|Commander / EDH||Legal|
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|Champions of Kamigawa||Rare|
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Kumano, Master Yamabushi
Legendary Creature — Human Shaman
(1)(Red): Kumano, Master Yamabushi deals 1 damage to target creature or player.
If a creature dealt damage by Kumano this turn would be put into a graveyard, remove it from the game instead.
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Kumano, Master Yamabushi Discussion
1 month ago
Stop rushing me guys...
- The Locust God - T2.5: We already have a working infinite mana deck made by Gigi. The fact that it needs colored mana limits the deck's options a bit, and makes it a little Glass-Cannon-y. The token it makes are also good fodder for Skullclamp to dig for your combo. T2.5 is a good place.
- The Scorpion God - T3 - Also an infinite mana game, but needs a bit more setup and is in weaker colors. The fact that he can pick off utility creatures and draw you cards while you set gives him decent utility. Middle of the road in T3.
- The Scarab God - T3 - Not terribly useful, but is a solid Nooze commander, and is a good finisher if anyone can think up any infinite Zombie combos. Lower end of T3.
- Djeru the Purified - T4 or 5 - Not sure yet. As merrowMania pointed out, he's a guarantied Karn or Ugin, but that's still a 5 mana tutor in the command zone that doesn't get the PW out right away. He's also in the weakest solo color identity. I feel this is more T5, but I'll leave it up to you guys.
- Unesh, Criosphinx Sovereign - T4 - Draws you cards, changelings and blink effects might round this out a little, and he draws your deck if you go infinite with a sac outlet. Mono-blue is also strong enough to support a mediocre commander.
- Razaketh, the Foulblooded - T1.5 - I made a deck that wins on turns 3 to 4. Need I say more?
- Neheb, the Eternal - T3 - I've already seen some decent decklists that turn stuff like Heartless Hidetsugu into massive red X spells. At the very least his Afflict ability means he's a 3 mana ramp spell in the command zone. Seems good for T3. (viperfang4, If you wan't this to go higher you'll have to make a decklist. Krenko, Kiki, and Zada are already good combo decks, and none of them have been able to break out of T3 because of the weaknesses of mono-Red.)
- Fixed Grenzo link
- If no one objects, I'm going to add the Rishkar list I made to T3. It came out really nicely I think, and somehow I doubt anyone else is going to brew a Rishkar list anytime soon.
- Also adding my Lyzolda, the Blood Witch, as I don't think it's likely that anyone else is building her. (There are several high rated Lyzolda decks on T/O, but none are cEDH builds.)
- I'm going to add this deck I found as our Glissa, the Traitor deck:
Commander / EDH*
SCORE: 79 | 48 COMMENTS | 18404 VIEWS | IN 48 FOLDERS
I don't think it's 100% optimized, but it's very close, and it has a lovely primer that goes over the fundamentals of Stax. (Also, having a Glissa list by somebody named Perfect_Phyrexia is to flavorful to pass up.)
- Added Gigi's Locust God list. Masterful also posted a list that was a good contender, but I felt it was a little too muddled in extra win conditions, and Gigi's seemed more straightforward.
- My Razaketh deck is about as perfect as I can make it. I can add it to the deckles section, but I'd like to get people's approval first. I know other people are trying this one, and as NarejED pointed out a while back, it's unhealthy for this project if the people who run it are overrepresented in its resources.
- Added DiabolicEsper's Scorpion God list.
- Added Gigi's more suped up Kozilek, Butcher of Truth list. He had the primer ready to go and everything. Im surprised he didn't put this up sooner.
- Added HezTheGod's Braids list.
Not sure if anyone's noticed (Nvrm, you noticed), but I added a TierBanned decklists section. I thought it would be neat to be able to show people what the banned commanders' decks might look like if we were allowed to play them. So far it only contains thegigibeast's Griselbrand storm list and Lilbrudder's old Leovold list, but anyone who wants to make a hypothetical decklist is welcome to.
