Please login to comment
January 15, 2020 7:28 p.m.
So I built Esper Control, and it kinda doesn’t get there. What did I do wrong with this build?
My LGS has no real meta. Most guys build something new everything week. I do consistently see RDW, Heroic, and UW Control.
January 15, 2020 8:46 a.m.
Well that seems like an inconsistent situation, but even when you see it, I think the only thing you can do is hope for a hand with at least 2 cheap removal spells like Fatal Push and Cast Down , land to cat, and some draw stuff to refill you. That’s a rough beat, though.
January 14, 2020 7:23 a.m.
Argy, I have been playing mono blue devotion. The list that you see posted most often wasn’t getting the job done. I swapped the set of Curious Obsession out in favor of a play set of Wizard's Retort . In this deck is basically Counterspell . I also removed things like Spell Pierce and Dive Down . There just weren’t enough moment’s where they go the job done. I added in more Brazen Borrower and went to a full set of Harbinger of the Tides . Even if I am not bouncing and tapping a lot of stuff for tempo plays I am usually playing my stuff at opponent’s end step so I can leave counter mana up for things I honestly cannot deal with.
I find control to be a decent matchup for me most of the time, as long as I keep Teferi, Time Raveler off the board. I can outlast most of my burn matchups.
Things I have trouble beating are dredge and Gruul aggro. As long as I can stick a Grafdigger's Cage , I can close out games 2 and 3 against dredge with minimal stress. Against the Gruul deck, I can slow them with Tidebinder Mage , but between Gruul Spellbreaker and Embercleave , I have trouble keeping my life above 0. Steel Leaf Champion is also stupid good against this.
January 13, 2020 9:31 a.m.
Epidilius, I am looking at the 8 Rack list. How are they swinging for 10 on turn 2?
January 13, 2020 9:13 a.m.
shadow63, control decks don’t really win before turn 7, and pioneer has quite a few successful control decks right now. I have a powerful Esper list I may throw it in as a 1 of wild card spot if no one wants to craft a deck together.
January 8, 2020 11:25 a.m.
Can we make a viable Pioneer deck that takes advantage of a big fat Hedonist's Trove ? Let’s try so I can take it to my LGS and see how it does.
First things first: my local meta consists of RBu midrange, RU Thing in the Ice Flip, RDW, Black Devotion, Gruul Aggro, White Weenies, Dredge, Lotus Field, and we have a guy that brings whatever was on top the previous week.
This clearly needs to be some type of control deck. I would prefer to stay away from mill, as it is less competitive, but do we have enough good control cards to fill a graveyard so we can slam down Trove in turn 7?
If this isn’t competitive viable, please let’s just make a fun deck and see what happens.
I am thinking we need a lot of removal and board wipes. We can go in the direction of burn or straight up kill.
What can we play?
January 8, 2020 9:42 a.m.
Daveslab2022, no I don’t really see why that’s an issue. Smuggler's Copter did exactly what it was designed to do, in all the decks it was designed to do it in. Even Rosewater explained it was banned for “being used too much”. It was in all the aggro decks. Not a surprise since it’s an aggro card, and a damn good one. It just about neutered mono blue tempo when banned, which sucks. Black devotion is still fine. Walking Ballista is also a widely played card. It makes no sense to ban it because it isn’t oppressing the format. I don’t believe Copter oppressed it just by fitting into a lot of decks. Dreadhorde Arcanist shows up on a ton of lists, no ban worries. Dig Through Time ...same thing. Widely played shouldn’t equal bans. I think it was a hasty ban choice. That’s all. Saying it’s oppressive because all the aggro decks use it is like saying Supreme Verdict is oppressive because all the UWx decks use it.
January 7, 2020 2:22 p.m.
I will continue to reassert that Pioneer is not the format for this combo. There is a modern deck that already plays a copy of Walking Ballista , and Heliod, whether you combo off or not, fits into the shell already. Martyr Life wants Heliod so badly. Pioneer will be janky at best.
January 7, 2020 12:02 p.m.
Magnanimous, you are right about that. One thing that intrigues me, though, is the idea of feeding a Hedonist's Trove . Is there a more efficient card that lets me pitch stuff to my opponent’s graveyard, that can also be used as utility in an Esper control shell?
Trove is a great target for my Jace, Architect of Thought , and I get to snag something fun from opponent, too.
January 7, 2020 11:58 a.m.
Wizards wanting pioneer to be different than modern is one thing. Pioneer actually being different than modern is a whole other thing. When you introduce a competitive environment to any situation, you are going to have people looking for the most effective ways to win. That includes cheating powerful effects onto the board, playing decks with a lot of relevant redundancy, and yes, combos that are difficult to interact with and that win the game immediately. That said...I still don’t think the Heliod combo will be big enough in pioneer to warrant a ban. Will it win games? Yes. Will it long term warp the format...maybe for a time until the people testing it out realize it’s just another thing that can happen. Remember when Sanguine Bond and Exquisite Blood warped formats? Me neither...
