You posted on my Graveyard deck a while ago, and was wondering what type of decks would Polukranos,unchained be best against and the weakest against?
March 1, 2020 6:43 p.m.
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IzmAYAYA: I might ask in the rules section of the site, they should be able to explain it better than I can.
But in your example:
Yawgmoth, Hapatra, 2 tokens on the board. My opponent has a 5/5 (for example).
I pay 1 life and sacrifice a token to Yawgmoth's ability, targeting their 5/5.
In response to Yawgmoth's ability on the stack, they cast Swords to Plowshares on Yawgmoth (or Hapatra, it would work the same either way). Stack is (top to bottom) Swords, then Yawgmoth activation #1.
In response to their Swords, I pay 1 life and sacrifice the other token, targeting their 5/5 with my Yawgmoth. Stack is (top to bottom) Yawgmoth activation #2, Swords, Yawgmoth activation #1.
Presumably, they don't have any further removal. The top Yawgmoth activation (#2) resolves. A -1 counter is placed on their 5/5 and I draw a card. Stack is Swords, Yawgmoth activation #1.
A -1 counter was placed, so Hapatra triggers to make a snake. Stack is Hapatra trigger #1, Swords, Yawgmoth activation #1.
Hapatra's ability resolves. I now have one snake (in addition to Yawgmoth and Hapatra). Stack is Swords, Yawgmoth activation #1.
I hold priority, then pay 1 life and sacrifice the new snake token to activate Yawgmoth, targeting their creature (now a 4/4). Stack is now Yawgmoth activation #3, Swords, Yawgmoth activationn #1.
You never let their Swords resolve until you're done with your combo, because you're creating and sacrificing snakes with the Swords on the stack.
Note that, when Yawgmoth activation #1 finally tries to resolve, it will be countered because the 5/5 will (presumably) be dead and the ability will thus have no legal targets. You will not draw a card from Yawgmoth activation #1.
March 29, 2020 6:31 p.m.
soufianhriz: Mmmm. Yes and no. Is Hapatra good enough for that? Yes. Is this deck a decent starting point for trying to build a cEDH version of Hapatra? Yes, this deck does well.
Is this deck quite ready for that table? Not quite, unless you get a very good hand -- and even then, I'd modify the deck to have a lot more stax pieces (taxing spells with Trinisphere and Sphere of Resistance, shutting down mana counters/removal, graveyard hate, etc).
Basically, I'd slim down the deck a little more, to fit in a lot more stax (since we can't play counters).
But I've played this against Food Chain lists to great success (because we snipe their mana dorks), and I suspect that we'd keep Najeela decently under control too, especially if we run Blowfly Infestation. Doomsday is trickier, since we really have no good ways to prevent Zur's tutoring in our colors (apart from "shoot him on sight"). I've never been super impressed by Curious Control, honestly, when I've played against it, so I'd rank that as the lowest of those threats (without knowing about your meta).
Definitely add Torpor Orb too. It's great against the current cEDH meta.
Check out this page for more information on cEDH Hapatra:
Commander / EDH
SCORE: 43 | 5 COMMENTS | 14568 VIEWS | IN 25 FOLDERS
March 28, 2020 4:08 p.m. Edited.
IzmAYAYA: Nah, what I was saying applies no matter which creature they target with removal. If they target removal at Yawgmoth, in response to their removal you can start the combo back up with a second snake.
And you can execute the whole combo, as many times as you want, at instant-speed before the removal resolves on Yawgmoth. The only difficulty is that you won't be able to cast anything sorcery-speed. But you can dig to find Chord of Calling or Heroic Intervention or Veil of Summer to either 1) prevent their removal, or 2) win the game on the spot, before their removal resolves.
March 27, 2020 6:39 p.m.
IzmAYAYA: Well, when you have Yawgmoth and Hapatra, you only get a new snake once the ability resolves. There's a window of time where the snake has been sacrificed, you've paid the life, but no -1 counter has been placed and no snake has been created. If they use a removal spell in that window, you won't have another snake to sacrifice to continue looping... unless you started with at least 2 snakes -- is that a clear explanation?
March 27, 2020 12:20 p.m.
IzmAYAYA: In order --
1A and B) No, unfortunately you can only put 5 counters on a 5/5 -- once it's dead you can't keep piling -1 counters on it. This kind of thing is actually why, to go properly 'infinite', you need something that gives your own creatures additional toughness (so you always have something to put the -1 counters onto).
There is a very minor exception to this, when using an effect like Grim Affliction: the proliferate on that spell can pull a creature's toughness below zero, because the "dies from zero toughness" state based action isn't checked until the spell finishes resolving. But before you ask, no, Yawgmoth's proliferate doesn't work the same way.