The only rule is you can't use other banned cards in the 99, because that would be unrealistic compared to the other decklists in the description. The point is to see how the banned commanders would stack up as cEDH commanders, not how broken it's possible make the format with no banlist. There isn't much competition on cEDH decklists for banned commanders, so if you think you can make a good one then have at it. (Dibs on Rofellos.)
I've also added a new tier. As I'm sure you're all aware, we're going to be getting a new Un-set soon, Unstable. In preparation for the momentous occasion, I have added TierInsanity to the list! It fits right below TierBanned, so the layout of the list won't be affected. Since they are not legal in commander Un-legendary decklists can also fit in the TierBanned section. I will be adding lists for them as soon as I find people crazy enough to make them. (I found a funny Richard Garfield, Ph.D. deck floating around this site already, but I'd be happy with a new submission that actually tries to optimize the deck. Interestingly, an optimized Richard seems like it would actually need to play a lot of expensive cards, since you need to make it to 5 mana before you can use his ability.)
Also, a few pieces useful information on the un-commanders you should use if you're going to make a decklist:
- Frankie Peanuts cannot keep a player from conceding or force them to concede. Players can concede an any time, and this is outside of all game rules, Un or otherwise. Maro has specified this. Multiple times.
- Frankie Peanuts also does not force a player to reveal hidden information, or use hidden information to abide by the answer given. Source
- Richard Garfield can't let you cast cards as if they were cards that are banned in commander. Source
- For now at least, lets say that all of the cards in the 99 have to be black border. It would be too confusing otherwise.
Ohthenoises pointed out in comment that it might be worthwhile to consolidate a list of every commander that can be used to win the game as a outlet for infinite mana. I went through the list and here are the results:
- Thrasios, Triton Hero (colorless)
- Prossh, Skyraider of Kher (With sac outlet)
- General Tazri (With sac outlet)
- Tasigur, the Golden Fang
- Sidisi, Undead Vizier
- Breya, Etherium Shaper
- Sidisi, Brood Tyrant (With sac outlet)
- Sliver Queen (colorless)
- Oona, Queen of the Fae (colorless)
- Nin, the Pain Artist (colorless)
- Marath, Will of the Wild
- Grenzo, Dungeon Warden (colorless)
- Ghave, Guru of Spores
- Derevi, Empyrial Tactician (With sac outlet)
- Xiahou Dun, the One-Eyed (Needs a finishing black spell to function) (Hard to interact with)
- Sakashima the Impostor (Needs a creature to copy with an ETB, LTB, or cast trigger to function)
- Oloro, Ageless Ascetic (Needs infinite life gain triggers to function)
- Kefnet the Mindful
- Kamahl, Fist of Krosa (Needs Creatures to function)
- Jazal Goldmane (Needs Creatures to function)
- Geth, Lord of the Vault (Needs an artifact or creature in each opponent's graveyards to function)
- Ezuri, Renegade Leader (Needs Elves to function)
- Depala, Pilot Exemplar
- Daxos the Returned (Needs Haste or grave storm to win same turn)
- Arcanis the Omnipotent (Needs Haste to function)
- The Scorpion God (Needs specific creatures)
- Reaper King (With sac outlet)
- Omnath, Locus of Rage (With sac outlet)
- Ambassador Laquatus (colorless)
- Bosh, Iron Golem
- Heliod, God of the Sun (Needs haste to win same turn)
- Ishkanah, Grafwidow
- Kaseto, Orochi Archmage (Only kills one player a turn)
- Lyzolda, the Blood Witch
- Nemata, Grove Guardian (needs Haste to win same turn)
- Niv-Mizzet, Dracogenius
- Nylea, God of the Hunt (Needs Creatures to function)
- Oketra the True (Needs haste to win same turn)
- Rhonas the Indomitable (Needs Creatures to function)
- Ulasht, the Hate Seed
- Verdeloth the Ancient (Colorless) (Needs Haste to win same turn)
- Gonti, Lord of Luxury (With sac outlet)
- Maga, Traitor to Mortals (With sac outlet) (partly colorless)
- Pia and Kiran Nalaar (With sac outlet)
- Vela the Night-Clad (With sac outlet)
- Yosei, the Morning Star (With sac outlet)
- Unesh, Criosphinx Sovereign (With sac outlet)
- Kumano, Master Yamabushi
- Latulla, Keldon Overseer (Only kills one player a turn) (Needs cards in hand to function)
- Obzedat, Ghost Council (With sac outlet)
- Ghost Council of Orzhova (With sac outlet)
Interesting things to note about the results here:
There are far more of them than I expected in the lower tiers, specifically T4. I'm probably going to make some adjustments based on this.
