Any cheap mana permanent with "Shuffle your library"?
Legacy Deck Help forum
Posted on Nov. 13, 2023, 8:54 p.m. by BrokkenDays
Hi everyone!
I'm new to the forums (obviously), so sorry in advance if this is the wrong section, I thought this was the best place for this question.
As the title says, is there any legal card with cheap mana cost or even 0 permanent (enchantment/artifact) that makes you shuffle your library whenever you want?
I know it's an odd card to seek out, but sometimes I find myself bricked and tapped out (see what I did there?) and many times I want to shuffle my library to maybe unbrick myself, so any cheap mana card(s) that does this would be awesome if it exists, especially if it makes that you don't lose advantage, like discarding a card without drawing a new one, etc. The only card I can think of is Gaea's Blessing, which is good, but a permanent that allows me to do this anytime I want by tapping it or something would be better.
And yes I know about cycling, but most cards nowadays don't have cycling and in some decks I don't use any cards that has it.
Scroll Rack (format dependent) is another low costed option.
November 13, 2023 9:24 p.m.
BrokkenDays says... #4
Sorry yeah I just have mentioned the format, it's the Legacy format, which means Divining Top is banned there.
I liked Scroll Rack though, thanks for the tip, going to get that, but any other cards like this or similar is welcomed too.
November 13, 2023 9:47 p.m.
FormOverFunction says... #5
Soldier of Fortune BABY!!! [Rick_Flair_Woo.gif]
November 13, 2023 9:52 p.m.
Assuming Commander, Soldier of Fortune is a directly apt choice. Elvish Reclaimer does the job well. Lantern of Insight is okay. Myr Mindservant fits anywhere. Soothsaying is pricy for the effect but acceptable. Turn the Earth does it twice with additional utility. And Weathered Wayfarer is always great.
Whilst I assumed it went without saying, I'll say it anyway. Fetchlands are splendid for many reasons; shuffling is one of them.
November 13, 2023 10:12 p.m.
BrokkenDays says... #7
Woah nice, thanks guys, I didn't know about any of these cards, all are awesome!
My first deck will be a Sanctum of All in a Legacy local tournament, so I can use any color since it's all colors, forgot to mention that too.
I will use proxies since cards here in Brazil are expensive as heck and they allow proxies in this store for the Legacy format, so I can use any legal card in Legacy, I'll make copies of all of these, thanks again!
Also I loved the Lantern Insight, I also like gimmicks like this that makes both players playing with top library/hand revealed, Soothsaying is good and it's not costly if you use only the second ability, which is great for just 1 blue mana and paying whatever you want to see and stack the top of your library in the way you want it, especially since it's an enchantment, Wayfarer and creatures are more easily dealt with by the opponent but it's also a great card as well, and Soldier of Fortune would be completely ignored by your opponent and not use any removal on it, since it's just a 1/1 and it only shuffles your library, so it's also good for that reason.
Again thanks a lot everyone, you guys are awesome!
November 13, 2023 10:29 p.m.
This thread was moved to a more appropriate forum (auto-generated comment)
November 13, 2023 11:27 p.m.
Do you have much familiarity with Legacy? Legacy is a fast, brutal format, full of extremely powerful decks. Generally speaking, every card in your deck should either advance your victory or hinder your opponent.
The top of your library is a really bad resource - it does not do anything on its own, so you need to either spend other resources to actualise it (putting that card in your hand, having a card which lets you play it from the top, or waiting precious time you cannot afford to wait for your next draw step).
And, of course, you need a resource for it to be useful in the first place - an unknown card is an unknown card. If you had a 3/40 chance of that unknown card being the thing you want, then you have that same 3/40 chance after. Shuffling without having expended precious resources to get better information is just as likely to make things worse for you as it is to make things better.
Given the brutality of the format, I think you are better off focusing on other, more useful aspects of your deck. Realistically, your only efficient way to shuffle the deck are fetch lands (like Flooded Strand), which actively help you advance by helping fix your mana.
November 13, 2023 11:40 p.m.
BrokkenDays says... #10
I play Historic on Arena, which is pretty much Legacy in paper, I only play there since I have no friends to play in paper, so the only way to play paper is in local stores.
I will have maybe a Field of Ruin, Fabled Passage, etc on this deck.
So this "shuffle the deck" is useless in Legacy with a sanctum deck? I can submit my current decklist if you want to take a look
November 14, 2023 12:30 a.m.
