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Counter target spell with converted mana cost 2.
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Spell Snare Discussion
2 days ago
Thanks for the input Squirrelbacon! The Serum Visions are actually just an experiment - I've been running Opt in their place pretty much since the moment Opt became modern legal. Giving the visions another shot since they let you keep more aggressive hands with the better dig. After playing it this last Friday I do think I'm going to switch back to Opt, but I'm going to give it one more week to see if it can really wow me. Glad to see I have someone else on my side though, seems like everyone thinks visions is better in every situation.
I do plan on going up to at least one Spell Snare when GoR comes out, largely because Assassin's Trophy terrifies me.
As for the Geist, I have to disagree with you there. Against combo and other control, slamming him turn 3 puts you in an incredible lead. Against more aggressive and even midrange decks you can keep the board clear to play him on turn 6 or 7 when you can continue to keep their side of the board clear. He also shines against Tron, which is normally an almost impossible matchup for us. I respect and appreciate your thoughts on him but I think I'm going to keep him in :)
2 days ago
At my LGS, I've played decks like this for quite some time. Between , Moon, and Jeskai control/tempo, I feel pretty strongly that Serum Visions is not right for these decks anymore. Sitting on turn one (especially on the draw) trying to set up you next turn or 2 is just miserable. In its place, I'd look into Opt or maybe 1-2 Ancestral Vision. Also, I'd recommend at least 1 Spell Snare to help with the whole "I'm doing nothing on turn one" conundrum.
He is one of my favorite cards but I would also recommend you move Geist of Saint Traft to the sideboard (and get the right artwork!) as in the main he feels terrible with 3 maindeck boardwipes---if you want control that is. If you want to play more of a tempo game, he should stay in but then the list should change a bit more than that.
Best of luck!
1 week ago
As someone who has extensive play with both control and delver strategies in modern and legacy, your deck confuses me. That doesn't mean it is bad, but there are a few things I want to ask you about with this list...
The first question, and one that stems others, is which style of deck would you like to play... control or delver? While they do over lap a small bit, they do have some major differences. A delver deck is classified as a tempo deck, low land count + high spell count. This enables Delver of Secrets Flip to reliably flip over to put down the damage. You are close on the spell count for the deck, however, I'd recommend at least 25 spells for delver. This include running around 8 cantrips, since you need the hand to be fueled and ready to go along with card selection/filtering. The low land count is next on the agenda, since you're not there. 24 lands is excessive in a delver deck, if you run extra cantrips take some out. You want to trim to about 20 so you can keep the spells high one purpose, protect Delver Flip!!
Control decks are trying to get to the late game, which is more what this deck feels like than a delver deck. Control needs those 23+ lands in the deck for proper functionality. The permission suit is similar to a control deck, but just remember that Spell Snare is a card, and in a 3 color deck I would not recommend 4 Cryptic Command. It's extremely stressful to play with Cryptic Command, not to mention painful with your manabase. I also feel that there is too much delve in this deck for a control deck. Without running Thought Scour (which if you stick with control you won't want) having 5 delving cards (expensive ones at that) does not sound optimal. The Logic Knot is great, the Gurmag Anglers are great, I don't know about the Tasigurs with them both... Just a thought.
I'd love to help you and figure out how we can concentrate this deck a little further, so more or less, do we want tempo or hard control?
2 weeks ago
Hey, thanks for your commendation and the suggestions. I also thought about Spell Snare and will add 2 for some testing. Your completely right with the lands. Shivan Reef was nice in my ultra-budget-build but it hurts to much... Thanks to the reprint of Steam Vents in GoR the prices will surely fall a little bit. I already thought about Blood Moon for the mainboard, but I wanted to build something different to blue moon, but it's a good sideboard-option.
I also need a plan for playing against extrem fast aggro-decks. I'm playing against 8whack from time to time and it's really hard...
2 weeks ago
Maybe consider the addition of Spell Snare, and also, though a lot less situational Stubborn Denial. Other cards you could save up for is more land fixing cards, getting rid or decreasing your amount of Shivan Reef and adding another Spirebluff Canal, Sulfur Falls, and another Wandering Fumarole, or just add a pair of steam vents. Another addition, you may want to add is Blood Moon to the sideboard, it allows you to slow decks like tron and KCI. Otherwise, this deck is set up pretty well. +1 from me my friend.
2 weeks ago
2 weeks ago
ArchonBlue Thanks for the suggestions. My local meta is super creature heavy, hence the maindeck inclusion of Essence Scatter. I'll try out Spell Snare though, since there's so many valuable 2 drops in modern that it can deal with. Cheers!
2 weeks ago
My current idea is that Grixis has a lot of powerful cards available - Search for Azcanta Flip, Young Pyromancer, Snapcaster Mage, Serum Visions, Kolaghan's Command, Tasigur, the Golden Fang - it's these power cards that I want to capitalize on. Delver of Secrets Flip has won me plenty of games, but it's done nothing in plenty too. Mana Leak and Spell Snare are very polarized for when they're good - but so is Search for Azcanta Flip, to some extent. Cryptic Command is a very good card, but it's not what I want to play. 4-drops get punished too much in my opinion. Especially if I want to go under the opposing Cryptic decks, which also have Teferi. Inquisition of Kozilek and Thoughtseize are pretty good right now. Especially going turn 1 Inquisition into turn 2 Pyromancer. Mardu Pyromancer appreciates the power of such a line of play, but they can't follow it up with multiple cantrips on turn 3.
