EDH Banlist Updates
Commander (EDH) forum
Posted on Sept. 12, 2014, 12:49 p.m. by Epochalyptik
The RC has announced their decision to eliminate "banned as commander" from the format rules.
BANNED:
Braids, Cabal Minion
Rofellos, Llanowar Emissary
Erayo, Soratami Ascendant
UNBANNED:
Kokusho, the Evening Star
Metalworker
Let's discuss. Do you agree with the move to eliminate "banned as commander" from the format? It allowed more flexibility in addressing certain cards, but it did mean having to explain the difference between "banned" and "banned as commander."
Moreover, what do you think about the changes?
If I'm understanding Epoch's post, they're just straight up banned. The only previously banned commander that is now usable will be Kokusho.
September 12, 2014 1:01 p.m.
Is there a source link? Not finding the changes on the wizards banned list of the Elder Dragon Highlander site.
September 12, 2014 1:05 p.m.
Unforgivn_II says... #5
Oh. Great. Time to watch my Erayo plummet in price.
September 12, 2014 1:09 p.m.
Epochalyptik says... #6
Updated with source.
@Unforgivn_II: No. Those cards are banned. They can't be used as anything.
September 12, 2014 1:09 p.m.
lemmingllama says... #10
I'm pretty happy with the changes. Rofellos and Braids could both be pretty brutal if left unchecked. I'm a little concerned about the unbanning of Metalworker , I can see some Sharuum the Hegemon or Memnarch decks getting really ugly hands.
Also its good that they removed the "Banned as a Commander" ruling. Normally cards would be banned as a commander since their power level is too high to consistently be cast. With all of the tutors and such, its best to just eliminate them altogether.
September 12, 2014 1:35 p.m.
Koku should have been unbanned long ago. This is a good move.
September 12, 2014 1:40 p.m.
I feel pretty fortunately that my local game shop ran out of stock on Rofellos. I leterally went to buy one days ago and was shot down.
September 12, 2014 1:40 p.m.
HorrorAvengers says... #13
I'm not a fan of the metalworker unbanning, other than that, I like this.
September 12, 2014 1:44 p.m.
Yeah. I'm a bit worried about Metalworker, but as it stands I'm okay with this as a whole. Rofellos and Braids were powerful even without their Commander status, and Erayo... Erayo's not on that level, but I wouldn't want to see her as a Commander, so banning her outright if it's the only option works for me.
Kokusho is a tricky spot, in that he's a power card in the ninety-nine, but not busted. As a Commander, the extra consistency is just dumb. I'm worried about this one too, now that I think of it.
September 12, 2014 1:52 p.m.
Im glad they removed ''banned as a commander''. If your going to ban it as a commander, just ban it straight up. If its soo overpowered then its still going to be all over the format, even if its not peoples commander. New rule makes sense to me.
Im really surprised they unbanned metalworker, the card begs to be abused in EDH. Should be fun.
September 12, 2014 1:57 p.m.
HorrorAvengers says... #16
inb4 sharum t1.
Naw one card won't do that much. Still, I don't like the idea of artifacts having a super sol ring.
BUT
my zegana deck can abuse it like fuck. So many artifacts.
September 12, 2014 2:02 p.m.
Metalworker is a 1/2 artifact creature. If a deck can't interact with that, it's owner has made some serious deckbuilding mistakes.
I'm okay with the unbanning of those cards. Personally, I was hoping for Deadeye Navigator to finally hit the bin.
September 12, 2014 2:52 p.m.
VampireArmy says... #18
Ban dead eye and see riots among the flicker combo guys
September 12, 2014 2:56 p.m.
Braids banned?!?!?!?!
Luckily I still got smokestack. But that's disappointing.
September 12, 2014 4:04 p.m.
FancyTuesday says... #20
I never thought "Banned as Commander" was an overly complicated concept, but I can appreciate any form of simplification in rules for a format that's meant to have a very low threshold for entry.
I'm ok with the release of Kokusho, the Evening Star and Metalworker . In a vacuum neither of them offer a massive card advantage to the player using them or blow out any other player. They're both highly dependent on specific conditions/board-states to do anything special, and having synergy with other cards is no reason to ban something from the format.
September 12, 2014 4:27 p.m.