I guess the next question is, how competitive/casual is this tournament? If it's "bring what you have" using the Legqcy banlist, you can probably get away with some lower powered cards. Pretty much every professional tournament Legacy decklist will be worth thousands of dollars, easily.
https://www.mtggoldfish.com/metagame/legacy#paper
This is a list of current tournament-winning competitive decks. (I don't have links enabled, sorry.) If you expect to see some of these in your local tournament, you need the top-shelf stuff. Otherwise, it would be better to describe the tournament as Casual. There's nothing wrong with that, but calling it Legacy assumes a certain level of deck power and investment.
Historic is much closer to Pioneer, maybe the fringes of Modern than it is to Legacy.
https://mtgdecks.net/Historic
This is a list of the current Historic tournament decks. Check out the links side by side, and you'll get an idea of the difference.
November 14, 2023 12:39 a.m.
BrokkenDays says... #12
It's pretty much casual as far as I know, just a card shop tournament. And yes you can have any card/deck as long as it obeys the Legacy banlist. As I said I will be using proxies, this store allows it since they themselves said that because a lot of cards in Legacy are expensive proxies are allowed, even a full deck of proxies is allowed too.
I said Legacy because this is the one of the tournament formats they host and Legacy is the only one they allow proxies, so that's why I'm choosing to play in this format there, it will be my first time in a tournament environment, I play Magic in Arena and way back with my older brother but never a tournament in a store, or maybe an event is a more suitable word.
It's cheap to participate and I can use proxies, so I will be going to mostly have fun, meet new people and get out of the house and do something different, I have some mental problems so that will help, but that is besides the point.
Here is my current decklist, as you can see my deck and sideboard is prepared for most common decks like mill, lifegain, aggro, self mill with Jace because of Calm Waters and maybe mid-range, but I think it can be improved, I have been thinking of using Yorion as companion too to have it as a card and put some counters and other cards in the main deck, but I don't think is necessary: https://deckstats.net/decks/242803/3286994-sanctum-of-all-1-4
November 14, 2023 1:26 a.m.
Yeah, it's good to get out and play in person if you can. Stay safe, meet good people, and enjoy it.
First thought is, as long as there's no proxy limit, use the original dual lands. Tundra, Taiga, and all the rest have all the upside of the shocklands with none of the downside. If you can, the fetchlands (Wooded Foothills, Windswept Heath, etc.) will give you more consistency and precision in your land base as well.
Basically, proxy up the best possible version of the card you have. Another couple of switches could be Idyllic Tutor -> Enlightened Tutor, or Doomskar -> Supreme Verdict, and even these could probably be improved. The goal is to go as fast and hard as possible. If you want to stick with the Shrine core, then maximize the support and land base. Find ways to play two or three Shrines each turn. Skim through the Legacy meta and pull ideas from there. If everyone's allowed to proxy everything, then you have free reign to go wild.
Above all, have fun!
November 14, 2023 2:04 a.m.
BrokkenDays says... #14
Nice, thanks a lot for the insights man! Completely forgot about the original dual lands that don't enter tapped.
Yeah I will definitely tweak with these cards, also I need Swords to Plowshares at least on the sideboard, since other people can go wild too, especially "cheating" out Emrakul from hand or deck, so if they do that with Sneak Attack or something like that I can cast Plowshares and it's out.
Also this is just one of many decks I like, I just loved the Sanctum deck a lot, so I will just make one for now, to see if I fit in and all that, also this way I don't spend a lot of money buying more matte sleeves for the proxies and printing the cards, if it all goes well, I have fun and so on I will make other decks in the future, variety is the spice of life after all :P
Thanks a lot again everyone, especially you legendofa! (also sorry if you care about gender identity and I didn't use your preferred pronoun)
November 14, 2023 2:29 a.m.
BrokkenDays says... #15
Sorry again forgot that Emrakul is immune to colored spells, so I need to use something else like Time Stop or Mindbreak Trap for it, another tweak I need to do lol :p
November 14, 2023 2:33 a.m.
As a note, if you are going to link to a deck list, you should probably recreate that deck on this site. TappedOut folks obviously use TappedOut, so it is polite to use the site your readers are used to looking at.
I think you are in for a very rude awakening when you play in a Legacy tournament which allows proxies if you expect it to be like Historic. Legacy is nothing like Historic - Historic is designed to be fair, and Wizards has purposefully kept some of the very, very, very broken things out of Historic.
Let’s put it this way - the most played card in Legacy is Force of Will, with over half of top-tier Legacy decks running it. Other free Counterspells, like Daze also rank high among the most played cards. These free counter spells are an important part of Legacy, because the format is so fast, you can’t really afford to leave mana open and your opponents could just… win the game before you ever even have the chance to use a Counterspell.