Right now I play Delver of Secrets Flip because the shell that supports it is really good. But I can't play a true Delver deck without another playable turn 1 creature. Legacy RUG and Grixis delver decks function because they can (or could) play Nimble Mongoose or Deathrite Shaman alongside Delver, which made the turn 1 tempo creature plan a lot more viable. Modern Big Zoo, D&T in Modern and Legacy, and Legacy Delver decks all know that you need a minimum of 8 or 9 turn 1 plays to reliably have one to curve out with and support an aggressive game plan. 9 is optimal which is why Zoo decks used to play 1 Birds of Paradise alongside their 4 Noble Hierarch and 4 Wild Nacatl. D&T in modern frequently plays 1 Weathered Wayfarer as the 9th turn 1 play. But when the other 1-drop options aren't viable enough, only 8 1-drops is fine, as seen in Legacy's D&T and Delver decks. But in modern I still haven't found a playable turn 1 aggressive card to pair with Delver of Secrets. Serum Visions and Thoughtseize don't count - the card needs to advance my board state.
I compensate for my lack of another creature by playing control with 4 hamfisted Delvers and a few things to support them, but when the deck needs aggression against Tron it doesn't find it enough, and when this deck without delvers could be blanking removal spells in the Mardu Pyromancer opponent's hand, I simply cast my Delvers into certain doom when I have the mana to spare.
There are some times, like vs Affinity or a Primeval Titan deck, that Delver of Secrets is really good even when cast after turn 1. Unfortunately there are relatively few decks where this is consistently the case.
I want to make a good Delver of Secrets deck, but after a summer of playing the card I'm unconvinced that I'm doing it correctly. Especially because of how good the card is in Legacy. Part of the difference is that I can cast Delver turn 1 in Legacy and most of the time I'll be able to attack with it at least a few times before it dies, if the opponent is playing removal spells at all. And if it does die, well, at least I can stay in the game with Stoneforge Mystic and because I have quality counters, I'm not getting locked out of the game by overwhelming board state disadvantage. But this is modern, not legacy.
Even though I now have Search for Azcanta Flip, I'm not convinced I want to play Delver of Secrets Flip alongside them. In this meta Young Pyromancer is an insane card. He dies hard to things like Terminus, which I have seen a lot of copies of recently. But if I need a few turns to get my grind engine on, then Pyromancer can do it. He can make chump blockers for that Gurmag Angler crashing in on me.
I think there are several powerful lines of play that opponents have that Grixis needs to be able to handle. I've seen Bloodbraid Elf cascade into Anger of the Gods in Ponza a few times - this is scary because discard spells aren't reliable to beat it. And control decks have Terminus, and discard spells can't stop it if it's Miracled. Counterspells are the only way to tempo out of such scenarios. The other option is to go over with bigger finishers, but this won't work against opposing Control decks.
My point is that both counterspells and discard spells have their merits and I feel naked when I play one but not the other. I want to find a way to play lands and cantrips and creatures and counterspells and discard spells and kill spells all in the same grixis deck. And I want more than just 2 Inquisition or 2 Thoughtseize - I want Rise // Fall. The card is insane. When it starts winning me games like crazy I'll come back and say I told you so.
Identifying the counterspells worth playing is no easy task. I really want original and powerful Counterspell. Nothing else feels adequate. Mana Leak can't counter Path to Exile when it matters the most. Dispel can't counter Anger of the Gods or Scapeshift. Spell Pierce is bad after turn 3. Logic Knot competes with Tasigur and Snapcaster for the graveyard. I think Mana Leak is still the best for what I'm trying to do, but it feels a little bad that I can't play Young Pyromancer with protection up. Playing Pyro with a Thought Scour or immediate Serum Visions is good enough for the silver medal.
Such a deck definitely needs 20-22 lands. No more, no less. I want enough discard spells that I can reliably play turn 1 discard into turn 2 pyro. At least 6 1-drops, and I probably won't have room for more. And 1 or 2 Rise // Fall to round it out. I want enough countermagic that the opponent has to respect it, but just 4 Mana Leak is probably enough for the mainboard. For creatures, 4 Snapcaster Mage is obvious. I think I want 4 Young Pyromancer until I get any indication that I shouldn't. Tasigur and Gurmag Angler have won so many games for me. I don't think I can play with less than 4 in combination of the 2. The obvious 8 cantrips. Finally, 2 Search for Azcanta Flip. The removal package will have to be treated separately and will depend on space, but Terminate is a card I have missed since I started playing less than 4 copies. I'm going back up to 4 Terminate and 0 Fatal Push.
The biggest challenge will be fitting all of the cards into the deck. There are a lot of things it is trying to do. I think I listed a 70 card deck. But I think such a deck has potential. Thoughts?