"With a sac outlet" just means some way to remove the commander so you can recast it. Food Chain counts.
"Colorless" commanders mean you only need an unlimited amount of colorless mana to win. This is always going to be an edge for that commander, since making infinite colorless mana is possible in every color identity, and is a lower barrier to entry.
A lot of the commanders in the upper tiers have more effecient strategies that make infinite mana game plans unnecessary. For instance, it doesn't really matter that infinite mana wins you the game with Sidisi, Undead Vizier.
Based on evaluating commanders off of infinite mana gamelans, and my review of the lower tiers, I've decided to make some general upkeep adjustments to the lower tiers.
Melira, Sylvok Outcast, Moved to T4: She has a combo that blows up all non-creature permanents and is tutorable in her color. Not great, but better than useless.
Sakiko, Mother of Summer Moved to T4: That's a lot of ramp. I'm sure there are some green shenanigans that can capitalize on that. CMC 6 is a little hefty for the effect, but she's not uncastable.
Triad of Fates, Moved to T4: There's actually a surprising amount of ways to speed up this ability, from Thousand-Year Elixir to Illusionist's Bracers and Oblivion Stone to Eye of Doom. With a black/white color identity it's reasonable to have enough tutors to se them every game, and then you have a draw engine / creature removal option that can help you dig for combos. Not the greatest, but I think T4 is a better fit.
Obzedat, Ghost Council and Ghost Council of Orzhova, Both moved to T4: I'm a bit hesitant on these guys, since a while back I vehemently argued that they should stay right where they are, but if you look at them from an infinite mana perspective, and not as incremental life drain engines, then they suddenly become a lot less janky. They have a lot of hoops to jump through, needing both infinite colored mana AND a sacrifice outlet to remove themselves, but seeing as the best infinite mana combos in Black/White tend to use sac outlets already, it's probably enough to bump these two to T4.
Kumano, Master Yamabushi, Possible move to T4: Not sure on this one. On one hand, infinite mana is a guaranteed win. On the other, few combos in mono-Red, almost 0 tutors, and he's completely useless outside of the combo. Could be T4? Maybe? Tell me what you think guys.
Ambassador Laquatus, Moved to T3: Blue is one of the best infinite mana colors right now, with Basalt/Rings, Dramatic/Scepter, and Pili/Architect all being searchable by artifact tutors. Laquatus was in T4 mostly for being looked at as "Oona without black," but I think he's probably the best infinite mana commander in mono-Blue, and deserves a spot in T3.
Erebos, God of the Dead, Moved to T3: People have been clamoring for it. and while I still haven't seen a decklist that's cEDH worthy, I can't deny that refilling your hand from the command zone is good enough for T3
Ghoulcaller Gisa, Moved to T3: She's a competent Stax commander, and mono-black has good enough ramp to offset her 5 CMC.
Ishkanah, Grafwidow, Moved to T3. A G/B infinite mana sink is nothing to scoff at. I think we put her in T4 originally as a way to denote she was worse than other options of the same deck, like Tasigur. But now that that archetype has branched out into multiple decks due to Thrasios gabbing the top spot, it's a little unrealistic to act like only one commander can represent the infinite mana plan. Not having blue definitely hurts her, but G/B is a solid color identity, and the fact that she herself is a piece in Nim Deathmantle gives her a leg up as well.
