Days Undoing
Modern forum
Posted on July 6, 2015, 10:02 a.m. by APPLE01DOJ
We have a 3 CMC Draw 7 cards spell. ...are you kidding me?!?!? This thing is so going to get banned & Burn is going to skyrocket in resurgence. Thoughts?
Like the Treasure Cruise era all over again.
EDIT:
If you're making Day's Undoing an instant, you're playing it at the BEGINNING of your opponents turn. During their upkeep. Because then it becomes a demon child of Timetwister and Time Walk.
EDIT EDIT:
Read Day's Undoing wrong. Less broken than I thought. Good. I was scared.
July 6, 2015 10:19 a.m. Edited.
Day's Undoing will induce a new aggro-era to modern. Until January when it will see the ban-hammer because of the Modern PT. It's quite sad we only see 1 change to the Modern-B&R-List per year. Just imagine... Affinity being much more streamlined vomiting out their hand on T1, following up with Day's Undoing to do more vomiting on T3 (and killing ofc, because with drawing 15 cards odds of not getting either Arcbound Ravager or Cranial Plating are pretty slim.
July 6, 2015 10:27 a.m. Edited.
Affinity and Burn could probably use this to a huge degree without too much fear of aiding their opponent.
July 6, 2015 10:57 a.m.
JexInfinite says... #6
I don't think it'll be incredibly broken like Cruise was. Not every deck can play this, and the ones that can either have a hard time casting it (Burn), or will suffer by giving the turn to the opponent (Affinity).
Then again, we've literally not seen the card be played, so only time will tell. I don't think it'll be as big of a problem as people think it will be.
July 6, 2015 11:44 a.m.
CanadianShinobi says... #7
It would be nice if people stopped overreacting to this. Will Burn and Affinity use it? Possibly. But even if they use it they're giving their opponents just as much fuel. And 7 cards can do a lot to turn a game around in one's favour. Even playing it at instant speed is ludicrous because you would need to add in something like Quicken, which would then dilute your deck too much.
If this does get banned I would be amazed. It's powerful, but not game breaking. While I see people calling it the next Treasure Cruise, I see this being the next Dig Through Time; meaning that if it gets banned it will be based upon pure and utter nonsensical speculation.
July 6, 2015 11:53 a.m.
@JexInfinite in what way does Affinity suffer, when they get to draw 7 whereas their opponent get's to draw 1 or maybe 2 cards (depending who's otp and if their opponent had a T1 play).
July 6, 2015 12:01 p.m.
WovenNebula says... #9
I personally believe the card is over hyped. Will it find a home? Maybe. If it does it won't be this unstoppable tier 0 deck that a lot of people think. People thought the same when Wheel of Fate was released. Yes they are different, but they are similar. One you cascade into play to avoid suspension, the other you quicken into play to avoid the end turn clause. It will see play nonetheless.
July 6, 2015 12:04 p.m.
JexInfinite says... #10
Putrefy Affinity is best when the affinity pilot is taking their turn. They do basically nothing on the opponent's turn, and refuelling them can lose you the game outright. Of course, on T2, it's pretty difficult to argue against it, but Pyroclasm is maindeck playable, and affinity will always have a worse G2. I suppose you could side out all the Undoings for G2 in hopes of not giving your opponent hate, but that seems too spicy.
July 6, 2015 12:16 p.m.
@Putrefy Did you not read this card? Each player draws 7 cards every time. Unless you're playing Notion Thief, in which case you draw 14 and the opponent draws 0.
You can just cast this main phase 2 before you would end your turn anyway. You guys are all oversensitive about the "end your turn" clause, when it's not that big of a deal. You're going to play your Quicken and your Leyline of Anticipation etc and you're going to water down your deck to play this card on an opponent's turn? Really? No need.
This card is coming out the gate at $15, will rollercoaster up to $18-25 depending on results, then after a few big events, will drop and hover around $10-12 until about a year after its been out of standard, and will slowly rise to a about $15-20~ card. That's my honest prediction.
July 6, 2015 12:19 p.m.
And you call yourself -Logician... Typically Affinity has played all their cards by T2, T3 max. So they draw 7 cards when you cast Undoing. Your opponent has played ~3 cards. Depending on otp/otd and if they have a good curve. So basically they draw 3 cards and not 7, because they lose all the cards they still have in their hand, whereas the affinity player's one should be empty. Got it?
July 6, 2015 12:39 p.m.
You're saying the card count in their hand increased by only 3, and not 7, but you're saying that using the wrong terminology. They do in fact draw seven cards regardless of the double meaning you decide to apply to words. The fact that the affinity player gets more value out of the deal is obvious. I'm not sure why that needs to be addressed.
