All creatures get -4/-4 until end of turn.
|Have (2)||metalmagic , gildan_bladeborn|
|Want (2)||Darui , Zebo|
Printings View all
|Magic Game Night (GNT)||Rare|
|Commander Anthology 2018 (CM2)||Rare|
|Commander 2016 (C16)||Rare|
|Magic Origins (ORI)||Rare|
|Promo Set (000)||Rare|
Combos Browse all
|Commander / EDH||Legal|
Latest Decks as Commander
1 month ago
Trying to solve the format:
Now, why Yidris? Yes, Atraxa, Praetors' Voice is in the right colors, however it is much more expensive to switch from these decklists in that way. Neither Tymna nor Thrasios is in the Atraxa Precon (As seen on Atraxa Precon (Reference)), and Yidris has Thrasios, Triton Hero (Yidris Precon), and when it comes down to it, most importantly are the sultai colors of the pairing, so the manabase isn't incredibly difficult to swap, etc.
Now down to the deck's evolution. While starting with Yidris for it's value is smart, moving quickly over to change out for a Thrasios, Triton Hero/Vial Smasher the Fierce once you make a few dollars, adding in the main engines that drive this archetype. Thassa's Oracle isn't incredibly expensive, however Demonic Consultation/Tainted Pact are certainly not cheap anymore. This means that the best wincons are going to be more controling, and I recommend moving to Vial Smasher as a main wincon.
Keen Sense and Curiosity effects are honestly not a huge investment, and can add a lot of consistency and ability to turn the list into a Curious Control style deck very fast. That can be cheap switches, like Notion Thief, Dig Through Time, and Treasure Cruise to add additional damage and value throughout the game, and just adding some extra cheap countermagic and mana dorks to get them out early and the deck looks really efficient.
Remember, this list already has good synergies for this strategy. Obviously ramp + Thrasios is busted, that's why Thrasios, Triton Hero is so expensive. Just tossing in Vial Smasher as a backup wincon to any number of decent budget threats, some cheap board wipes (think Languish) and some effective removal and the list hits really hard as a strong control deck, easily able to win some games for that cash prize. Being a strongly upgradeable deck, one that gets incredibly powerful on a budget if you have the precon, and also being great out of the box is why this strategy is so good.
Remember for those that wanted Atraxa, or the 5c Dragon deck and wanted to upgrade those to the higher tiers for their manabase, they have to cut tons of dragon and +1/+1 synergies over time, while this deck ran cards like Windfall and Decimate and Burgeoning and signets, Fellwar Stone, Commander's Sphere, etc. Our deck just ran the good cards irrespective of strategy, letting us change out individual cards rather than the whole deck.
Now upgrading the manabase, individual cards, turning more into a curious control deck, perfectly balance in the competitive scenes, hopefully smoking the competition in the early-mid tiers of this format, moving to the Oracle/Consult lines, and tuning will get you far, but make sure you know when enough is enough, as this plateaus with enough money pretty fast, don't go out of your way to get shocks and even mid budget cards (5+ dollars or maybe even less) that can't be used for the Tymna the Weaver side of things. Start looking to upgrade the ramp, interaction, etc. and look to save up store credit to get Tymna the Weaver.
Perhaps prepare by getting manabase that works for both, think fetches at a certain point where either decklist has a use for it, as you upgrade to the best deck of the format, this will be a budgeted version obviously, but even a City of Brass is a great card that just does work for either deck. Getting cheap enablers like Avacyn's Pilgrim, Drannith Magistrate, Aven Mindcensor to replace the Keen Sense style effects from Vial Smasher aren't too expensive, so make sure you are ready to swap cards as you swap commanders. Now work on a bit of manabase fixing and the deck is really ready.
The decklists below look to show where to take the Vial Smasher and Tymna variants on a budget, both based off of some of the cards it would have been expected to have gotten! I personally went for the Dramatic Reversal/Isochron Scepter plan first while testing, as it wasn't overly expensive, and adding in a ton of dorks and rocks for the list was both cheaper than many people might expect, and really really useful when wanting to both have a strong lategame (Thrasios is busted) and also allows for the backup wincon backdooring Thrasios into a Jace/Oracle win!
Commander / EDH
2 VIEWS | IN 1 FOLDER
Taking the above decklist, refining it for Tymna the Weaver and reposting a similar list and we have the following below:
Commander / EDH
0 VIEWS | IN 1 FOLDER
Now, not only are both of these good budget cEDH decks, but they are specifically in the mindset of this format, being the optimal upgrade path to a cEDH list from this mindset, and being the most competitive upgrade path possible, hopefully dominating the format.