1C and D) Basically, what you want to do is execute the loop by having TWO tokens on the battlefield. You start the loop by sacrificing one token, they cast removal, and with their removal still on the stack you start another iteration of the combo using the second token. This works no matter which creature they target.
2A) For the same reason as 1A, you can't target anything an infinite number of times with Yawgmoth unfortunately. You only get to place as many -1 counters as there are points of toughness. This is why things like Ivy Lane Denizen are good (your creatures always "gain" a toughness to offset the one they lost), or effects like Spidersilk Armor (you can "bounce" the counters between two snakes, and never run out of things to target).
3) While you can't execute Yawgmoth infinite times targeting the same thing, you CAN use him to screw with combat math pretty well -- you can sacrifice some of the blocked creatures to shrink blocking creatures, and make them vulnerable to lethal damage. Still, this isn't usually relevant, since Yawgmoth immediately wins the game maybe 90% of the time he hits battlefield in this deck.
March 27, 2020 2:32 a.m.
DarthParkarius: Glad you like the deck! In answer to your questions...
1) Necroskitter was always a little... winmore here. It's cute, and is very helpful in a meta with a lot of mana dorks, but in general it kinda just sits there. It's a nice thing to slot in, if you have an extra slot, but... Not necessary to the deck's function.
2) Spidersilk Armor is in here for two reasons. First, this deck has always had issues with flying attackers. We spend our life somewhat aggressively, with cards like Necropotence, but almost nothing in the deck has flying. We have little trouble with attackers on the ground, since we get a lot of expendable deathtouching blockers, but Spidersilk helps patch that issue. Second, with Spidersilk out, we can loop with Yawgmoth, since each snake can survive a counter and still be sacrificed to Yawgmoth.
March 26, 2020 9:09 p.m.
Squirrel_of_War: Honestly? Blowfly just... didn't work right for me.
I ran it for a long time, but it was always awkward -- hard to tutor (since most of my tutors search for creatures), doesn't do anything without a way to profit (Nest of Scarabs, Zulaport Cutthroat, etc), and requires having two 1-toughness creatures when it starts (so it can't be done off an empty board state).
Moreover, several times it ended up killing my entire board state if my opponent used removal at the right time. Notably, at GPLA, it lost me an important game when I had fifteen 1/1s and Hapatra: an opponent removed Hapatra in response to the trigger, and killed my entire board (because there were no creatures with 2+ toughness on battlefield).
It was just an awkward inclusion, and once I cut it, the deck ran MUCH more smoothly. I never looked back, honestly. I've got better combos, with Yawgmoth and Devoted Druid.
And I'll consider dropping the land, yeah. Thanks!
March 26, 2020 4:04 p.m.
moldycrow83: I prefer Soul Snuffers to Harbinger because it's both more immediate and more controllable. I used to run Harbinger, but there were far too many times where it actually harmed me more than it helped me. In a slower meta, I think Carnifex Demon actually fulfills that role best, as you said (I've considered putting him back in, actually).
If you're concerned about losing all of your creatures to a Carnifex activation, the best solution (apart from Ivy Lane, who's awesome) might be effects like Gaea's Anthem that give you a static toughness boost -- these also combo nicely with Yawgmoth, making them good additions to the deck in multiple ways. I'm currently running two of these (Spidersilk Armor and Eldrazi Monument), and Leyline of Vitality would be my go-to for a third.
(Note that even if you have Ivy Lane Denizen, any creature with 1 toughness will die before you can put +1 counters on it to save it.)
Hope this helps! Glad you appreciate my deck :D
March 26, 2020 1:07 p.m.
Hello, would you mind giving a comment or upvote to my Kroxa list, as per the "Advertise your deck" rules? Thanks :)
Commander / EDH
SCORE: 105 | 60 COMMENTS | 7629 VIEWS | IN 27 FOLDERS
March 23, 2020 1:50 p.m.
Profet93: Can't afford it and can't abuse it sufficiently. I'll pass on this one.
Poly_raptor: Hey, thanks for the upvote anyway! XD and I appreciate your thoughts on the descriptions, I'm still expanding this one... Regarding cards like Liliana's Caress, I avoided those here because 1) they're kind of overplayed, and 2) if I don't draw them early, they're rather dead cards (since I have no interest in refilling opponents' hands). This is a deck that thrives on my opponents never getting cards back in hand if I can avoid it.
March 21, 2020 12:55 p.m.
Hope my comment helps!
Anyone feel like giving me a few more upvotes on my current pet project?
Commander / EDH
SCORE: 104 | 58 COMMENTS | 7495 VIEWS | IN 28 FOLDERS
March 21, 2020 1:43 a.m.
