What do you think of Noyan Dar, Roil Shaper combo?
Commander (EDH) forum
Posted on Oct. 6, 2015, 6:30 a.m. by kengiczar
First off let me start by saying this combo does take a lot more setting up than most. It isn't one of those T1-T3 combos, it's more at home in Jeskai or 5 color control.
Here's the article for it (though it's for the standard format): http://magic.wizards.com/en/articles/archive/reconstructed/comboing-standard-2015-10-05
I like the idea of animating all of my lands with cheap spells like Preordain, Ponder, Serum Visions, Brainstorm, Visions of Beyond, Path to Exile, Swords to Plowshares, Counterspell, Dispel, Wear / Tear, and once you have four lands animated Clockspinning to get to 5 lands and infinitely increase the number of +1/+1 counters on all of your lands!
Also this card doesn't combo with Doyan but it does help you keep your lands in play: Sacred Ground
I am thinking if I am eventually wanting to be able to cast Clockspinning a bunch via this combo I should probably have Dack Fayden to help me get there and since I can ult him why not use Mind Games to gain control of every single permanent on the field? Ok so that part of it might be to much, but you can't deny that it sounds fun/evil.
Also if you do this 5 color and get to the combo you can then use Mind Peel to continually discard your opponent's hands. I'm sure there are a lot of other evil things you can do with the ascendancy in 5 color such as Jeskai Ascendancy + Kormus Bell . Urborg, Tomb of Yawgmoth and some reanimator junk for an early Elesh Norn, Grand Cenobite along with the Bell is already something a group play EDH 5 color combo deck might do anyways am I right?
asasinater13 says... #3
you can't use extra colors in commander. you have U/W to work with for noyan. I don't get how Clockspinning is a combo. it's just a card with buyback, there is no untapping your lands to make it repeatable or abusable. Mind Games is the same thing. You seem confused about both the format and the words you're using.
October 6, 2015 7:23 a.m.
All the combos he describes are only valid with Jeskai Ascendancy in play. Which means the commander can't be Noyan, it would have to be part of another deck which uses Noyan. Here is the link he mentioned which might help explain some of the things that were unclear in the post.
October 6, 2015 8:03 a.m.
Requirement 1: Noyan Dar, Roil Shaper.
Requirement 2 Jeskai Ascendancy.
Requirement 3: Lands, preferably at least 5 to actually grow your mana pool unless you have karoo lands or lands that can make more than 
worth of mana but the higher the costs of your instants the more you need.
Requirement 4: With just basics you will need 2x Island, 1x Mountain, 1x Plains and 1x any other land that makes at least 1 mana that can be used for P-walkers and Instants.
Requirement 5: To just make infinitely big lands you just need Clockspinning.
Requirement 6: To steal everything with Dack Fayden on the field you need at least one other card in hand. If Dack is not on the field and you don't have Mind Games in hand you will need 2 cards in hand aside from Clockspinning. To bounce everything with Capsize you will need to have a total of 7 lands animated that all tap for at least 1 mana and can be used to cast instants. To kill everyoen with Fireball you just need Noyan, Ascendancy, Clockspinning, and lands that can make 5 mana.
Jeskai Ascendancy says when you cast a spell you can untap all of your creatures. Noyan Dar, Roil Shaper makes your lands into creatures.
Scenario: Noyan Dar + Ascendancy on field and 5 lands animated, just some cantrips in hand. No Dack Fayden present in hand or field, no clockspinning, no Mind games.
Step 1: Cast a spell for as cheap as you can, lets say it's Ponder.
Step 2: Jeskai Ascendancy trigger goes on the stack.
Step 3: In response to the Ascendancy Trigger I tap my other 4 lands floating 
.
Step 4: I begin resolving Ascendancy trigger; I draw a card and discard a land then untap my lands.
Step 5: I begin resolving Ponder drawing into Brainstorm (Could be anything really)
Step 6: I use one of the mana in the pool to cast Brainstorm.
Step 7: Jeskai Ascendancy trigger goes on the stack in response to Brainstorm being cast.
Ste 8: In resposne to teh Jeskai Ascendancy trigger I tap my 5 untapped lands putting 5 more mana into my pool which is now sitting at 
mana.
Step 9: Jeskai Ascendancy begins to resolve and in order I draw a card, discarda card, then untap my lands.
Step 10: I begin to resolve Brainstorm and draw into Omniscience, which I don't even need, and Clockspinning.
