precious combo than what you are doing. When it comes to new players in a multiplayer game if anyone is dropping infinites then they need to get over their ego and realize that EDH is a casual format meant to have fun. New players wont come back to play if they think that magic is a douchy "I have more money than you" game. I usually let new people play my deck and then i will play a crappy deck so they can really enjoy the game and see what magic is about.
December 12, 2011 2 a.m.
Ok im going to throw my opinion out there, i absolutely hate infinite combos in EDH, we play in pods of 4, the guys go infinite in turn 4 turn 5.. from infinite milling to infinite turns, to infinite creatures, its Bull, it ruins the game, its no fun ending the game turn 5 and then the winner chooses whos in wat place. say no to infinite combos and play a proper game.
December 12, 2011 2:30 a.m.
I agree that a lock down and an infinite combo is utter crap in a large casual multiplayer EDH game. multiplayer games sometimes do call for a game ender and that is fine but when the same combo happens again and again it gets very rediculous and boring. my decks are very expensive but i don't run douchy plays i wana have fun and not make my mates miserable. if i find a deck is douchy i change it so it is more fun for everyone without making it less competitive. for the record land destruction in EDH is shite too! anything that stops people playing is sucky but destroying one land aint too bad but picking on someone struggling for mana is a dick move stuff like that. my friends and I tend to roll dice on who to attack or just spread out the damage making a game more fun and funny when everyone is on 8 thinking o crap I could die any second to an Earthquake lol
December 12, 2011 5:44 a.m.
ok im guilty of land destruction, but it was a competitive match and i needed the 1 guy out fast Creeping Mold , Noxious Revival ,Creeping Mold ,Reclaim Creeping Mold , ganked him down so i could concentrate on the other threat.. yeah its petty and not fun like infinite combos.
December 12, 2011 6:16 a.m.
i dont mind a single land destruction as when my mate has Cabal Coffers out or i have card:Volrath's Stronghold out because they just simply win games! them and Homeward Path they are just OP so a timely Ghost Quarter , or something along that ilk is good but barring that its like whaaaat lol. I did once cast Obliterate because the game had gone on for 5 hours and we were all top deck getting nowhere fast and I had my Uril, the Miststalker out with a Bear Umbra on him os he survived and I won but that was required lol one person QQ'd but tough it was just blergh at the end lol
December 12, 2011 6:22 a.m.
LMAO! well u had to win it :) they could have countered or something so they stil had a chance.. we have quite a bit of land destructions... and a wrath every like 4 rounds but our games dont last 5 hours haha
December 12, 2011 7:41 a.m.
good luck countering Obliterate :-) I know what you mean though sometimes you just need to reset and start a new game!
December 12, 2011 7:48 a.m.
aebersole10 says... #14
@SaberTech ... from much earlier
While we haven't run into the lockdown combo as often, I tend to agree with Epo's assessment that they do tend to make games less fun for the other players. Therefore, since our premiss with EDH is for everyone to have fun, regardless of the victor, they would fall into the frowned upon category too.
December 12, 2011 2:25 p.m.
StlwllAngl says... #15
I think it depends on the playgroup and overall game feel the group wishes to achieve. I enjoy a game with high-powered, tuned decks that can go infinite within the first few turns. I also enjoy a longer game with a more "traditional" beatdown-based feel. I feel that what is most important is to agree on the type of deck beforehand. It's not much fun to realize after he game starts that one is "the guy with the ringer deck," purposely having to play a deck below its potential in order to keep the game interesting for the other players. Kind of like sucker punching a blind person. If I'm not sure what the other decks will be, I bring pieces to build either type of deck. It's a casual format, after all...
December 19, 2011 11:28 a.m.
i am amazed that people have such hate for clever card interaction. it really comes across as soreloser-ness. what i mean by that is this. the people that complain about having their library removed from the game or having all their permanents destroyed today, had they played in 1993, would prolly have complained that Serra Angel could attack AND block... just because you would use Black Lotus to cast War Mammoth dont expect others to
maybe play better, run flexible cards and adapt so as to insulate yourself from these win conditions. a simple analogy, my opponents keep killing me with creatures, should i a] play creature removal b] label them un-fun and sulk
December 19, 2011 1:06 p.m.
@stryder
Judging by your card examples you don't understand what sort of combos we are talking about here and you probably haven't played Commander.
