Proxies in EDH/Commander/TL
Commander (EDH) forum
Posted on June 2, 2015, 7:01 p.m. by Karns_Pyromancer
I'm curious about how different metas feel about people using proxies in decks AND why?
Examples: 1. Proxies are allowed if you can't afford the cards (e.g. Chains of Mephistopheles). 2. Proxies are allowed only if you own the cards. 3. Proxies are not allowed.
If you're comfortable with it, please share your general location or region. I'm Curtis about a potential regional influence as well.
jungmannmatt says... #3
My meta is cool with running proxies if you own the card and can readily show proof of them. No one ever asks because we all trust one another, but it's still good to be prepared.
That being said, I can't imagine playing EDH without using proxies. I have way too many ideas and interests for different decks, and cannot afford multiple copies of the EDH staples. It would really suck if my local groups weren't cool with it.
June 2, 2015 7:19 p.m.
Epochalyptik says... #4
I allow proxies if
- you are interested in testing something you don't own in order to make a decision about whether you will own it,
- you have ordered the card and haven't yet received it,
- you own at least that many copies of the card, but have them tied up in other decks (binders and collections don't count), or
- you want to proxy a deck to playtest against.
If you can't afford the cards, I sympathize with you, but I will not allow you to play proxies. If you don't own it, don't pretend to own it. Now, I'm fully aware that many players do proxy cards they never anticipate owning. I understand why they do it, and I don't begrudge them the ability to do it elsewhere. What they do in their own playgroups is their business. But I play in a competitive environment, and you can only compete with real cards. And even when I didn't play competitively, I was of the opinion that if you wanted to play a collectible card game, you had better own the cards required to play it.
There is no regional influence on this decision.
June 2, 2015 7:23 p.m. Edited.
I do not really mind if people use proxies at all, in any sense. I don't really value economics as a useful, desirable barrier to entry and therefore I personally have no problem with it being removed. I understand that other people struggle with finances though and manage to scrape together enough to build their decks so I do sympathise with that determination; just not enough to believe it should be mandatory.
June 2, 2015 7:27 p.m.
Didgeridooda says... #6
I do not like proxies at all. I do not like when people use them, or promote them.
If someone feels they must, then I will at least try a game or 2 with them to see how they are using it.
If someone owns a copy, and wants to use it in multiple decks, then I am not really upset about that.
I feel that a big part of the game is acquiring the cards, and negotiating power levels. Bringing people up to my level, and striving to reach the level of those above me.
I think something you have to do is be able to voice your opinions to your friends/group. If they do not wish to follow your guidelines, either change them, or find others to play with. Find a good situation for yourself. If you can't, work on how you approach the game.
June 2, 2015 7:38 p.m.
With my playgroup, it's usually a card by card scenario. I proxies a Damnation in my monoblack edge for a good six months, and group was cool with it because they knew I could afford one, but just hadn't found a reasonably priced one yet. On the flip side, my roommate proxies an entire EDH at one point because he was testing it out. Everyone was fine with it, with the small exception of Gaea's Cradle, a card we knew he wouldn't buy anytime in the foreseeable future.
Tl;dr case by cases based on card value and likelihood of person buying said card. Location is probably irrelevant, but Oregon.
June 2, 2015 7:47 p.m.
I'm fine with them to a point. Will I care if you proxy 1 rather expensive card because it is just way too pricey to realistically buy for yourself? Sure, might get annoyed if I get screwed over by it, but that's my problem and I usually keep my grievances to myself(especially since I don't have a static playgroup). Have a few proxies of random cards because you don't want to take apart your other deck? Totally understand that, I sure as hell don't want to have to switch cards in and out of my decks just to play and I definitely don't want to spend another 200 dollars on staple EDH cards.
If it is clear though that a good chunk of your deck is proxies and you made no effort to acquire even the moderately priced ones, I'll probably ask you to play something else. As a completionist of sorts, I rarely trade for/buy cards if they're not in the deck I'm currently working on, so naturally I go a long period of time just saving money, keeping an eye out for deals and trading with people. As a person with the self control and dedication to stick to that plan, it kind of annoys me when I see people who build several decks without ever actually completing any of them in paper.
