Pithing needle in Legacy
Legacy forum
Posted on March 10, 2014, 10:34 a.m. by harrydemon117
Why isn't Pithing Needle seeing more play? It seems good as it's only a 1 mana spell that stops things like AEther Vial , Sneak Attack , Planeswalkers, Mother of Runes , etc
I mean, I don't have a playset of Wasteland s so it would at least piss those people off :)
It can also name fetch lands!
It sees limited play because there are more main deck answers to it now, and Revoker is a thing.
March 10, 2014 10:51 a.m.
harrydemon117 says... #4
@LeaPlath: I had thought about that! Turn 1 Gitaxian Probe to see which fetch land they have and then name that to set them back a couple of turns lol
March 10, 2014 11:03 a.m.
harrydemon117 says... #5
@Boza: For decks running countermagic you can use Daze or Force of Will if need be to stop Show and Tell . Personally, I would board in some extra counterspells in those matchups as combo loses to control anyway.
I have been pondering this and was wondering if it was worth it to run Gitaxian Probe and Pithing Needle to see what you are up against and you can name the card with confidence that you want to "neuter"
March 10, 2014 11:05 a.m.
Venser, Shaper Savant is my favorite answer to show and tell decks.
March 10, 2014 11:08 a.m.
As i have already said, dedicating hate to one card is very detrimental to your deck. Daze and FOW deal with both SA and S&T in the famous deck, so they work a lot better as hate.
Dedicating 4 probes and 4 needles (that is 8 slots in 75) just to make a 1 land keep bad is a terrible idea. How much are you hurting your own gameplan by that?
compare this type of hate to the hate produced by Death and taxes. Playing a thalia is as bad for a sneak and show deck as pithing needle, if not worse. However, thalia works as a hate card vs a multitude of decks, while pithing needle is narrow and cannot be played blindly; moreover, thalia provides a clock.
March 10, 2014 11:12 a.m.
harrydemon117 says... #8
Angel of Despair was mine for awhile, but I stopped using it as I couldn't hard cast it using BUG colors and it was too expensive
March 10, 2014 11:13 a.m.
harrydemon117 says... #9
If I neuter a fetchland turn 1, I can with confidence land my win con such as Delver of Secrets Flip or Deathrite Shaman knowing that they will be a turn or 2 behind. Gitaxian Probe replaces itself and I will be able to have an island turn 1 (either by dropping my own or using my fetchland BEFORE casting Pithing Needle ) so I can still Brainstorm or Daze
March 10, 2014 11:17 a.m.
harrydemon117 says... #10
and my fetchland may even be different than the one they have in hand as well
March 10, 2014 11:18 a.m.
Stifle is a much more effective card IMO. It hits triggered also.
March 10, 2014 11:19 a.m.
harrydemon117 says... #12
Yes but only works once. A control deck's nightmare is having someone have a turn 1 AEther Vial and you don't have Force of Will in hand with another blue card. You are then forced to use removal which you may not have very much (usually 4 x Abrupt Decay in BUG lists).
I'm just trying to think outside the box. I would not run them maindeck, but sideboard was thinking that it would be a versatile slot to help "shut off" decks using things like AEther Vial or "slow down" decks using Sneak Attack or other combo type pieces
March 10, 2014 11:24 a.m.
Play more legacy. as stated Pithing Needle is a sub par answer. You still have way too many ways to remove it. Sure it's removal that could save something else, but then again the needle slots in your deck would go better towards something that forwards your game plan or surprises your opponents, in the terms of instants. remember things like Vindicate are a thing in legacy also.
March 10, 2014 11:27 a.m.
harrydemon117 says... #14
Yeah I need to play more. I try to watch the tournaments online but can't seem to find enough time to learn the format
March 10, 2014 11:35 a.m.
I have it as a 1 of in the side bc I like it in my local area but its more of a rare bring in, Dsphere and abruot decays tend to handle everything counter magic misses
March 10, 2014 12:20 p.m.
ryuzaki32667 says... #16
My deck has two in the board, namely for Deathrite Shaman so he doesn't eat up my combo. Which is instant speed reanimation of Griselbrand and Emrakul, the Aeons Torn and swinging for lethal.