For example Sharuum the Hegemon can be built to only fetch a combo and execute it, and many other generals. Sure it can be disrupted if you know it's coming. The deck will combo off in early turns or it'll lose. Now what is so horrible about this that makes us cry by ourselves in a corner. It's because a combo deck firing off means a huge anticlimax for the game, it's not about playing a good game of commander, it's about one deck just ending the game on early turn without much actual playing. And that's the point a combo deck plays by itself and doesn't interact.
I use to have Niv-Mizzet, the Firemind going infinite turns. Sure it's fun to win but it was quite boring playing the rest of the game by myself, not to mention someone watching me play for 10 consecutive turns, or how many it would take.
What goes for infinite mana, it's sort of the same thing depends on how you use it. But basicly going infinite mana and ending the game with something like Geth, Lord of the Vault , Exsanguinate or something of the sorts. It's not a gruesome battle to the end but rather one player hitting the mana combo and again just ending.
It's not that I "label them un-fun and sulk" but rather that I want to play commander, not watch someone set their combo and ending the game. It's not so bad if someone combo's out once but playing regularly against decks that end the game, that has been built up by other players only to end in such a boring way.
December 19, 2011 2:42 p.m.
@raumance /facepalm
the card examples i mentioned were to illustrate the power creep that has occured over 18 years of magic.
leyline/helm hivemind/pact teferi/knowledge pool is today what serra angel/stasis was in 1993
people were butt hurt losers then and there are butt hurt losers now, i was trying to be polite.
your comment about wanting to play "a good game" of edh and not watch someone else go off.. that is exactly the same as wanting to use black lotus to cast some junk and then getting mad some else uses it to win instead. how is losing to the combat phase more fun exactly? what you want is not what everyone else wants
for the sake of brevity i'll be blunt. you are a poor player, slow to adapt, doing the same thing yet expecting different results
you are using black lotus to cast war mammoth and its time to change
December 19, 2011 3:09 p.m.
Epochalyptik says... #19
Stay on topic, guys.
While it may be possible to respond to some combos and delay others, the point of it is that it isn't fun when games end on turn 5 because someone pulled a combo to wipe the rest of the table. EDH was meant to provide longer games with more interaction between players; ending a game quickly with some exploitation may be a good demonstration of build skill, but not of the attitude the format was designed to foster. If I wanted to lose quickly, I'd go play Vintage.
It's also not accurate to say that everyone who can't deal with these combos is a sore loser. EDH has become a very popular casual format, and a large number of the players do not have the resources or desire to build top-level decks that dominate games. They play for fun, and I doubt any of them would classify losing to a combo or spending the whole game worrying about losing to a combo as fun.
December 19, 2011 3:21 p.m.
I'm pretty much talking about multiplayer, I think in 1-1 anything there's really no etiquette but winning.
"your comment about wanting to play "a good game" of edh and not watch someone else go off.. that is exactly the same as wanting to use black lotus to cast some junk and then getting mad some else uses it to win instead."
I play because of the experience, though sometimes it's nice to win. This is a different format so I don't think the situation goes hand in hand what some very different format went through more than 15 years ago.
You say that I'm a butthurt and want to just keep combos for myself so that I can win, but that's not the point. I don't want to play combos and I don't, like I said I use to have Niv-Mizzet going infinite, I cut that out after I got feedback from other players. I also don't use mass hand discard, like card:Myojin of Night's Reach or Cabal Conditioning , or cards that end the game out of nowhere like Exsanguinate , or use infinite mana combos for Geth, Lord of the Vault .
When I venture from my edhcircle to the local store sure I put back the nasty discards but not the infinite mana or combos. I dont think a card should be banned because I dislike but because it takes away from the format, degenarate combo pieces like Disciple of the Vault , by making games one man shows. Without comboing off the game quality in my mind is better.
I don't think EDH is meant for longer games, but it is better for the play if the end result is the sum of all the decisions made by multiple people rather than one player tutoring a card or two and just ending the game.
Also I don't consider cost of a card should be the basis on banning but rather what the impact to the game is.
In a format like this I don't think banning is such a negative thing. It levels the playing field for more diversity, taking away the few cards that the strongest decks need. You can still play whatever you want in your own circles, but I think league/organised type of play would be better off without racing for that combo piece.
December 19, 2011 8:37 p.m.
I think that about 35% of my overall wins in EDH are won using an infinite combo. I enjoy combos, and almost all my EDH decks have multiple combos built into them, but I don't consider the combos a central part of the deck. For me, a combo is just something cool that my deck can occasionally pull off.