Played one person in particular for a while who usually beat me pretty handily with a few different decks. He never made the effort to acquire any cards that were more than 20 dollars if he didn't already by chance have them, this sometimes even meant his commander was a proxy. Losing to someone with essentially no cash limit due to a proxied deck can really make me hate proxies, but I try to stay fair and not let that one person affect how I treat all proxy users.
June 2, 2015 7:56 p.m.
My playgroup has only recently talked about making proxies. Mostly for foil tokens, commons, lands, and edh generals that don't come in foil. ie Animar, Soul of Elements
You do have to invest in the game if you want to go crazy, but I have friends that just borrow decks to play variety. Have one that you put your resources into, then playtest yer friends decks the rest of the time. Most folks are really generous with trades for people just getting into the game
In Hadley, MA I got my ass kicked by a mono G that was running a Gaea's Cradle (in Chinese i think) in one of his other decks. In it's place was an Island probably. took him forever to find it. I made him prove it lol
In northern VT there are definitely ppl who run rando proxies at the shop. It's whatever... as long as it's reasonable
June 2, 2015 7:56 p.m.
I'm almost 100% ok with proxies. I only feel bad is Wizards has never seen money from you in any way. The people I play with are highly competitive. I love being able to play against the very best things they can put together. We're all undergrad students. If it weren't for proxies, we could never play EDH. Most of us are putting lots of money into living as well as other formats.
I've never really understood why people frown on proxies. Not trying to insult anyone here. I'm simply curious. Is it the aesthetics? If so, a high-quality print job can look pretty damn close to the real thing. At the very least it'll look close enough to the real thing to be easily identifiable. Is it that you see acquiring actual cards as somehow integral to the game of magic itself? That seems a bit odd to me but I guess I could see it. Still, I disagree with how restrictive that can be on the playerbase. Is it that you hate Wizards being thrown out of the loop? I find that most people who proxy have mountains of cards as is. Maybe they just can't afford that playset of fetches for their latest modern brew.
I dunno man, if you literally refuse to play with me because I don't own the physical cards in my deck, I can't help but to look down upon you. After all, I don't proxy with the intent of making more powerful decks to beat you, but rather to overcome the cost of putting that deck together. Seems awfully elitist to me. So what, if I'm paying for rent, gas, and classes while having limited income, I'm somehow less worthy to play the game than someone 5 years older than I am that's graduated and has a steady job? Please...
I believe I ought to be judged by the strength of my deck and my capabilities as a player rather than the size of my wallet. The collectible aspect of magic means very little to me.
Oh, and I'm located in Miami, FL if that makes a difference.
June 2, 2015 8 p.m. Edited.
Epochalyptik says... #11
@TheDevicer: You look down on people who don't play Magic with you because you lack the materials required to play the game?
June 2, 2015 8:09 p.m.
Didgeridooda says... #12
TheDevicer that is a very tough post to respond to.
My opinion mainly boils down to this, "Is it that you see acquiring actual cards as somehow integral to the game of magic itself?"
Another part of it is how I view people who proxy. I see the ones I have played against as overly entitled, and I do not like that mindset.
Building on a budget, and working around budget constraints is something I enjoy doing. Add to that a good understanding of the rules, and well timed plays, to find the place where I get a large amount of my enjoyment in the format.
I value deck building as much as the game, and proxies kill that for me as well.
I also have another opinion, but I think that might make people go on the attack against it. I think I will keep that one off of here.
June 2, 2015 8:10 p.m.
RoarMaster says... #13
greyninja im curious of your technique in making foil proxies.
June 2, 2015 8:11 p.m.
It is interesting WHY people put stock on owning the official game materials. Would you play chess with me if I made a board out of paper pieces?
June 2, 2015 8:13 p.m.
Didgeridooda says... #15
Oh, one other type of proxy is the alter. I am perfectly fine with those if you have the real card to the side or in a binder, and just want an overall theme or feel to the art of your deck.