July 6, 2015 12:46 p.m.
Ok, let's rephrase it: effectively the opponent is drawing 3 cards.
Also I apologize if I use the wrong terminology, English is not my first language.
July 6, 2015 1:22 p.m. Edited.
CanadianShinobi says... #15
Putrefy yes effectively the Affinity opponent is drawing 3 cards. However, drawing a completely new hand is something we have to keep in mind here. Affinity isn't a deck that has a whole lot of interaction with the board aside from spamming artifacts and maybe a Dismember or Galvanic Blast. But consider the various matchups. At what point do you want something like Jund, Delver or Burn to draw into more cards? Hell, at what point do you want to give Twin more cards on T3? Sure you can go with T2 sometimes, but even then you risk a great deal.
The card is powerful, but not game breaking. There's simply too much risk to rely on it for the win. Affinity can potentially use this to some form of advantage, but giving the opponent a fresh hand has a great number of pitfalls.
July 6, 2015 1:37 p.m.
I just wish people would stop overreacting to Day's Undoing. It's not that good, people who play it are probably thinking of BCSM (Best Case Scenario Mentality) and are enamored with the fact it says "draw 7" on it.
I'll just put it this way, if you play Day's Undoing in any existing archetype, you are wrong to do so. And if you win, it's because the other 56 cards in your deck carried you through, not Day's Undoing.
July 6, 2015 2:17 p.m.
APPLE01DOJ says... #17
Burn is the issue at hand Burn really doesn't care what the opponent has in their hand most of the time & drawing 7 cards at once when you're in top deck mode sounds like a free win to me. I mean how many games vs Burn come down to top deck mode? Tons. Burn doesn't loose cause of the board state Burn looses cause it was out raced.
July 6, 2015 2:40 p.m.
So Burn is going to take a turn off to cast Day's Undoing? That doesn't seem like something Burn would do. It might help you game 1, but in the sideboarded games you're going to give your opponent more opportunities to draw Kor Firewalker? Or Burrenton Forge-Tender? That seems bad to me.
July 6, 2015 2:47 p.m. Edited.
APPLE01DOJ I completely agree. This is going to be terrible for the meta in decks like Affinty, Burn and even Zoo. They puke their hand, draw 7, puke the hand, and this card in top deck mode is an absolute beast in those decks. Top deck this to draw 7? Really? Did WotC even consider how this would change the format? play XLightning Bolts!, play Day's Undoing draw into 2-4 MORE lightning bolts.
This is insane.
July 6, 2015 2:51 p.m.
I'd also like to say, I'm targeting this as an instant pickup in trades, because I want to abuse the hell out of it before it gets banned. =D
July 6, 2015 2:52 p.m.
CanadianShinobi says... #21
DrFunk27 Wizards does not print nor put any effort into printing and/or researching cards for Modern. You are bother living in Magical Christmas Land with this card, however. If burn is going to tap out on T3 to give everyone a new hand then something is terribly wrong and that player may want to reconsider their life choices. Sure, maybe it will help game 1. And then comes games 2-3. And then Burn will side it out, because keeping it in is pointless. And if something is going to be sided out every match then why is it in the main deck to begin with?
It is a dangerous card. If burn doesn't do enough by T3 then giving something like Twin, 7 new cards isn't going to be a good idea. In fact I can't think of a worse idea. So I'm clearly in agreement with JWiley129 on this one.
July 6, 2015 2:59 p.m.
You do realize there is a second main phase, after combat, in which burn will play this card after unloading their hand in main phase 1 and attacking during combat? lol Continue to believe it wont get played in Burn, you're kidding yourself.
We are living in another Cruise era.
July 6, 2015 3:04 p.m. Edited.
There is only one deck in Modern where I would play this type of effect, and it's Storm. But Day's Undoing is terrible in Storm because none of your win conditions are Instants. Let's look at the downsides:
You're going to give the
decks more creatures and more chances to draw disruption? What about Spirit of the Labyrinth?You're going to give
decks more chances to draw counterspells and interaction? Good luck resolving your spells with their new grip of Remand, Mana Leak, and possibly Cryptic Command. You're to give
decks more Thoughtseize and Inquisition of Kozilek? How'd that good card in the matchup look? Too bad it's back in the graveyard.You're going to give
decks more chances to draw Lightning Bolt and friends? That also seems bad.You're going to give
decks a better chance to draw their dudes? Collected Company, Obstinate Baloth, Ezuri, Renegade Leader, and others?