EDH decks that are built around specific combos aren't something that I enjoy playing because they are too systematic for my tastes, too predictable, and take away from the guessing game that I think is an entertaining part of playing Magic. I have a pile of cards kicking around that is an aspiring Sharuum the Hegemon deck, but I just can't bring myself to finish it. In attempting to build the deck to its max potential it has become so focused on pulling a Sharuum combo that I know that is how most of my wins will end. There's not much motivation for me to play a deck that I know will either lose or win in a fairly specific way. I save those sorts of decks for 60 card constructed, and so my proto Sharuum deck continues to collect dust.
I would probably be more inclined to remove the combos from my decks if time wasn't such an issue with my group. We all have busy schedules and are only able to catch each other for short periods of time on any given day. Infinite combos give us a better chance of actually completing a game before we have to continue on with our day.
I like StlwllAngl's suggestion of just carrying around a bunch of extra cards that can be used to modify decks on the fly if need be, which I'll probably start doing from now on. It would kind of be like a sideboard for adapting to other people's gaming groups instead of for beating an opponent's deck. I'd much rather switch out my infinite combos if I'm playing with people who are really against them, then either having to borrow a deck from someone else or play a game with my combo cards languishing in my hand.
December 20, 2011 1:20 a.m.
ligerman30 says... #22
I think combos are fine so long as you follow these few rules. Don't activate them turn 5 or less and kill everyone, that's not fun. Don't stop people from interacting with you, that's not fun. And most importantly, don't waste our time when comboing off; spending 20 minutes just to fizzle is rude.
November 18, 2013 12:45 a.m.
I understand that you've only been on this site for a month, but DANG, bro, this thread is two years old. Why did you dig this up?
November 18, 2013 1:08 a.m.
If you're playing 1v1 and you deck is build around infinite combos i think it makes for a boring time.
If you're playing in a 'pod' and no one has the ability to stop the combo, then the pod has a lot of poor decks in it. Just my oppinion, but edh is basically legacy and there are tons of cheap good removal spells each person can dedicate 4-5 deck slots too.
November 18, 2013 8:56 a.m.
Infinite combos are fine - a lot of people run them. Especially in high tier EDH games, they're particularly potent.
The rules specifically state that when you combo you need to know the end board state and how many times you need to repeat the combo in order to reach that board state - this avoids time wasting. If someone can't do this then technically they can't infinite combo because it's a waste of everyone's time.
What I have a problem with is people who play the same EDH deck endlessly in a casual format and just combo every game. That is dull. If you want to be competitive with your infinite combo then that's fine but it shouldn't be a priority in a casual game.
A lot of people I know have multiple EDH decks. One super competitive one and more casual ones. The competitive ones are less fun to play against but do amazing things. The casual ones just play normally and it's all good.
November 18, 2013 9:07 a.m.
Oh man. I didn't even realise how old this thread was.
November 18, 2013 9:16 a.m.
Repeatable combos: yes
Infinite combos : no
That way, if I -need- to repeat my combo a bunch of times either to equalize the board state, or to deal with someone else trying to combo out the table I -can-, but since it's not an actual infinite combo that MUST end the game, even if I -can- do it early, I'm not going to have to deal with the temptation to clear the board.
November 18, 2013 9:25 a.m.
A repeatable combo diverges onto an infinite combo at some point. Also there are infinite combos that don't end the game - like infinite mana combos. My point is that a lot of good repeatable combos ARE infinite combos.
November 18, 2013 9:28 a.m.
That was a brain slip. Edit the above - repeatable combos CONVERGE onto infinity.
November 18, 2013 9:29 a.m.
Then we're using the terms in different ways.
My Sharuum the Hegemon deck runs Time Sieve and Myr Battlesphere , they together can generate me an unlimited number of turns with Tawnos's Coffin . This is a repeatable combo. I can take 1 turn, I can take 10 turns, I can take an arbitrary number of consecutive turns if nobody has a way to stop me, but I can stop any time I want.
That deck also -could- but -doesn't- run Vizkopa Guildmage and Exquisite Blood . That combo sets up a loop that can ONLY be stopped by the death of every other player in the game. That's an infinite combo, and I don't run those.
November 18, 2013 9:46 a.m.
I would refer to both as infinite combos. But I see how you're defining them as different things.