January 7, 2020 9:27 a.m.
I think you’re dead on with modes 1 and 2 being outclassed by Drown. My thoughts with mode 3 was to hit opponent with it. Pitch a win con or throw land in the yard when they are having mana troubles. Clearly I was hoping the card could be better than it actually is.
January 6, 2020 2:16 p.m.
New Heliod is fine: 1. He lacks the support in standard for him to be viable, and will probably be a fringe deck there. Likely not selling to standard players in huge numbers.
That’s a viable play style. It shouldn’t discount a card from being playable. This one is clunkier than copycat. It’s fine.
As for Teferi, Hero of Dominaria : if you lose to him as a win con, you were already going to lose. It’s a slow, boring win con, but it has so many answers our shouldn’t really let a game get there anyway. Is it possible you just play decks that already have bad UW control matchups? I lost to storm over the weekend, when I should have had a good matchup to it. I kept a bad hand with one land just because I had Rest in Peace in my opener. I never got the second land, and my opponent stormed off turn 3. It was one of the most boring parts of my magic career. Took him like 20 minutes to get through his storm, and I didn’t lose because of not having answers available, I lost because I didn’t have available answers at the time it happened. Teferi is infinite easier to stop than storm. Just have answers.
January 6, 2020 12:43 p.m.
I ran across Dimir Charm while building my pioneer Esper control list. Anyone else feel this may be playable? The removal hits a lot of things we see in pioneer deck lists. The counter can be relevant in a few matchups. The pitch cards to the grave lets you foil some game plans and set up your opponent’s next draw.
January 6, 2020 10:52 a.m.
I concur on what you are seeing. No one in my LGS is playing Phoenix, however. I see a lot out of burn decks and a lot of black. I have two RBu controls, too. It’s punishing, and I will no lkb er even try to play mono blue devotion because of it, especially when the 4 mana red wipe is released. I am currently brewing an Esper ck tool build that look very well suited both before and after Beyond Death releases.
Personally I will not being playing the Heliod combo in pioneer. It will likely see a ban in the form of Ballista. I will play it in my modern Martyr Life, though, where it will shine.
January 5, 2020 1:22 p.m.
The Heliod and Erebos look amazing. I am not as big a fan of the others.
January 4, 2020 3:07 p.m.
I am interested in the Isolated Chapel . Unfortunately that is all on this list. If you have anymore of the UB or UW “buddy lands” I would happily make a deal for a bunch from you. If not, I’m afraid it isn’t worth your time for just the chapel. Let me know if you have anymore unlisted to sell.
January 3, 2020 9:39 a.m.
January 3, 2020 9:27 a.m.
January 2, 2020 1:28 p.m. Edited.
I will be playing new Heliod in my modern Martyr Proc deck. I already have Walking Ballista for spot removal and to shoot over my opponents’ creatures if needed. You can do the same with it in Pioneer, just with less consistency, as Martyr Proc has better tutors for both.
In Pioneer I think it can do just fine. The cards available to play a Soul Sister build are pretty bad, in comparison to the actual Soul's Attendant and Soul Warden version. I would probably run it in a GW ramp build for Pioneer. Heliod comes out on turn 2, followed by a turn 3 2/2 Walking Ballista , and a turn 4 win. The combo is open to removal at this point, so you may want to wait even later game to keep response mana open. Then you’re looking to play a game of attrition early on with value creatures like Loxodon Smiter , Fleecemane Lion , Steel Leaf Champion , etc.
I would also play the combo in any UWx control shell. Too bad Fae of Wishes is unable to grab either piece from the sideboard.
January 2, 2020 12:20 p.m. Edited.
FriendsyeaGO — heinm1989 — Zurnic — Owlus — JSims — evil_monkey — BookBurner — Gav_Cap — XxCataclysmiCxX — Taytora — SandyDufresne — KrazyCaley — Human_Rogue_21 — Ptotherice — Kravian — MTG_Player — zombiesocket — jessicarose — Fleetfiend — Draygo — simplepain — ijuanda — bml1359 — lemjac40 — Long_Con — mrbloo1848 — ChiefBell — Kirtanian — aebersole10 — Krayhaft — Steve.Corell — chanslaf314 — Ashy — Kamotz — dcarvill — StonRighMeow — Gatecrashed — BalthasarGerard — hollandboys
SCORE: 1 | 5 VIEWS
SCORE: 1 | 41 VIEWS
|Playing since||Limited Edition Alpha|
|Avg. deck rating||8.14|
|Favorite formats||Commander / EDH, Modern, Pioneer|
|Good Card Suggestions||28|
|Last activity||1 day|