I have seen this a couple times. The 2 I have seen do this had binders that held the deck, and the alters were sleeved up, and played. It was actually pretty cool, the alters were really nicely done, and you could tell there was a good amount of effort put in. That, and you could flip through the binder to make sure the cards are all there. They were.
June 2, 2015 8:14 p.m.
Didgeridooda says... #16
ChiefBell that is not at all the same thing. Chess is not a collectible game created to be traded, using rarity to have cards' frequency different then others.
Really tired right now, I hope that made sense.
June 2, 2015 8:16 p.m.
My main EDH decks do not have proxies in them (3). The others (like 6) have proxies due to cost. I don't always have or can find my copies of cards, so as long as I have one, know I have one, or have intention to buy one I will proxy. I want to play my ideas out. I do not do proxies of cards that cost probably more than 20 bucks or so. If it's cheap, buy it when you can. If it costs too much and you have no intention of buying it, do something else. It lets us play with what we have without destroying every deck and doesn't let us overpower decks for the sake of making something overpowered.
June 2, 2015 8:28 p.m.
Chess isn't really an apt comparison. Paper chess pieces don't give you an inherent advantage over people who aren't also willing to use paper chess pieces.
June 2, 2015 8:29 p.m.
My Commander playgroup allows proxies of cards we intend to acquire, and for cards/decks we wish to test before wasting money.
For example, I proxied out a Golgari Rot Farm, but not a Bayou. I can't afford a Bayou, but I can afford a Rot Farm, just have not acquired it yet.
I won't speak for all my friends, but I find it somewhat disagreeable when someone proxies out a ton of cards he never intends to acquire. However, it doesn't bother me too much because:
A) We're not exactly DCI sanctioned. We just play for fun.
B) If my friend can't afford a deck (we're all students), is he not allowed to have fun? That seems elitist.
I live near Nashville, TN, if that makes any difference.
June 2, 2015 8:41 p.m.
For good or ill, insisting that no one play with proxies is creating an artificial economic barrier to playing the game of magic. Especially in a casual setting, I think this economic barrier is ridiculous, arbitrary, and just feels icky (to use a technical term).
There are two sides to Magic: the game side and the collectible side. Too frequently, we let the collectible side interfere with the gameplay side. I don't agree with proxying an entire deck (outside of trying it out to see if it's worth the effort to build it) but I will never begrudge someone for judiciously proxying a few key cards that are difficult to attain. If my brother in law, with his six month old daughter and new house can't afford to pick up a playset of Force of Will because, like me, he's a teacher barely scraping by with all his expenses, I certainly won't judge him for those proxies. If you are on a budget, I do think it's fun to make some difficult budgetary choices, but there are some cards that you just aren't building a deck without. By all means, proxy the crap out of those cards if you're poor. Telling people "you can't play with us unless you own every card in your deck" in a non-standard format is akin, to me, to saying either:
"you can't play with us unless you can afford to drop $500 (and in many cases significantly more) to play"
OR
"Sure, you can play, but because you can't afford the same things we can, you don't get the same resource pool to build your deck with."
Either way, we are creating an economic threshold that needs to be crossed in order to join our elite club. Ultimately, the game aspect of magic should be about skill, not the breadth and depth of ones collection.
With that said: in a competitive setting (read: at a sanctioned event), there are rules to be followed and the barrier naturally exists. I don't like it, but in that world I see it and it makes sense. Playing a handful of games in the back of our local shop? What the hell, play what you want. I won't judge you for being poor, just don't be a jerk about your proxies.
June 2, 2015 8:43 p.m.
Megalomania says... #21
IMO, proxies are fine as long as you don't use them permanently. Some people tend to get irked when a guy who has a ton of proxies keeps winning the game. Especially if he is winning via cards like Chains of Mephistopheles or if people keep getting countered with Mana Drain. And in my experience, people have a hard time taking the game seriously if a lot of proxies are being played.
June 2, 2015 8:51 p.m.