March 10, 2014 12:32 p.m.
mtgtop8.com
"search" tab
format - legacy
level - i check pro, major, and competitive
Searched "pithing needle"
Pithing Needle shows up in decks from SCG open series top 8's, GPT Paris winner, GP side events. 3 in 2014, 6 in 2013.
it seems like Pithing Needle is a valid sb choice for legacy.
March 10, 2014 12:53 p.m.
Pithing Needle is more of a meta thing. Some decks are packing as many as four Abrupt Decay mainboard with one Ancient Grudge , and more Ancient Grudge s in the side.Phyrexian Revoker and Meddling Mage do the same job for a lot of decks, but also give a body.
March 10, 2014 7:51 p.m.
aeonstoremyliver says... #19
As an artifact with a CMC of 1, Pithing Needle is very playable, especially if you're not running counter magic. I mainboard Needle in my 12 Post deck to hose Wasteland mostly.
March 19, 2014 6:09 a.m.
harrydemon117 says... #20
That was my original thought as I don't have $400 to drop on them, but I DO have $6 to play something that hoses them haha
March 19, 2014 8:04 a.m.
when I have sideboarded in needle it helps a lot. it wont stop the deck but very clse, especially turn one g2 when you know what they will play.
March 25, 2014 9:49 p.m.
chicagobearz says... #22
In my deck USA Delver AK I swapped out my full set of Meddling Mage
for 2x Pithing Needle
and 2x Meddling Mage
. This was originally a move to try and stop the Dark Depths
and Thespian's Stage
combo, naming the stage. I've rolled with it and they have been useful in matches against MUD and UW Painter decks.
April 4, 2014 6:21 a.m.
aeonstoremyliver says... #23
I like that combo. Need to pick up Dark Depths for my 12 Post deck.
Da BEARS!
Anyway, Phyrexian Revoker can hit stuff Needle can't, like mana abilities. Hello Gaea's Cradle . And it is a body. Some lists prefer it over needle and vice versa.
April 4, 2014 8:07 a.m.
But phyrexian revoker cannot hit cradle. It has that pesky nonland clause. In D&T list I play i play 4 revokers in the 75 and between 1 or 2 pithing needle, just for the lower cmc. I really do not like pithing though and I am looking to substitute it. Hitting lands is sadly impossible for both cards.
April 4, 2014 8:32 a.m.
aeonstoremyliver says... #25
Crap, I read that wrong lol. I was thinking of something else in my sleep deprived state.
It can hit mana abilities of dorks like Priest of Titania , Deathrite Shaman , and the like whereas Needle can't. Revoker works great in D&T.
Why don't you like Needle though?
April 4, 2014 9:04 a.m.
It lacks the body. Revoker puts swords-wearing body out there. In DnT every body is a threat when it gets a jitte. Pithing cannot get a jitte. Plus, Runed Halo does pretty much the same job and is better in most cases (that effing True name nemesis)
April 4, 2014 9:16 a.m.
harrydemon117 says... #27
Pithing Needle cannot be a win condition on its own...Revoker can at least attack
April 4, 2014 9:16 a.m.
aeonstoremyliver says... #28
Lol TNN. Revoker is def better in some builds, esp D&T or StoneBlade variants where the body matters. In 12 Post, which is what I play, I have Prime Time and bigger beasts, so the body may be relevant, but not as much. Revoker is my 5th Needle.
April 4, 2014 9:21 a.m.
aeonstoremyliver says... #29
@Boza Actually Pithing Needle can name a land like Wasteland , Karakas , Eye of Ugin , etc. Needle effects the activated ability, but doesn't effect how they produce mana.
April 4, 2014 10:11 a.m.
julianjmoss says... #30
i mean it is fine since it applies to a lot of things but the more you get to know your deck and what it loses to and what it needs in the sideboard, you will find that there are many better cards to fill the void.
Boza says... #2
Because the hate of one particular card is not worth it. You stop the SA, but cannot stop the show and tell. You stop the waste, but do not stop the the rishadan port. You stop the aether vial, but they flash in mangara of corondor in response and you feel awkward.
Also, sideboard space is very limited in Legacy and you cannot dedicate much space to subpar answers.
March 10, 2014 10:48 a.m.