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|Commander / EDH||Legal|
|Commander: Rule 0||Legal|
|Pauper Duel Commander||Legal|
Untap all creatures you control.
3 months ago
I really want to play against this deck to test it out! This idea sounds super cool! Also, anyway to get some good untaps going in order to activate your commander multiple times per turn? I saw Patriar's Seal, I also like Thousand-Year Elixir, Saryth, the Viper's Fang, Instill Energy, Quest for Renewal, Illusionist's Bracers, Seedborn Muse, and Vitalize. There are probably other options out there
5 months ago
Staff of Domination + dork die voor 5 mana tapped = infinite
Combo's met Ashaya, Soul of the Wild op het veld.
Quirion Ranger + dork die voor 2 mana tapped.
Scryb Ranger + dork die voor 3 mana tapped.
Argothian Elder zonder summoning sickness = beide teams infinite mana
Combo's met Temur Sabertooth op het veld.
Wirewood Symbiote + 1 cmc elf om te bouncen + mana dork die voor 5+ tapped.
Combo's involving lands
1 year ago
Also, just wondering if there's some reason for the fetches other than minor thinning? No shade if it's just for thinning, I just didn't know if I was missing something that relies on it or not. I'm in the camp of being against thinning for the sake of thinning if you don't think you'll play past turn 7 or so (when it is more likely to matter) and you're otherwise giving an opponent graveyard food for deathrite shaman and other stuff.
Finally, if I were running an elf deck, Marwyn would be my commander instead of Ezuri especially since you're already running all the infinite mana stuff for her. I'd just use Ezuri as a backup craterhoof.
1 year ago
Looks a lot smoother, nice!
For Card Draw, I find Vanquisher's Banner to be one of the best for an Elf build. For one, getting the mana to play it out early isn't difficult at all, and for two -- Elf decks tend to be very creature heavy, thus increasing the chance of drawing another low-mana elf when you cast a creature. This can generally be repeated multiple times a turn, often multiple turns per game in fact. Particularly if you keep drawing/casting 1-mana elves.
I also can't think of a single better Card Drawer for Elves than Sylvan Messenger. I've often cast him with the Vanquisher Banner in play only to draw easily 3 or 4 more elves, and this allows you to just keep spam-playing quite early in the game. Plus, he has innate Trample, making him a prime target for buffing up. So long as you can just keep Drawing/Tutoring elves, you can just go non-stop for quite a while. This is also another reason I like Vitalize (kudos for including that underappreciated beauty); You can use Vitalize strategically with the Sylvan Messenger's effect and extend your time playing elves even longer by re-using your mana generating creatures.
Shamanic Revelation isn't a bad card by any means, but in a build like this I think I'd find it a bit slow. I could be way off the mark here because I have no idea what types of decks you're commonly up against, but a benefit of using the Vanquisher Banner/Sylvan Messenger for you card draw is that you're never drawing that many cards at once. The worst thing I can see happening is having a bunch of creatures in play, casting Revelation, and drawing so many cards that you're still forced to discard even after playing.
Without testing it myself, I fully admit that I'm just speculating here, but in general I don't favor drawing mass amounts of cards all at once unless you've got something included with "You have no maximum Hand size."
With you keeping the infinite mana combos with the staff, I think Domesticated Hydra doesn't really belong. I'm sure you just threw him in for his X-cost ability, but you already have Ezuri, Renegade Leader whom you could achieve a BETTER effect from (infinite mana, so infinite triggers). This will hit ALL elves instead of just one creature. Plus, the Hydra doesn't share an Elf type so he's not helping your Priest of Titanias or Elvish Archdruids, and he won't be hit by Tribal Unity OR Ezuri's global elf effect. As a general rule, with a strong tribal build like this, do not include anything which doesn't fit your desired creature type. All it ultimately does is reduce your overall deck synergy.
In any case though, MUCH more reliable looking build you have here. I'd be eager to hear from you how differently it's playing now.
1 year ago
Overall, I like it! Few observations:
My personal experience with Elf builds (particularly in Legacy format) is that nowadays there a SO many decent elves to choose from that no "one build" really has it all, and a deck's viability tends to depend a lot on the playgroup it's being used with.
Anymore, the "infinite combo" approach with Staff of Domination takes FAR too long to set up in my opinion (plus, artifact destruction isn't nearly as 'niche' as it used to be), and you can easily (and more quickly) win the game without it. (I actually removed the one Staff of Domination I own from my elf deck as it kept winning before it could really get moving). I can see it still being viable in, say, Commander format -- but nowadays there are SO many ways to deal with an artifact threat, that I don't feel it's anywhere NEAR as strong as it used to be (let's remember after all, 20 or so damage is all you're really looking to achieve in a lot of games). Bottom line, you're eating up 8 card slots in order to pull off an infinite combo, so unless that's your ONLY win condition (which here, it is not) I personally find it to be a waste.