And that's not talking about the Multicolored cards and Colorless cards in the format. Day's Undoing is a bad card to play in Modern. And as I said before, if you play this in any existing archetype, you're wrong to do so.
July 6, 2015 3:05 p.m.
Guys. I've extensively played this card now on untap. I've played an affinity deck myself running 3 or 4 of these, and I've played against an affinity deck running 3 or 4 of these. I've spent the last few days just playing the card over and over and over.
....It's absolute trash.
Here's what goes down usually:
The affinity player vomits out their hand as per usual. Come T2 or so they play out their Arcbound Ravager or Cranial Plating. So far, so normal. So you're staring down a ton of Memnites, Ornithopters and a threat. If you don't remove it you lose. If you do remove it then the game goes on. So here's where Day's Undoing makes a difference. IF you manage to remove their threat they can restock.
So they cast it T3 after removal, or after you've deal with their threats, and pass to you. You then draw another card, taking your hand size to 8. We're assuming that the affinity player doesn't have an awesome board state because otherwise they would have won and this new card is totally superfluous. So there you go. They pass to you. IF you draw into the one Abrupt Decay or Terminate or Lightning Bolt or Path to Exile or whatever it is you need to kill the threat you assume they just drew into then the process repeats. But here's the kicker: you have a turns head start now. Whereas before you may have tapped out when dealing with a Signal Pest or whatever, this time you can untap your 3 or 4 lands and sit there with a hand full of Mana Leaks or Terminates OR you can get out some kind of threat to sit there as a blocker until they do. Sure - you may be staring at an established board state but you're looking at one that doesn't include a ravager or a plating. Therein lies the problem for them. By definition this is a card that does the most work when they're behind, and in such a state the person who doesn't cast undoing becomes 1 turn ahead.
Why is it a problem passing the turn?
Easy. Affinity is a deck that's super easy to respond to and sideboard against. Therefore whilst they're busy cycling through or churning out threats you're also busy drawing hands that include Shatterstorm or Path to Exile or Anger the gods. This is the problem for them. A deck that can be responded to with a single golden bullet does not want to cycle their opponents hand. They rely on a very specific set of cards to win. For the most part - you don't. You just need any random removal or counterspell.
Also something else to note:
A LOT of the time if I saw Day's Undoing coming I would play out as much of my removal as possible at instant speed and then let the opponent draw me into more. So as soon as they cast it I bolt and path and terminate the hell out of you and then I let you pass the turn to me so I can do it all over again.
It's so, so beautiful having Day's Undoing cast against you when you're playing ANY deck that can do things at instant speed. It's just funny. Because you get to respond to their state and then have them draw you into more responses.
Haven't tested burn yet.
July 6, 2015 4:08 p.m.
CanadianShinobi says... #25
DrFunk27 unless that second main phase has some magically untapped mana then how are they casting Day's Undoing? They either flooded or the game is taking longer than it should. In that scenario Burn has probably lost. Especially if they want to give their opponent a brand new hand.
July 6, 2015 5:19 p.m.
WovenNebula says... #26
I agree with CanadianShinobi burn should have almost won by turn 3, and in playing Day's Undoing it's either a win more card in certain situations only (Magical Christmas Land) and a gamble to give what your enemy needs, I'd rather have something more definite in that slot.
July 6, 2015 5:42 p.m.
APPLE01DOJ says... #27
Burn either wins by T4 or its out of fuel ...which is when you cast this not T3 and yea you're giving your opponent a free turn but you would be doing the same top decking a land in both cases Burn can still win Terminates aren't going to do anything when you're eating 9 more to the face next turn.
Counter spells are a different story...
July 6, 2015 9:57 p.m.
could you imagine using days undoing against splinter twin,or any combo deck for that matter! i don't really see it holding up in modern but i could be wrong.
July 6, 2015 10:37 p.m.
In my opinion, Day's Undoing won't see a whole lot of play outside of Burn and Affinity (basically fast aggro decks that need to refuel, as noted above), and it's worth noting that it's decidedly not good in the mirror match in those cases. I plan to test it to confirm my hypotheses, but I'm not worried about the card making an outsize impact.
htffan951852 says... #2
I actually don't think it will be banned or become to expensive. You have to keep in mind that unless you can play it at instant speed and play it on your opponents turn, you end your turn as soon as you play it. And while that is pretty easy to do, your opponents also get to draw the seven cards.
The way I see it, people are going to use any card that can make Day's Undoing an instant, and play it at the end of their opponent's turn so that they can get the most value out of it. But again this does help your opponent out as well.
That in mind this will definitely rise in price, but I don't think it will even reach the ten dollars in price. But that is just me.
July 6, 2015 10:17 a.m.