Now obviously some people will enjoy the Iso-Rev combo, may move to Power Artifact style stuff after a few hundred wins, whatever floats your boat. I already own duals from store credit in EDH games I run cEDH decks in sanctioned by the store, so it is possible, just depending on the length of the season. Again, my store has a system where each player pays 5 dollars, and gets a 5 dollar coin, they can play in one of two types of pods, one where each player keeps the coin, or the other where people give it to the winner. Under this system, with a $20 allowance per win, assuming 1 win per week you get to build up these lists in roughly 8 weeks based on my estimates.
Make sure to use heavily played cards, discount codes, etc. to get it done even faster! Also, look into other upgrade paths to solve this format, while I tested every list and saw what was closest to the top tier, there may be much more efficient lists early on, so try to get a system to beat this one!
Thank you RNR_Gaming for this challenge, it was super fun to try to solve, and I look forward to perhaps testing my theory in person and crushing everyone xD
1 month ago
1 month ago
there's a lot of cards out there that destroy all enchantments in one swoop. Since this looks to me like a slow board build, you might as well be playing lots of counterspells and creature removal to hold off opposing plays while you steadily drop shrines. Also I would remove the White and Green shrines from your Mainboard and focus on Red, Blue and Black ones. Red damages your enemy so you can win, Black does that and disrupts his hand by making him discard, Blue keeps your hand fresh and searches for answers. Also, Mirror Gallery can compensate your legendary handicap.
You need a stronger and more consistent mana base. Removing 2 colors will help you a lot. Dual lands, check lands, fetch lands and shock lands will do you wonders. Chromatic Sphere or Chromatic Star will help fill the gaps while refunding themselves instead of Pentad Prism.
I understand this isn't a deck that's meant to be a tournament winner, but mostly to play on multiplayer with friends, but still, there's improvements to be made here that would make your build more frightning to others and fun for you. Hope I helped :)
2 months ago
No, Damnation is a stretch in its omnicidal globalism. usually leaves some sort of out, from Extinction Event only affecting half the casting costs in the game, to Languish not affecting anything large enough. But it's not a bad card at all.
3 months ago
I'll share my experience with you. I tried a competitive UB mill in Pioneer for a while, but it was far too slow. There are not many great mill cards in Pioneer. So, I changed my build to combo-based with 4 Fraying Sanity and 4 Traumatize. And it started to work.
I think you oughta try and see for yourself. Because, let's be frank Mind Sculpt is pretty meh. And the 0/4 creatures to stop aggro don't always do the job. The only real good card is Thief of Sanity and even him is too vulnerable. The opponent won't waste removal on a wall if he can wait to target the Thief.
My best bet is that the best version of this deck is focused on combo and a possible alternate wincon with a planeswalker or a manland. Think of all the slots you'll free if you abandon the non-combo mill cards and how much you'll gain by adding cards like Cry of the Carnarium, Languish, etc.
3 months ago
I've been absent from the topic for a while, I find it best to let the thoughts at the time of writing settle down and then revisit with a fresh mind.
Gidgetimer First of all I don't agree about white's lack of card draw in the Commander format is a content creator conjured issue. Content creators are just a very broad place I can refer to as a common platform where people share their beliefs. And I wanted to not only resort to the anecdotal experiences of me and my play group. Although for reference, most players in my play group agrees that white is the weakest singular color in Commander and one of those reasons is lack of card draw.
It may be a slight miscommunication but the thread could easily be about card advantage and not specifically card draw. I've made several of the suggestions in the OP not be direct card draw but rather an ability to access more card resources (like through the graveyard). So feel free to post ideas about mechanics that enables card advantage but not strictly through card draw.
This got rather lengthy Show
One of the major problems I find in white's card advantage pool is that white doesn't use many mechanics that effectively enables alternative card advantages. I mentioned they don't do draw-discard, they don't self-mill, they don't discard their own hand or in pretty much any capacity put their own cards into other zones other than the battlefield. From the battlefield they may put cards back into their hand if they die or self-bounce or flicker. They do have a selection of cards that resurrects permanents from the graveyard. However in recent times this has mainly been reduced to target low CMC permanents and their unconditional resurrections costs 4+ CMC, first of all that hardly cheats the mana cost and often it's a 1-for-1 trade, so no card advantage and no inherent mana value. White usually has to hard cast their big stuff to put them on the field and THEN it has to die and THEN they can use their recursion effects to get mana value. It's very clunky.
You point to the fact that white likes to equalize the board, mostly through board wipes. Although black seems to do the job just as well or better with Toxic Deluge, Mutilate, Languish, Black Sun's Zenith, Killing Wave, or Damnation. Most of these working around indestructible which can be a big factor if the opponent run cards like Heroic Intervention or one of the variants.
Red has cards like Blasphemous Act or Chain Reaction that works as damage board wipes. Blasphemous Act might even be considered better than white board wipes due to the mana reduction but generally white is better than red at wiping the board.