Hmmm. Have you considered Pox, Smallpox, Decree of Annihilation, or Wound Reflection? I think these might be good options to piss off your playgroup ;) Oh, and Ruination and Stoneshaker Shaman of course, if you wanna attack landbases a little more. Toxic Deluge is an amazing board wipe that no RB deck should go without. Finally, Torbran, Thane of Red Fell might be decent to multiply your damage more quickly.
March 21, 2020 12:49 a.m.
IzmAYAYA: I think it probably will :) you're running a LOT of things that make -1 counters, and more things that create tokens of their own. If it doesn't, that's something to tweak in the second draft ;) but adding more stompy creatures without synergy definitely won't fix that issue.
March 20, 2020 10:52 p.m.
IzmAYAYA: My response -- If you rely on big creatures to win the game, you haven't sufficiently optimized your deck yet. Big creatures are inefficient -- even a 10/10 needs evasion or trample before it's a threat, and gives players four turns each to answer it. If anything, your deck should be MORE resilient to opponents' big things, since you have a bunch of replaceable deathtouchers.
If you're dedicated to combat victories, I'd much rather win with a big group of small creatures, since it has less vulnerability to removal, blocking, etc (and it's easier to pump with things like Overwhelming Stampede, Overrun, Craterhoof Behemoth, etc).
March 20, 2020 9:29 p.m.
OptimalGreen: Yeah, but I was never really able to leverage it properly (I don't run enough reanimation to really break it, and I have few enough creatures here that I often drew it without fuel to discard)...
March 20, 2020 8:51 p.m.
WUBRG97: Hmmm. If I were trying to tone down the power level, I'd add a few of my older favorite cards back in: Parallel Lives, Garruk Relentless Flip, Archfiend of Ifnir, Survival of the Fittest... But I'm probably not going to make an explicit separate list with these changes. I will say that I've never been a fan of Blowfly Infestation here; it causes Problems and is often a dead card. I have easier-to-tutor-for combos :)
March 20, 2020 7:30 p.m.
I think it's MUCH closer! I'm a fan :)
Just be cautious, because your global -1 placement effects will wipe out a lot of your mana dorks. It's a tricky balance -- which is why I only run BSZ and Soul Snuffers at the moment in that role.
March 20, 2020 7:23 p.m.
IzmAYAYA: The best advice I can give is that high-power creatures are not very powerful: life totals matter a lot less than in EDH. For example -- Nessian Boar is an actively awful card in EDH, because your opponent will almost always be happy to get a bunch of cards, especially since they can plan around it (because it doesn't have haste). And even if it goes through -- who cares about 10 damage? It's only 1/4 of a single opponent's life total (or, put another way, 1/12 of the total damage you'll need to do over the game). So cards like Knight of the Ebon Legion, Nessian Boar, Questing Beast, Lovestruck Beast, etc aren't very good in 40-life multiplayer, because the type of pressure you have to apply is different.
Sisters of Stone Death CAN be fine, but she's very VERY mana intensive. I'd only run her if you run a lot more ramp.
I'd also tentatively recommend against Skinrender, because it only gets you a single snake. Still, depending on your meta, it can be pretty sweet.
Both of your PWs seem... so-so, and too high-cmc; if you want to run a planeswalker I'd recommend Vraska, Golgari Queen. She did good work for me once upon a time, since you can protect her well, she draws cards by sacrificing excess tokens, and her third ability is absolutely brutal.
I didn't love Uncage the Menagerie when I ran it (remember that all the creatures have to have cost exactly X, no more and no less). But it might work better for you, keep me updated on it.
I'd highly recommend Eldrazi Monument if you can afford it.
Finally, I'd generally recommend lowering your curve. My deck barely gets away with 34 lands and 13 other mana sources, and I have a much lower curve than you. I would suggest starting with 35 lands and at least 5 mana rocks/dorks, and work from there. I'd aim for an average CMC around 3 -- anything over 5 mana should threaten to win the game IMMEDIATELY, within a turn cycle or two.
Hope this helps! (Oh, and you can mark a deck's format as "Commander", and put the commander in the correct place by typing [asterisk]CMDR[asterisk] on either side of her.)
March 18, 2020 5:58 p.m.
Jfreyes: She's a lot of fun! Glad to hear you're a fan of this list, let me know if you have any questions ;)
March 18, 2020 3:33 a.m.
Well, with 38 lands, into the wild will 'hit' approximately 40% of the time (less if you've tutored aggressively). I'm not fully convinced that's worth it, as a 4-drop that doesn't do much until T5 at the earliest.
March 14, 2020 10:10 p.m.
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