I like this move a lot. I mean, it is a bit sad that braids can no longer be in the 99, generally he was a really sweet card and even pretty fair, but this situation is a lot more simple and I get to brew with koko.
September 12, 2014 4:29 p.m.
I'm not convinced that Erayo, Soratami Ascendant is on the same level as Braids and Rofellos, but I can see it being a real problem once flipped. I guess these are good moves
September 12, 2014 4:37 p.m.
Erayo is easily the worst offender IMO. The most powerful effect and the hardest to get rid of.
September 12, 2014 4:57 p.m.
NobodyPicksBulbasaur says... #26
I've always absolutely hated Koko in EDH.
By himself, he's just fine. The problem is, he's never alone. A girl in my playgroup uses Damia, Sage of Stone to draw into Koko + Rite of Replication , then just ramps until she can play both. When we try to interact with it she's always ALWAYS holding goddamn Pact of Negation .
I get bitter sometimes.
September 12, 2014 7:17 p.m.
I used to run Erayo, even when I had the board locked down i lost to Zur the Enchanter ever spell was countered but he found away around it.
September 12, 2014 7:26 p.m.
Didgeridooda says... #28
Seems ok NobodyPicksBulbasaur, but how does it get to that point so often? That is only 25 to each person right? Just making sure I am not missing anything. There are much more efficient combos out there, especially in a Damia deck.
September 12, 2014 7:30 p.m.
now just unban Tolarian Academy so i can play Palinchron again
September 12, 2014 7:33 p.m.
NobodyPicksBulbasaur says... #30
It gets to that point so often because those aren't the only 2 cards in the deck, and none of the other 97 are slouches, either.
And yes, it's only 25 to each person, but then there's also about 100 life gained in the process. Kinda ruins the game state if everything else was "fair" at the time.
September 12, 2014 8:21 p.m.
brokentoken says... #31
So metalworker is unbanned??? It's still on the list on the website. Also, i'm glad to see anything removed from the banned list. i dont think much of anything in commander should be banned.
September 12, 2014 8:30 p.m.
guerillarage says... #32
I'm fine with the rofellos banning, even though its a centerpiece of one of my decks. Rofellos is a very powerful card and IMHO needed a banning. I do not like the fact that Braids is now banned.
September 12, 2014 8:34 p.m.
EndStepTop says... #33
I felt this was relevent:
http://forum.mtgcommander.net/EDH_Forum/viewtopic.php?f=14&t=17211&start=30
Rofellos, Llanowar Emissary and Braids, Cabal Minion were "collateral damage".
September 12, 2014 9:41 p.m.
hopefully teferi wont be the only planeswalker we can use as a general, if i get Nicol Bolas, Planeswalker as a general, i will start playing this again
September 12, 2014 9:45 p.m.
fadelightningmm says... #35
@ Gspot they did say it was too streamline the ban list which wasn't really that complex. Personally as a green player I'm upset that green seems to take a lot of hits
September 12, 2014 10:10 p.m.
EndStepTop says... #36
I'm very upset. I play stax in a highly competitive group. Losing the second strongest stax piece for this reason, while other decks still retain their value is apalling. Luckily my group is ignoring the ban. However I have to alter my list to play outside my group.
Tl;DR: two unbroken cards are banned for no reason.
September 12, 2014 10:14 p.m.
hisaoawesome says... #38
As someone who recently bought a Rofellos, Llanowar Emissary thinking that it was a safe investment I'm pretty pissed. This came out of the blue without much reason other then the BS that it was confusing how it was only banned as a commander. Who was that confusing too exactly? A person first reading the rules of EDH maybe, until they finished reading the freaking rules. It's not like Rofellos dominates EDH either, he's a fragile 2/1 with no built in protection that either dies instantly or makes you THE target of a table. This is a middle finger to Timmys everywhere.
And spike keeps Necropotence , Deadeye Navigator , Consecrated Sphinx , and the oh so broken Bribery . AND adds Metalworker ..
The rules committee needs to get their act together.
September 13, 2014 1:42 a.m.
Um. Rofellos is a Spike card as much as it is a Timmy card. In mono green, he's the equivalent of a turn two Vorinclex or Mana Reflection . That's absurd amounts of ramp, and your only requirements are hitting your land drops.