Step 11: in the pool. I cast Clockspinning, going down to 
mana in the pool, targeting one of my lands animatied with Noyan Dar, Roil Shaper.
Step 12: Jeskai Ascendancy trigger goes onto the stack because of me casting Clockspinning.
Step 13: In response to the Jeskai Ascendancy trigger I tap my 5 lands putting my mana pool back up to 
.
Step 14: I begin resolving Jeskai Ascendancy trigger; I draw a card and discard anything because I don't need it. Seriously. I Untap my lands.
step 15: Clockspinning begins to resolve. I put a +1/+1 counter on one of my lands and put Clockspinning back into my hand as part of it's resolution. (It would not go back to my hand if it was countered as spells do not resolve when countered.
Step 11: in the pool. I cast Dack Fayden if I have it and then Clockspinning, going down to 
mana in the pool, targetting one of my lands animatied with Noyan Dar, Roil Shaper to make that land have another +1/+1 counter.
Step 12: Jeskai Ascendancy trigger goes onto the stack because of me casting Clockspinning.
Step 13: In response to the Jeskai Ascendancy trigger I tap my 5 lands putting my mana pool back up to 
, notice that the pool has been growing with each iteration and I untap my lands each time.
Step 14: I begin resolving Jeskai Ascendancy trigger; I choose not to draw and discard if I alraedy have Dack Fayden otherwise I draw and Discard supposing there is already 1 other card in my hand besides Clockspinning when I start this iteration. I untap my lands. step 15: Clockspinning begins to resolve. I put a +1/+1 counter on one of my lands and put Clockspinning back into my hand again.
Step 16: Repeat Step 10.
Step 17: Repeat Step 11.
Step 18: Repeat Step 12.
step 19: Repeat Step 13.
Step 20: Repeat Step 14.
If I didn't have Dack Fayden yet I keep repeating until I get him. Once I have him the sequence changes slightly:
Setting up the big Hesit
1: Cast Clockspinning.
2: Jeskai Ascendancy trigger goes on stack.
3: Tap lands floating even more mana.
4: Begin resolving Ascendancy trigger; skip draw if you have no cards in hand. If have a card pitch it and draw. Untap lands.
5: Resolve Clockspinning putting another Loyalty Counter on Dack Fayden.
Repeat this until you can ultimate Dack Fayden and then Ult him. If you have one other card aside from Clockspinning repeat until you draw Mind Games. If you couldn't keep up the looting off of Ascendancy because you had no cards in hand then just make your lands huge and swing for lethal at somebody. If you could loot just do the cycle over and over but use Mind Games instead of Clockspinning to steal everything. Make lands big enough to kill everybody with 1 hit. Win the game.
From here on out you can just keep on casting Clockspinning until you draw into whatever you want to do like Fireball, cast Capsize until only you have board sate, or if you've gotten Dack Fayden's ultimate, the buyback spell that lets you tap down permanents which will put triggers on the stack as soon as you targe them with Dack's Emblem, thus stealing them for you.
Note that their are actually TWO triggers on Jeskai Ascendancy. The looting is optional but you will untap your lands. What this means is with 5 lands you can just cast Clockspinning over and over again netting one mana of whatever color your lands can make each time without worrying about decking yourself and without losing hand size. As mentioned before you can just win the game with Fireball much easier than these fancier methods involving Dack and Capsize if you have Clock spinning + Fireball in hand when you start making infinite mana.
October 6, 2015 8:34 a.m.
Epochalyptik says... #7
As a general rule, it's a bad idea to exclude from your description half of the engine that makes the combo work.
October 6, 2015 8:51 a.m.
Epochalyptik says... #8
You also can't play this combo in a Noyan Dar deck, and it's nowhere near good enough to build around.
October 6, 2015 8:53 a.m.
asasinater13 says... #9
yeah, what I was saying is it isn't in a noyan Dar deck, and then you don't want Jeskai Ascendancy, Noyan Dar, Roil Shaper, and Clockspinning individually at any point in the game, only as a group. and then you need to have 3 lands animated when you cast clockspinning the first time in order to start going infinite. it's a three card combo that all have to be in your 99 in colors not strong in tutoring for creatures, a third of your combo. there's just better things to run and better ways to make infinite mana with pieces that are more useful individually. yes it's a combo. it's also entirely unreliable and very hard to justify running, unless you're playing super casually and jus think it would be cool to do. in which case, It's a noncompetitive thing you could try to do.
klone13 says... #2
Capsize
October 6, 2015 7:20 a.m.