So you don't think I'm just being negative, one possible thing to add which might help with this would be to swap your 4x Snakeskin Veil for 4x Tamiyo's Safekeeping. True it doesn't add a counter, but Tamiyo's Indestructible effect will: A) Protect a creature from a Boardwipe effect (which mere Hexproof won't do), and also B) Can be used to target ANY permanent, not just a creature (so, perhaps saving your Staff of Domination or Umbral Mantle from some artifact hate). This would help ensure that you are in fact getting that combo off when you happen to have the cards (no tutoring effects either makes pulling it off especially difficult game after game).
Another thing I see right off the bat is how many "tap for mana" elves you have. I don't see Umbral Mantle being valuable here except for your 'infinite combo staff maneuver'. Me personally, I favor things like Vitalize, because it'll hit everything you've got rather than just one creature, and I would also add in some form of Card Draw -- because all the mana in the world won't help you with an empty hand if your opponent has board control.
Again, if the infinite Staff combo is REALLY something you're sold on, then yeah maybe keep the Umbral Mantle, but it's such an old combo now that I find it far too easy for opponents to disrupt in one way or another. I also don't see any X-cost stuff in here (except for the Gelatinous Genesis copies, which I'd drop for something better honestly) -- X-cost stuff is really what makes the Infinite Staff combo shine in my opinion. If you're going that route you'd want Helix Pinnacle (for a next-turn win with Infinite Mana), Tribal Unity (should you want to do a big Elf Attack with all that mana, Stream of Life (if you're doing a teams game and want to heal your teammate) -- stuff like that, to really put down a power play when you finally hit infinite mana. In any case, if you end up wanting to stick with the Staff, put some more X-cost stuff in so that "infinite mana" is more than just a novelty and can essentially end the game for you.
I appreciate the vote of confidence in my elf builds, so I'll assume you've already seen my Legacy Elf build -- but here's a link again in case you want to review some more options. It's basically a deck that COULD have gone infinite mana, but didn't because it genuinely doesn't need it to win. The Card Draw just gets nuts, and I've regularly had turns where I'm playing out 4 or 5 Elves.
See my Elf Build: Tae'rin Terror (Elf Zerg) for more thoughts/suggestions along this line.
You've clearly got some seriously solid cards going on here now though, so any critique anyone can offer isn't really going to be along the lines of "This is just outright bad" and more of "This is slightly more efficient and reliable". I wish you luck, and +1 on your build!
1 year ago
Vitalize is a card that is so often overlooked & I use it to pretty devastating effect in a couple of my Legacy builds.
Adding a couple here might really help you combo out some pumped-up Ooze(s). It can also help you set up nicely for the opponent's turn, giving you some blockers w/o having to hold back an attack.
Either way, +1 for a solid build
1 year ago
I'd replace Mobilize with Copperhorn Scout. The cmc is the same, and scout is an elf for when that matters, and the scout can be used repeatedly. The problem with Vitalize and Mobilize is that they are one-offs and thus often low impact, but at least the former is an instant allowing you to use it during your opponents' turns for a surprise move.
Cards like Torment of Hailfire are just better than things like Gruesome Scourger and Radiant Epicure which at 5cmc will often just not do enough to justify the cost. It's always good to think of the floor of the card and not just the ceiling. If you have one other creature out and play those cards it will feel bad. With Hailfire, even if you only cast it for five each opponent is going to have to choose between sacrificing up to three permanents or taking up to nine to the face, which will be a good return on investment.
Living Death is especially amazing with Syr Konrad, the Grim and can double as a board wipe and win con. If you cast it with Syr Konrad out, first all creatures in all graveyards will do damage to each opponent as they are exiled from the graveyard, then opponents will take damage for every creature killed and put into the graveyard. Its just crazy powerful. Also, if you have a sac outlet you can always sac all of your stuff first so you can get everything back. Its just unbeatable.
I feel like Throne of the God-Pharaoh could do some work but probably fits better in a different deck, but that's just me.
The Meathook Massacre is pricey in money for a reason- its sort of a catch all. It can be a boardwipe, or not, but either way its an extra aristocrat effect of a permanent type people remove the least, so its good!
I'll post some other thoughts on the deck page itself, but I wanted to answer your above questions here.
1 year ago
Thanks Apollo_Paladin for your advice. Vitalize seems to be a good option, but I'm thinking on adding more disrupt-control enchantments. Perhaps Root Maze is a good alternative to this deck? The drawback will be that Quirion Ranger will not be so versatile anymore.