Green is kinda at a loss because their color doesn't really do board wipes and usually just resorts to taking out problems with Fight or the occasional Whirlwind, Hurricane, or the odd Ezuri's Predation. Green usually "fixes" the problem by applying enough pressure through their own creatures to require board wipes.
Blue has gained a lot of soft board wipes like Inundate, Evacuation, River's Rebuke and the all time favorite Cyclonic Rift. While not a final removal choice, the tempo and flexibility it provides can be more than enough for blue to pull ahead or win.
And after a board wipe, unless the white player has been planning or specifically played up to a board wipe, they lose a lot of resources themselves to a board wipe. But where other colors have access to good and fast card draw or equivalent, white is kinda stuck with the cards they have. They have a harder time rebuilding.
I wont go into the topic of mass land destruction, for one because of the social aspect of Commander and secondly because WotC haven't printed a new white mass LD spell since the early phases of the game - a point where the does and don'ts of the game was not quite established (looking especially at you Time Walk). There's one exception being Fall of the Thran which may just be a callback to the Urza block, and it has a soft-remedy. Cards that blows everything sky high usually includes "Nonland permanents" or in the cases of Elspeth Tirel and Scourglass exclude lands from their destruction.
This kinda sums up my point:
Overall I don't see white always coming out of a board wipe having equalized the card access/advantage. And even if that was true it reads like white is always behind up until the point that they equalize. That doesn't seem like a good position to be in.
3 months ago
First things first, good choice! The Scarab God is an extremely fun and powerful commander, so I believe you're gonna do well in the tournament. Your decklist seems pretty solid, especially considering the budget restrictions. A couple of general advices would be to include as much mana ramp as possible as your commander's ability is very mana intensive, and as many instants as you can considering you can use the Scarab's ability at any time. This way, you'll be able to play a very interactive game. Here are a few specific considerations:
I'm not a huge fan of Bontu's Last Reckoning. I don't know if you have tested it enough, but having to basically skip two turns to have the board cleared is a terrible deal. If the better boardwipes are out of budget, you can consider Crux of Fate, Decree of Pain, Languish and Life's Finale (which has nice synergy with your commander, although it costs a bit too much mana).
Walk the Plank is also a little suboptimal, as it's sorcery speed (which is a nonbo with your commander). There are plenty of instant speed removal spells to choose from, like Cast Down, Dismember, Go for the Throat and Victim of Night.
I'm also not a fan of symmetrical draw effects like Howling Mine, because giving extra cards to your opponents is very dangerous. Maybe a more traditional draw spell would be more appropriate.
I think you are aware, but Yawgmoth's Bargain is unfortunately banned in our format.
Personally, I would include a slightly more prominent token subtheme to get the most value out of your commander's first ability. You can consider cards like Dread Summons (good for milling your opponents' creatures AND create some tokens), From Under the Floorboards (even when you are unable to cast it for its madness cost, three 2/2s for five mana is an ok deal) and Open the Graves.
Awaken the Erstwhile is amazing in this deck, as it fills every graveyard with -hopefully- creatures to copy as well as provide some 2/2s.
Every graveyard-based deck should have a decent number of free sacrifice outlets, and while I see you included some, I think you are still missing the best one for this kind of deck: Altar of Dementia. Apart from the amazing utility of being able to sacrifice a creature in response to an exile removal spell, it has the huge benefit of fueling your (or your opponents') graveyard for your commander. At some point during the game, depending on your board state, it can even become a win condition. Ashnod's Altar is another one I would include.
Considering your commander's ability is at instant speed, I would include Vedalken Orrery (if it's not our of budget) and Leyline of Anticipation to be able to play your spells on your opponents end steps, in case you didn't use the Scarab's ability.
Good luck for your tournament and keep updating this list!
3 months ago
Languish is probably better than Cry of the Carnarium, especially if you put a Rest in Peace in your SB. It just kills more. However, Kaya's Wrath is much better. The main reasoning is that, as this is a control build, you probably want an effective wrath.
Of course, it's obvious Cry misses a lot of the creatures you are running, but you'd always rather have a full wrath than a mediocre wrath in this style of deck. It is only one copy, after all, and the situations in which it's not helpful are mostly situations in which you are winning anyways.
I'd also like to recommend Merciless Eviction as a one-of target for Grim. Since this is a toolbox deck, you should also consider more mana efficient tutors, such as Wishclaw Talisman or possibly Scheming Symmetry. However, those cards' drawbacks are significant enough for you to have to work around them, so use them with care.
Although reading above, Dark Petition does look solid as it adds the mana you may need to immediately cast the card you want to cast. It could even tutor up a Grim Tutor or Talisman, if that is ever useful in any way.
Additionally, I like the Yorion + Pact interaction. 7 turns of value should be plenty to win the game, and you should have a good number of other preventative measures, although I can't remember them off the top of my head and I'm adding this part in the preview menu.