November 18, 2013 9:51 a.m.
I think that I honestly don't care what other people are playing any more but if I feel group hate then I waste little time finding another table. And I have a bunch of decks to choose from so if the other players bring it to that level then I have my decks ready to join in (although they don't really rely on infinite combos - but a few of them have the potential for them on a very lucky draw or very long game without boardwipes (i.e. not really))
November 18, 2013 5:02 p.m.
Well, combos are part of the format. It's not how you make the deck, but how you play it. Is it really necessary to tutor that gamewinning combo every game as soon as possible? After all MTG, like all hobbies, is all about having fun and players should keep and eye for the power level of the table and play accordingly. If early game combos are a problem do like my game group does: Comboing player shows the combo, activates it, sees if someone has a answer for it, and scoops before it resolves. That way game has a clear winner but other players can still play and fight for the second and third place.
November 19, 2013 12:02 a.m.
Epochalyptik says... #34
@Nortti: Although that is a "solution," and a rather common one, it doesn't really get to the heart of the issue.
If you have a combo in your deck as a win condition, and you have the means to tutor it relatively consistently, then it will be apparent that you're holding back if you don't. The game will continue, but it may feel forced or artificial after that.
If you play the combo and scoop, you maintain sportsmanship by allowing the other players to continue to fight for second/third, but you also force yourself out of the game early, and the experience lacks the satisfaction it might have if you were playing the combo in a meta better suited to it.
November 19, 2013 12:07 a.m.
Point taken! People should just accept the fact that they are not going to win every game. If you lose to a combo get prepared for it in the next game. You can't think EDH as format like all the other formats where winning is everything. In EDH it's the game that matters. Or at least, that's my opinion.
In established meta, with good players and even better decks, combos aren't much of a problem. You have to run them, or some other controversy tactic like Mass-Ld, just to keep up with other players. In other metas you play against decks made from draft leftovers. Of course you can't play the same way in both metas. But metas twist and change, and tactics from yesterday aren't perhaps good tomorrow.
The problem isn't the decks or the cards. The problem is how players think. So chill out and have fun! How hard could that be?
November 19, 2013 12:43 a.m.
Epochalyptik says... #36
I am and always have been a proponent of the idea that EDH, as a social format, should be played for the playgroup rather than the victory (unless at tournaments or in playgroups that like the cutthroat, victory-oriented game). You need to find a playgroup that shares similar perspectives on the format and wants the same kinds of experiences out of a game of EDH. Don't combo in a casual group, and don't bring a precon to the hardcore table. It's all about building the experience for every player, not just yourself.
Unfortunately, a lot of EDH players still need to realize this. Many times, arguments about whether combos are fun or should be banned stem from a player bringing a combo deck to a casual table and cleaning house. That's not what the format is about.
November 19, 2013 12:47 a.m.
I consider it good etiquette to ask a group's opinion on infinite combos before the game even starts when playing with a group of players that I don't really know. The social aspect of an EDH game and having an opportunity to show off the fun plays that my deck can make are what make playing the game worthwhile to me. I devote a lot of time to deck construction and playtesting, so I completely understand when someone else doesn't like playing under the threat of the game ending before they can make cool plays of their own.
That being said, I personally enjoy the edge that comes with playing a game where there is a lingering threat of someone suddenly going for a game winning combo. It keeps my attention engaged with what is happening at the table and makes me put more thought into how I'm playing. The ultra competitive scene isn't my cup of tea, but being in a group where big, game ending plays are common is something that I enjoy. On average, I'll build my decks with multiple infinite combos but I don't build the deck to focus on the combos as their main win conditions. The wider variety of play options that I can build into the deck, the more I tend to enjoy playing it.
November 19, 2013 2:41 a.m.
Even in casual games i dont see the issue with infinite combos. Infinite life is overwritten by commander damage (21) and poison counters.
The odds in a group game of not one player having 1 mana open to cast Path to Exile , Swords to Plowshares , Dismember , Vapor Snag , Lightning Bolt ...or any other 1 drop interupt leans more towards poor deck building then lack of competitiveness.
November 19, 2013 8:55 a.m.
There are infinite damage combos that can kick in extremely early. There are also combos that can bait out instants such as those you mentioned by passing priority temporarily and then continuing with other pieces. Theres also Grand Abolisher . Infinite combos can sometimes be extremely robust.
November 19, 2013 10:11 a.m.