Consecrated Sphinx and DEN are (slightly larger) dudes that have no built in protection other than their size and are either instantly removed, make you a target, or you win. So, not exactly the soundest argument against them yet pro Rofellos.
Bribery is broken lolwut. Like, yeah, I don't like people stealing my stuff as much as the next guy, but Bribery is only broken if you don't run answers to creatures (or Bribery, but not everyone in the world plays blue, so I'll grant you that). And if nobody runs answer to creatures where you play, then, well, explain how Rofellos is too vulnerable again?
Metalworker needs to be watched, I'll grant you. But side by side to Rofellos, they're dudes, that tap for absurd amounts of mana, that you can play relatively early game. Rofellos even gets you colored mana, to play many things. Yes, Rofellos generates noticeably less mana, but they're both equally vulnerable; in fact, since Metalworker can be hit by artifact removal too. Yeah, it needs to be re-banned pretty soon, I think; but if it deserves to be banned, Rofellos probably does too.
Necropotence is the only thing here where you might have an argument, but someone more aligned with Spike than me might be better equipped to explain how Necropotence isn't deserving of a banlist spot.
September 13, 2014 3:14 a.m.
HeroInMyOwnMind says... #40
That is unfortunate. I didn't really mind seeing any of these cards as non-commanders. /shrug. I suppose my opinion of "powerful" cards is not shared by the majority of EDH players.
September 13, 2014 6:09 a.m.
I'm seriously thinking about getting out of EDH. The rules committee is a joke.
Let's ban a creature that can only go in a green deck and ramps for a ton of green, but unban a colorless creature that can go into any deck and ramps for a ton of colorless.
Let's also ignore that a color that is limited by it's ability to ramp has a much harder to interact with mana accelerate than Rofellos, Llanowar Emissary in the form of Cabal Coffers . One isn't more abusive than the other, apart from one being a potential commander.
Meanwhile, Deadeye Navigator , Tooth and Nail , Mana Drain , Mana Crypt , Necropotence and so on....
I really feel like their ban decisions are rather arbitrary and don't help the format, only what they think is "fun/unfun."
September 13, 2014 6:20 a.m.
canterlotguardian says... #43
The only thing I'm sad about is Rofellos. Other than that, I agree with Erayo and Braids getting the banhammer. Also happy about Koko getting unbanned, as my Jund dragons deck is gonna get a buddy deck when I build one around Koko.
September 13, 2014 9:16 a.m.
Didgeridooda says... #44
This was not a banning though. It was a "streamlining" of the ban list. They did not announce new bans. I think Wizards just needs to buy them out.
It seems that there are a few guys that run this, and one of them plays blue, and the other plays green. Then the other guys don't like them, so they ban the good stuff. But that is how I have always felt. I do not like the EDH ban list. I thought banned as commander was an easy to understand, and good distinction for those cards. No need to streamline.
September 13, 2014 11:16 a.m.
EndStepTop says... #45
Didgeridooda if you go to SCG's website read some of Sheldon's articles. He's on the edh rules committee, and knowing his opinion on the format makes me uneasy.
September 13, 2014 1:02 p.m.
EndStepTop says... #47
Theres a few, on in particular talks about player ethics, and he refers to players who use proxies as being "that guy". He also has stated, (and I don't remember the article, sorry) that "battlecruiser" magic where players aren't knocked out before t10 is what he wants Edh to be.
September 13, 2014 1:10 p.m.
And ye, I really don't like the rules committee thought process. If they want it to be a turn ten format, they have to accept a larger ban list. Cards like Hermit Druid come to mind, or just ramping into Tooth and Nail .
"We think players will be nice and not jerks so we don't need to ban a bunch of cards!"
...is a terrible reason to not ban something. But that seems to be their line of thinking. You can't have your cake and eat it, too.
September 13, 2014 1:55 p.m.
EndStepTop says... #50
I love the format having the speed it does, my problem ia that they ban cards based on what they like/don't like. Not what's broken. That was one of the links I was referring to. I stopped reading his articles after the one on the topic of proxies, he's so full of himself and ignorant that some people can't just buy a Gaea's Cradle or what have you.
Unforgivn_II says... #2
So, we can use those three as Commanders now? Erayo is going to be a bitch
September 12, 2014 12:59 p.m.