Didgeridooda says... #22
I think EDH is what we are talking about though. Playset of FoW does not really come into play here.
June 2, 2015 8:52 p.m.
As far as I know, proxies don't actually make me unable to have a game of magic with you. If you want to go with an analogy, it's not like I showed up at the race track without a car. Rather, the wobbly little thing I'm driving is a kit car I built in my shed rather than an authentic version. There's really nothing stopping you from driving a few laps around the course with me other than your attitude.
C'mon man. You've just singled out one sentence from my post and tried to turn it on its head rather than make a reasoned reply. Quite frankly, I'm disappointing. I really thought you'd be better than that. Disagree with my logic behind the matter if you want, that's not an issue. Didgeridooda's comment was perfectly fine and that's respectable. Heck, the behavior between the two of us has been nothing but cordial even though a previous exchange between us prompted this thread in the first place.
June 2, 2015 8:58 p.m.
fluffybunnypants says... #24
Because EDH is actually a competitive format.... amirite?
June 2, 2015 9:02 p.m.
RoarMaster says... #25
TheDevicer yeah Epoch has been doing a fair bit of that recently :(
June 2, 2015 9:21 p.m.
Epochalyptik says... #26
@TheDevicer: I took no issue with anything else that you said; ergo, I did not address it. You're welcome to experience the game as you do and to share that experience with like-minded players. What you do is not my business, and I would not stop you from enjoying the game even if I could.
But if you say something so fundamentally senseless as "I look down on others for not sharing my views," then of course I'm going to call you on it. That much should be intuitive.
And @RoarMaster: You're welcome to point it out to me. I notice you still haven't responded to my most recent comment in the thread you're referencing. There's a basic difference between disrespecting a poorly-conceived argument and disrespecting the person who advances it. But this is not the place for this discussion.
June 2, 2015 9:24 p.m.
Good point Didgeridooda... We are talking EDH, so my FoW playset example is pretty pointless. My general feeling is the same still, though less strong (as I think there are more budget alternatives in EDH). If you're proxying judiciously and not abusing it... Print away. Especially in what is called a social format.
June 2, 2015 9:27 p.m.
Didgeridooda says... #28
saj0219 I totally agree with you on the social format layout of EDH. The fact that it is should balance this issue out. This is not an issue where one side is right, and one wrong.
The social aspect should take care of most if not all of the problems that one might have. You just have to be able to communicate what your expectations are, and be able to work with others to meet theirs. Or come to a workable compromise.
June 2, 2015 9:36 p.m.
Karns_Pyromancer says... #29
saj0219, Didgeridooda, I would argue that EDH ceased to be a 'social format' when higher level tournaments started popping up. If your playgroup still holds to the social aspect, I congratulate you. But, as Epochalyptik said, there are highly competitive groups and they do frown on proxies generally. (A lot of them are OK with you proxying a high value card for testing, but not tournaments).
Now, I do agree that there is a limit to quantity and use of proxies. Those guidelines should come from a mutual agreement between players though.
June 2, 2015 9:59 p.m.
Didgeridooda says... #30
Social, and competitive are not mutually exclusive. I was not saying that the format is casual.
June 2, 2015 10:05 p.m.
Xavier4238 says... #31
Would either of you be willing to build each one of your decks in adherence to the lowest player in your playgroup's budget?
For example, if you wished to play a 3 colour deck but the 'cheapest' player could not support the mana base for such a deck, you would have to omit some necessary lands (for example your 9 fetches and 3 shocks) that are required to make your deck run smoothly.
Additionally, some of the more expensive edh cards may have to be omitted (Mana Crypt, Mana Vault etc.) for poorer card choices.
I feel that if the more affluent players were to play like this regularly, it would cause them to be much more sympathetic towards players who don't really have a choice, and turn towards proxies as a solution. To overcome this power barrier.
June 2, 2015 10:36 p.m.
Didgeridooda says... #32
Xavier4238 I do that all the time. I also try to help the newer guys out, and give them stuff when I can.
