|Commander / EDH||Legal|
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|Commander 2016 (C16)||Rare|
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Each player discards his or her hand, then draws cards equal to the greatest number of cards a player discarded in this way.
Cipher (Then you may exile this spell card encoded on a creature you control. Whenever that creature deals combat damage to a player, its controller may cast a copy of the encoded card without paying its mana cost.)
Whispering Madness Discussion
2 days ago
Here are my thoughts, in no particular order
Your land base is just 1 card away from running Tainted Pact for use with Labman lines. You should ditch that 2x island and run it. Also run the new Jace as a back up.
Omniscience + Show and Tell should be cut. Replace with Dramatic Reversal + Isochron Scepter . Its a more compact win, doesn't have the opportunity to blow up in your face, combos with Top and Copy Artifact, and both pieces have higher quality than the pieces they are replacing.
You run a lot of large CMC junk cards that will either end as dead draws or don't win upon resolving. Consecrated Sphinx should be put into play with reanimation, but since you don't run you should cut. Bolas's Citadel is just a bad Ad Nauseum. The handful of wheel cards over 3 CMC should be cut. Why spend that time giving your opponents cards on a soft combo when you could be tutoring and winning with the very easy A + B of Labman + pact? Specifically, Time Spiral Wheel and Deal Reforge the Soul Whispering Madness . Replace those cards with more format staple counterspells and removal. Swan Song Dispel Flusterstorm Red Elemental Blast Abrade Shattering Spree .
Really not wild about Molten Psyche or Winds of Change either. You are losing card advantage on both (-1 to be precise). Notion Thief and Waste Not are both strong when used with a wheel, but it isn't worth devoting that many deck slots to combos that don't explicitly win. You would be better off running tutors instead, which will help you get whichever A or B part of the Notion Wheel combo you don't have in your hand.
You really don't need to run Mission Briefing if you are running Snapcaster AND yawgill AND past in flames.
You should highly consider Chain of Vapor as well as Hurkyl's Recall . Both allow you to gain mana and storm when combined with the mana positive rocks, which feeds into your Aetherflux Reservoir line. They also double as removal and can combo break opponents who are trying to win.
You should include Mana Vault , its much better than Basalt Monolith . Thought Vessel should also be cut, even Prismatic Lens is better. The no maximum hand size will literally never be relevant, because if you are drawing that many cards you should be able to win instead of passing the turn. If you do have to discard down to 7, just keep the 7 that allow you to win and protect the win. You should also run Chrome Mox because of the high card advantage you generate.
28 lands means you're in danger of getting staxed out, very easily. Any artifact hate with early taxes means you're caught and discarding cards for multiple turns. The land base you're running could also use a tune up. You should include the painlands Underground River etc. as they enter untapped and provide color diversity without extra requirements. The two-or-more-opponents lands I'm not a fan of, but playing in a pod means they'll be live. The two-or-fewer-lands lands I'm not a fan of, and firmly believe you should cut. Checklands are fine, but replaceable long term. You should also run more rainbowlands, specifically Forbidden Orchard Gemstone Caverns Tarnished Citadel . If you are running Tolaria West as a 0 drop tutor, don't count it as a land towards your total, if you're running it as an island, it comes out tapped so cut it.
Your cantrips are a bit goofy too. Thought Scour should be replaced with Sleight of Hand , which gives you more flexibility about the card you get as well as gets around draw restrictions such as Alms Collector or Spirit of the Labyrinth . Fact or Fiction is simply too much CMC. I'm personally not a fan of Scroll Rack but that's entirely your call.
Terminate should be Pongify or Rapid Hybridization . Its 1 cmc cheaper and less color intensive, and if you lose to a 3/3 token you were going to lose anyways. Notably, Kess can kill the token by blocking.
3 days ago
inGtSToRm thanks for answering my questions and your opinion on the topics. Let's discuss this more in detail:
My deck seems to be stucked between Consultation and Storm. I run Isochron Scepter + Dramatic Reversal and Paradox Engine + Mana Rocks and as a pay off/win con Aetherflux Reservoir and Capsize , and one Consultation win con: Jace, Wielder of Mysteries + Tainted Pact . That's why I only run 1 Island and 1 Snow Covered Island (those Full Arts from Modern Horizons are going to be awesome). With the ABUR Duals + Shock Duals I have a total count of 6 Islands, which seems to me too few Islands to run High Tide ?
I do own a Wheel of Fortune but no Timetwister . But whith Time Spiral , Wheel of Fortune and Windfall there are 3 very good Wheel Effects, and there's Whispering Madness . A Turn 2 Narset, Parter of Veils followed by Turn 3 Wheel seems a to be a very good line, and this is why I am mentioning Whispering Madness . I will try Narset and give feedback after some rounds. As this is a sort of soft win con for the deck: how many slots should the Kess Deck or a cEDH in general sacrifice for wincons?
Basalt Monolith is somehow the third version for a colorless Ritual effect. Could you imagine a situation where you want Basalt Monolith turn 2-3 to enable an ad nauseum a turn later? Right now I have Gilded Lotus in my deck and if it stays for one turn, it really helps to go off that next turn.
I appreciate the discussion.