Vela the Night-Clad, Moved to T3: Vela has always been a weird fringe deck that people don't know what to do with. The problem is mostly that her abilities seem contradictory. Do you want to focus on attacking with creatures, or do you want to make creatures leave play? It's a bit murky what strategy fits her best, but now that I've taken a look at her from an infinite mana combo, I think her best strategy is probably to look for an infinite mana combo with a sac outlet, and infinite LTB combo (Deadeye combo probs), or bomb with Blade of Selves/Rite of Replication. (Not to mention, a certain card that may or may not be coming out next set forms a 2 card combo with her.)
Lyzolda, the Blood Witch, Moved to T3: I already made a decklist on this. Infinite mana is a guarantied win.
- Jazal Goldmane Moved to T4: I defended Jazal for quite some time, as his unusual tiny creature aggro strategy can often deal 40 damage to a player on turn 4 or 5. However, with the increasing power level that recent card printings have pushed onto tiers 1 through 3, it's becoming quite clear that the ability to take out just one player quickly is better relegated to T4, as most voltron commanders are already.
The leaked commanders' placements so far. Not linking them, you can look them up if you want to.
- Ur-Dragon - T5
- Ramos - T2.5 maybe 3
- O-Kagachi - T4
- Wasitora - T4 maybe 3
- Taigam - T3 maybe 2.5 (I think we've been going about this guy the wrong way so far. Everyone's been building storm, but rebound doesn't really help storm. Something interesting I just came across is the idea of using him for turns instead. Rebound makes every Time Warp into a Time Stretch instead. Add in a little spell recursion and you could easily take 10+ turns in row. Tamiyo, the Moon Sage's ult would then turn that into infinite turns.
- Mynea Frian, Dark Apostle - T5
- Kopala, Warden of Waves - T4
- Admiral Beckett Brass - T4 maybe 3
- Gishark, Sun's Avatar - T5 maybe 4
- Tiehana, Voice of Thunder - T?
- Captain Lannery Storm - T5
1 month ago
Kumano, Master Yamabushi, Obsidian Fireheart, Shivan Hellkite,Jinxed Choker Comet Storm, Ravaging Blaze, and Volcanic Geyser could enable wins off of Braids of Fire. With a few more things to do with mana at instant speed, braids could be savage.
Planeswalker's Fury could also be good
2 months ago
Was thinking about Mana Flare, but as u said, it help my opponents too. But if I ever get one, Ill definetly try it out to pump my mana and end the game in one turn.
Actually, if I take a closer look, it might work better than damage doubler (cheaper and giving 1 more damage with R(X) burns), so I might really consider cuting one and fit it in!
Thanks for suggestions and upvote Love-in-Theory
4 months ago
I feel like Tajuru Preserver, Loaming Shaman, Vexing Shusher are very specific for the main deck and should probably be used in the sideboard against mill, stax, and counters. I also think that Kumano, Master Yamabushi is a drain on your mana that doesnt fit with the fast pace. Eternal Witness is mostly better suited for decks playing more spells and 3 mana for a 2/1 is weak compared to the other creatures.
With that being said, red decks run Lightning Bolt almost as an auto-include. Burning-Tree Emissary fits persectly with your ramp and I feel like having some more cheaper creatures would be great for early game. Shaman also is not the cheapest tribe, so while you do have Bosk Banneret, I feel like Urza's Incubator would do very well. Rakka Mar adds a faster aspect for the deck, and Signal the Clans is always some fun. Hope this helps! I could see this struggling with turbo fog, and if you run into board wipes you're not gonna have a fun time.
As for me, I'm very excited for GotG2, but more so for the Pirates of the Caribbean 5! I love those movies so much. My life has been all right, there isn't too much news from up in Maine. You?