Hermit Druid can pretty consistently win an EDH game turn 2
November 19, 2013 1:17 p.m.
I agree, there are definitely combo's that can hit hard and early. But to have a 3 card combo in play and something like abolisher so that it cant be interupted should have given someone in the group enough time to realize this and try to interupt it. Especially if its in a pod of friends who now each others deck.
It would be like playing a friend with a birthing pod deck and seeing them play melira or viscera seer and not realizing they are about to chord of calling to combo win on turn 3 when you tap out. So you dont and cast something to interupt it.
November 19, 2013 1:19 p.m.
You're right. And by having the counters and learning the combos you elevate to a higher state of play than you would be at if you just arbitrarily banned infinite combos.
Reminds me of this - http://www.sirlin.net/articles/playing-to-win-part-1.html
November 19, 2013 2:45 p.m.
FalkensteinAZ says... #43
I've been thinking about how to regulate MTG games for max fun since I started playing, and in the end it's always more about the pilot than the deck. I don't care if my opponents play infinite combos, or lockdown, or whatever. Maybe Black Lotus into War Mammoth is dumb, but if it starts a War Mammoth beatdown the turn after Cataclysm , that's funny as hell. We can all be quick to blame the deck, but it's just paper after all. When you walk into a tournament, expect a room full of stryders. When you're playing EDH for kicks, surround yourself with great people and you'll have a blast, whatever decks are on the table.
November 22, 2013 6:27 p.m.
lord_of_the_snakes says... #44
my view, there's too many cards available in edh to think about infinite combos, we should showcase cards that can't be used well in any other format
November 23, 2013 7:13 a.m.
Didgeridooda says... #45
I definitely see the difference in multi player EDH and 1v1. My friends play things like infect pump when tutoring for Hatred
, or land kill, or any combo. I just try to make it so my deck can deal with those.
November 23, 2013 12:23 p.m.
HorrorAvengers says... #46
In my playgroup, Infinite combos get intense because most of us play blue. So every turn, at least one person is threatening to go infinite, and we all look around the table to see who will stop it. It becomes a hugely intense thing when all it takes is one card not being in somebody's hand for the game to end, and it's nonstop like this for a hour and a half.
Also worth noting, we usually stop being frinds for a few days after every game like that XD Last week we had a game last 3-ish hours, and only ended because the niv player kept returning curiosity to his hand. It was great. My zegana deck started to go off 3 times before getting stopped :(
May 19, 2014 12:03 a.m.
HorrorAvengers: You just dug up a thread that is six months old, that had already been dug up when it was two years old. Please don't do that again.
For the love of all that is good and holy, you had to dig twenty pages deep in the archives to find this thread. Why would you dig this up?
May 19, 2014 12:19 a.m.
There's a search function so this kind of necrobumping does happen. More common with specific questions though, rather than general discussions.
May 19, 2014 10:25 a.m.
WanderingSpirit says... #49
I'm inclined to like infinite combos. The EDH/Commander format was built with big, crazy plays and cards that would be impractical in smaller games in mind. While such combos have their ups and downs, their existance adds to the format overall, and in turn, the gameplay.
Here's the thing. If the game is just getting fun or you have newer players in your group, you have the choice not to make use of the combos. If you really don't want combos like that in the deck for the people you are playing with, I'd do as some suggested and replace a key component or 2.
May 19, 2014 4:09 p.m.
HorrorAvengers says... #50
My bad, the sites I'm more used to tend to lock threads after about a month of inactivity so I'm not used to watching the dates.
aebersole10 says... #2
This is something that my own play group has discussed extensively, and we've come to a conclusion based on what we want out of the format.
EDH covers a wide range of appeals, both competitive and casual, but for us, we tend to play more casually. For us, a big multiplayer EDH game is a social event, and a time hang out and have fun. The games we love the most, and talk about for the longest, are the ones that last for 4 hours and have tons of brilliant moves, each undoing the last one made by an opponent. To that end, we build our decks intentionally omitting infinite combos that would end the game. Powerful combos are good, but nothing that for all intents and purposes just ends the game. At the end of the game, everyone can say they had lots of fun, and sometimes people have a better time than whoever happened to come out on top and win the game by the end. Personally, I have had some games where I just went all in and attacked to knock a powerful player off the table, knowing full well I would get wiped out the next turn. It's fun.
So there's a viewpoint from the more casual side of EDH play.
December 11, 2011 5:43 p.m.