1 week ago
Hey K1ngMars, sorry to bother you again but I've noticed something that I'd love your opinion on. You'll notice I updated the description of the deck to include an interaction I overlooked with Notion Thief and Whispering Madness . My worry is that with this, I have an enormous opportunity to draw a huge amount of cards and if I'm lucky enough, mill the opponents simultaneously. What are your thoughts on adding a Laboratory Maniac to try protect myself against this combo? My fear was that EDH likes to focus on drawing a lot of cards so there's a very real chance I could discard someone anywhere from 4-7 cards on average. If it's more 5 or more, then I will draw 20 minimum (in a play group of 4) and then by not using the cipher ability - it may be a waste of a card. But if I do use it, I'll draw 80 the next time which is more than what would remain in my library at that point in time. Any suggestions would be hugely appreciated! Thanks heaps :)
3 weeks ago
Thanks for the suggestions cdkime! I agree, mill is definitely not the most ideal strategy. It was quite a challenge to find enough ways to affect the table instead of just the typical "target player" method. Which is why I quite liked cards such as Jace's Archivist , Windfall , Whispering Madness . But I do like a good challenge and it will be interesting to bring something different to the table :)
You're so right about Necrotic Ooze , that would be monstrous! Definitely going to find some room for that one. And that's an interesting idea using the opponents graveyard to get some extra value out of it. My thoughts were to maybe exile the graveyard but I was kind of conflicted with that tactic because my creatures take value out of it. I'm going to work in those suggestions. thanks.
I would also typically include more mana rocks such as the Signet and I think a revised version will certainly include more.
3 weeks ago
dude1818 The more I play and upgrade this deck, the less its about cascade. Wheel works really well without cascade, and while trying to cascade out a wheel, it can be far harder to predict. As it is, Yidris is usually just my opener, cascading out for value early on. My playgroup has wised up to the threat of cascade from Yidris, so lower cmc spells also help to stabilise a board after hes hit with heavy CC. My plan is to add in a Doomsday combo soon, my pile being Gitaxian Probe , Gush , Pact of Negation , Street Wraith and Laboratory Maniac . Or, for a less mana intensive, cascade friendly version, Ancestral Vision , Pact of Negation , anything (maybe more protection), Gush and then labman, with the initial cascade trigger being anything else in the deck. After this I want to add ad nauseum then lowering the average CMC to be 3 or less except for Whispering Madness and a few other things. This is why my average CMC is getting lower and lower.
1 month ago
Necropotence is a powerful draw refill engine, if you fix your mana base you will always be guaranteed to hit triple black easily. There are also ways you can add in triple black by having burst mana in the use of rituals like Dark Ritual . The Venser's Journal and Necro synergy is great, but sometimes it will be a dead card in your hand but the lifegain never really is a detriment. I played Sen for quite awhile so it does draw a lot of hate. One card I do like a lot if your going in a creature light build is Overburden as pretty much you deny them of playing more creatures and if they do they bounce back a land which you can play. I would also go into a some extra turn builds to build up more advantage, cards like Nexus of Fate , Time Warp , or Temporal Manipulation are stellar cards to use.
Yeah I can definitely help with mana base, however depending on your budget it can go either way as land base are quite expensive. Utility lands aren't much of a problem aside from that one Strip Mine to deal with pesky lands like Gaea's Cradle and such. There are other synergy you can use like Notion Thief + Windfall / Dark Deal / Whispering Madness . The additions you add are great ones, but in personal opinion I still think the CMC curve is quite high and can still be lowered.
1 month ago
Cipher- Whispering Madness .
Conspire- Mine Excavation .
1 month ago
I know the error happens in the "Swaps:" section and below because if I take it out, the deck saves. How do I fix it?
Description: Bad brackets near 'e]] - [[card:Entomb]] - [[card:Diabolic Tutor]] ### **Undecided:** - [[card:Whispering Madness]] - [[card:Endless Ranks of the Dead]] ### **Swaps:** - [[card:Entomb]] for [[card:Diabolic Tutor]] - Take out one [[Swamp]] - [[[' Descriptions are required for non-private decks. They are a great way to indicate what type of feedback you are looking for for your deck
My first non-precon build. Please, check the acquireboard before suggesting anything that is already on my list. I am going for graveyard play and mill with that zombie theme. ### **_Updated: 3/31/19_** ### **Cut:** - [[card:Swamp]] - [[card:Call to the Grave]] - [[card:Paradox Haze]] - [[card:Counterspell]] - [[card:Disdainful Stroke]] - [[card:Swan Song]] - [[card:Negate]] ### **Add:** - [[card:Mana Confluence]] - [[card:Fleshbag Marauder]] - [[card:Unbreathing Horde]] - [[card:Entomb]] - [[card:Diabolic Tutor]] ### **Undecided:** - [[card:Whispering Madness]] - [[card:Endless Ranks of the Dead]] ### **Swaps** - [[card:Entomb]] for [[card:Diabolic Tutor]] - Take out one [[card:Swamp]] - [[card:Mana Confluence]] is already in the decklist. - [[card:Fleshbag Maruder]] for [[card:Disdainful Stroke] - [[card:Unbreathing Horde]] for [[card:Paradox Haze]]
Whispering Madness occurrence in decks from the last year
Commander / EDH:
All decks: 0.02%
U/B/R (Grixis): 0.6%