4 months ago
Really good decks start out with a solid idea and evolve over time and play testing. Here's some ideas based on my experience.
Cards to consider (in no particular order):
Ugin's Nexus to keep people from taking extra turns.
Goblin Welder for artifact recursion. Even if they counter something like the Nexus or Contagion Engine.
Jester's Cap is great at ripping combo decks apart by removing key components. It also works well with the Goblin Welder.
Bonehoard is better than Nightmare Lash in multi-player games as it sees everyone's graveyard.
Grafted Exoskeleton really should be in this deck to help push the infect theme and make any creature a significant threat.
Infiltration Lens, for the card drawing. The defender chooses to either take the damage or allow you to draw two cards.
Skithiryx, the Blight Dragon also should be in this list.
Kumano, Master Yamabushi as an alternate win conditions via direct damage. With the Grafted Exoskeleton it's a short game.
Fallen Ferromancer, Frostwielder, Spikeshot Goblin, or Prodigal Pyromancer to get around those pillow fort opponents.
Kaervek the Merciless to make it hurt for those combo players.
Virulent Swipe as a better creature pump spell. The rebound means you get twice the effect out of one card.
World at War is another extra combat phase card. Also rebounds.
War Elemental can get huge. When paired with a Surestrike Trident it becomes a quick way to kill a player each turn.
Loxodon Warhammer for tample and life gain. Any creature in the deck is better with a Warhammer. Spikeshot Goblin is really fun with the Warhammer.
Relic Putrescence could be fun on someone's mana artifact.
Cards to consider cutting from the list:
Anthem of Rakdos deals too much damage to you. Per Gatherer: "The first ability triggers once for each creature you attack with. If you attack with three creatures, for example, theyll each get +2/+0 and youll be dealt 3 damage." Horrible when you have multiple combat phases per turn.Talisman of Indulgence should be a Rakdos Signet so you don't take as much damage.
Lashwrithe is too conditional on your lands in play.
Nightmare Lash same problems Lashwrithe.
Thunderscape Familiar and Nightscape Familiar don't promote your theme and are not strong enough on their own to be worth having on the field. If you really need the mana reduction, you're better off with more land cards.
Scorchwalker is a mediocre creature and a crappy pump spell. There are too many better creatures.
These cards are all single creature pumps that don't help you at all if an opponent plays a Wrath of God or similar effect. One-shots are nice against a single opponent, but not in multiplayer.
Haze of Rage, Reckless Charge, Tormenting Voice, Balduvian Rage, Brute Force, Enrage, Reckless Spite.
The X mana pump spells are really bad because of the mana choices that playing them forces on you each turn. Leave mana open for the X pump spell or play another card? Not worth it.
May be worth cutting unless you don't have a better option:
Inquisitor's Flail is a maybe. This one is kinda a tough choice. I would cut it for a better card but leave it in if your budget or collection doesn't have another option.
Bonesplitter is another mediocre card that's only good if there isn't a better option.
Swiftfoot Boots and Lightning Greaves The haste is nice but they are really only good against spot removal. I would leave these in until you need to cut them to make room for better cards.
Obviously, temper these suggestions with your collection and budget. Feel free to check out my decks and let me know what you think of the ideas.
4 months ago
Ah, I forgot about the Kiki-Jiki, Mirror Breaker interactions with Sakura-Tribe Elder. I agree that Rampant Growth may be the better card to cut with Kiki-Jiki in mind.
Yes, Ulamog, the Infinite Gyre will shuffle the entire library back into the deck. And I use him for that same purpose too.
But the Loaming Shaman is a 3/2 that sticks on the battlefield after shuffling the graveyard back in. It also interacts well with Kiki-Jiki since it isn't legendary. But I do see why it may not fit into your playstyle or deck concepts.
Oh Deadeye Navigator.....