Another data point - maybe in Historic you might need to pack an answer to Emrakul - Emrakul isn’t even among the top 100 creatures played in Legacy (I don’t actually know if she has any presence on Legacy). She is too weak of a card for the format.
Anyway, I think you should look at more Legacy lists to get a better idea of how the format plays, or perhaps watch some videos from high level tournaments. Even though you mention the tournament you are found to is “casual”, the existence of proxies in it and the word “Legacy” both strongly imply it will be full of extremely oppressive decks.
November 14, 2023 8:03 a.m.
jethstriker says... #18
Emrakul has presence in legacy. With the exception of traditional reanimator, any deck that tries to cheat out a creature has a high chance of having an Emrakul in it. Emrakul and Griselbrand are hand in hand the prime choice of creature to cheat out in legacy.
November 14, 2023 6:13 p.m.
sergiodelrio says... #19
Squadron Hawk ftw!
Remember you can fetch all remaining 3 hawks the first time you cast one, then simply "fail to find" and just shuffle for the ones you cast after that.
November 16, 2023 6:43 a.m.
BrokkenDays says... #20
Caerwyn Yeah sorry for that, I didn't even did a proper link format, I just copied where I built my deck without thinking, I'll change that, especially since I did some tweaks on it. Well like I said I never played with other people in paper except with my brother when I was a kid and of course never in a "tournament" setting, even if I lose it will be good fun to be able to be able to play in paper, going to another city (where the store is) and meeting new people, having fun, etc and playing outside of Arena is more important to me in this, also it's mistakes that make us learn right? So all in all should be good fun nonetheless. People also run here in my country elf and goblin decks to swarm the field, I've seen them asking for a goblin, elf, etc deck in the comments on sites selling cards and places like that, which I have a response to, either or both Doomskar and Ghostly Prison counters, and I found out that Authority of the Consuls counters Emrakul or whatever other card using Sneak Attack or Show and Tell, Emrakul is immune to colored spells, not permanents, which Authority is, so it will enter tapped, can't attack to use annihilator and gets sac'ed (using Sneak Attack), even if using multiple Emrakuls won't matter if I have just one Authority in play. Also, I think Historic in Arena is somewhat equal to what you said to me, because there is a lot of goblin decks, elf decks, loop decks (Vito and opponent losing life) etc, so to some extent it will be somewhat like that. I am also going to be running Pyroblast, so if they use any of these cards they will have to exile a blue card from their hand having less cards in hand and I just counter it with Pyroblast since it can counter any blue card, if they use another Force of Will or similar it will be just less cards in their hand and/or an Island on the field for them so less plays to make. I of course am no expert and no one can prepare for and counter every deck there is, I also have no idea what decks people will use, so again at least it will be good fun overall, it's also cheap to enter this event on this store especifically, so we'll see, I'll post here when I'm ready and after I go there, thanks a lot for the feedback!
seshiro_of_the_orochi, jethstriker, sergiodelrio Thanks too for the feedbacks and card tips! And yeah I found out that Authority counters Emrakul using Sneak Attack or Show and Tell and cards like that, which is great since I already run it :p
Here is my current deck I will use BTW: Sanctum of All Deck
November 17, 2023 3:58 a.m.
BrokkenDays If you haven't done it yet, I recommend playtesting a little bit against a proven Legacy deck, to get a feel for what to expect going in and get some sideboard considerations going.
https://www.mtggoldfish.com/archetype/legacy-goblins#paper
https://www.mtggoldfish.com/archetype/legacy-elves#paper
Here's the sort of Elves and Goblins decks you might see. Copy them into decklists here, then open a new browser window for your deck and playtest them against each other. Better than going in blind.
Let us know how the tournament/event goes for you!
November 17, 2023 11:43 a.m.
Myr Mindservant comes to mind. I use it in conjunction with Mystic Forge in heavy colorless spells decks.
Caerwyn says... #2
For starters, what format are you looking at? It is hard to discuss card legality when one does not know which set of legal cards you are looking to use.
Additionally, unless you know what the top card of your library is, shuffling your library does absolutely nothing for you--it changes one completely random unknown card for another completely random unknown card. There's no statistical advantage unless you have some way of knowing what is on your library. Generally speaking, something like Sensei's Divining Top is going to be a much better option--it gives you information and allows you to manipulate a known card to the top of your library.
November 13, 2023 9:18 p.m. Edited.