Ok, this is more of a metagame choice than a card choice. Since there are great articles on the issue, please look over:
(Sorry, still have not gotten links to work for me in comments.)
So, short version. A lot of people are looking to get Deadeye Navigator on the banned list because he is TOO combo enabling and kinda broken in all of the wrong ways.
Once he hits the table, most groups are going to immediately assign you as the biggest threat at the table. It stops being fun when you keep getting knocked out of games because everyone works against you.So, if your play group is ok with using/abusing the Navigator, then feel free. He does combo well with a lot of the cards you have. Just keep in mind that the Navigator also ends up warping decks to maximize/abuse the ETB triggers he can spawn.
If you look at my Brago flicker deck Did you see that? you'll see that the Navigator is absent. That card would be great in that deck. But it would paint a bigger target on me than I want. So, as a metagame choice, I didn't use it.
I recommended Temur Sabertooth based on these ideas. Yes, you have to recast the bounced creature. But the Sabertooth doesn't paint a giant "kick me" sign on your back.
You still have the option of blocking then bouncing. The smaller creatures like Eternal Witness, Mystic Snake, and Wood Elves aren't that bad to recast. Also, the indestructible aspect lets you look at Blasphemous Act as a board wipe to replace the All Is Dust.
Glad that you like the Kumano, Master Yamabushi. I've had a few games where people have locked down the table with either Ensnaring Bridge or a Isochron Scepter with Fog. I've won games just on dumping as much mana as possible into his ability to ping players directly. And it is nice exiling pesky creatures.
So, I started looking back over your list. Here are some simple but effective ideas:
Elvish Visionary for the card draw. Also works with nicely with Kiki-Jiki.
Conquering Manticore as an additional flying 5/5 version of Zealous Conscripts. Having another flyer doesn't hurt.
Acidic Slime could give you an option to deal with things like an opposing Maze of Ith. I think this may be the better option.
Mulldrifter nets you two cards for 3 mana.
If you feel like it, take a look over some of my decks and let me know what you think.
4 months ago
First of all thank you very much for your advice. I appreciate it!
I'm not sure if I need Loaming Shaman in long games, because this deck is very strong in lategame and has plenty of options then. And Ulamog, the Infinite Gyre helps keeping my library full. But I understand your point of view and getting to choose what cards to reshuffle is definitely interesting. I will keep thinking about this option :)
I'm sorry, but I dont like Temur Sabertooth very much. Bouncing creatures and playing them again costs so much mana and speed. But what do you think about Deadeye Navigator? I don't have to pay the mana cost again and would benefit immediately. The downside is: I can only pair one creature.
Maybe I will change like this:
- -1 All Is Dust
- -1 Rampant Growth
- +1 Deadeye Navigator
- +1 X
Thank you for commenting!
4 months ago
I think Loaming Shaman would give you some graveyard recursion what wouldn't hurt. It gives you an option for the long games.
Temur Sabertooth would give you a way to bounce your ETB creatures like Mystic Snake and Eternal Witness. And it has good synergy with the Frontier Siege
Kumano, Master Yamabushi has always been good to me. Gives me a solid beatstick with exile capability. Just ping a creature for 1 damage and it gets exiled instead of hitting the graveyard.
I saw your note about asking if there was enough, too little, or too much mana ramp.
I keep thinking that the Sakura-Tribe Elder, while a really good card, may be the "too much" mana ramp card that doesn't fit right. You aren't using any "whenever a creature dies" triggers to get more out of him than a basic land and a chump blocker. The Wood Elves can fetch up any of the Forest shock lands for color fixing.
So I would make these changes to add a little more synergy:
-1 Sakura-Tribe Elder
-1 Mind's Dilation
-1 All Is Dust
+1 Loaming Shaman
+1 Temur Sabertooth
+1 Kumano, Master Yamabushi
Please don't think that it was easy for me to make any really useful recommendations. You have a great deck and I think you've done a awesome job.