I will not take things out of my decks, but I always have a variety of budgets with me. That way I can match power level to my opponent.
June 2, 2015 10:40 p.m.
Didgeridooda says... #33
I also offer my decks if they would like to play them, and I will play theirs if they prefer. I build on a really tight budget, and have just played for a long time. I have EDH decks from about 40 bucks (less then the value of a precon I believe), up to a decent amount.
I build with stuff I have, trades, and like 10 up to 20 bucks. I hope that gives you a view from my perspective.
June 2, 2015 10:43 p.m.
Xavier4238 says... #34
Well that is impressive indeed. I can certainly understand how you might personally dislike playing against proxies then.
However, certainly not all people do that, and to those who don't and still have a problem with proxies I ask you again: Would you be willing to play to the lowest power level at the table? If not, why not?
June 2, 2015 10:43 p.m.
NotSoLuckyLydia says... #35
I'm fine with proxies as long as they aren't being used for a tournament. (Unless we're playing powered cube, because screw buying actual power/pseudo-power) If somebody doesn't want to play magic with somebody running proxies, that's their deal. (I play in SoCal, and a lot of this is influenced by playing with broke college students and vintage players who just REALLY want somebody to play with.)
June 2, 2015 10:46 p.m.
NoPantsParade says... #36
I read about half of the responses since I'm getting a little tired so it might have been stated, but ChiefBell, I believe it's due to the idea of "If I have to buy X cards for Y amount, then the other person should have to as well." I don't think it'd be fair for someone putting a lot of money into a deck when someone could just proxy up a deck that's of equivalent value for little to no cost, unless he or she intends to buy the deck. Personally I wouldn't want to put, say $200 of hard-earned money, into an EDH deck when the person across from me can just print out a stupidly powerful deck they have no intention ever buying, containing stuff like Gaea's Cradle and The Tabernacle at Pendrell Vale. I'm probably wrong, but I'm half-asleep right now.
My group doesn't allow proxies at all, unless you're testing the card out. I don't think location is relevant here, either.
June 2, 2015 10:49 p.m.
Epochalyptik says... #37
@Xavier4238:It's an interesting question. I've built super-budget decks before using bulk rares and various commons and uncommons, but there are two points I'd like to make:
This is a collectible card game. It's designed around the principle that not every player will have access to every card. Disparate resources are a reality of the game. Whether that's good, bad, or neither is a matter of personal opinion, but I don't find it useful to ignore this reality, especially because you can't ignore this reality if you play competitively. I still stand by my earlier statement: if you would like to play with proxies in your own playgroup, that's up to you. But I don't permit proxies in my playgroup on a wealth basis. I permit them only for the four reasons I listed in my first post.
Secondly, I don't see the "need" for players to proxy to overcome a power barrier. If you're at a budgetary disadvantage, improve your deckbuilding skills to make the most of what you have. If you truly feel that you're out of your depth and not enjoying your games, then find another playgroup if possible. I've spent entire articles addressing playgroup disconnects and why it's important to find players who want the same things you do from games.
However, don't expect that other people will accommodate you purely because you can't accommodate yourself. And I mean that in the most genuine way; I don't mean that if you're too poor to play, then it sucks to suck. I mean that your circumstances do not create an obligation on the part of other players. Now, if those players decide that they can enjoy the game while allowing you to proxy (if you must), then more power to them (and you). But they are under no obligation to do so.
That's exactly why I took issue with TheDevicer's "looking down on" players who refused to play with someone who proxies their decks. They are well within their rights to choose how to enjoy the game, and they are under no obligation to accept you into their playgroup. Would it be "nice" of them to do so? Sure. But that doesn't invalidate the choice they have in the matter, and it doesn't necessitate that they're callous if they choose not to.
June 2, 2015 10:52 p.m. Edited.
Example two is the ONLY acceptable example in my opinion. If I see someone pull out a proxied Mana Drain my question next is :do you own that card? if the answer is no... I dont play with them again.
its not fair to the other players if you sit there proxying cards that amount to the value of some peoples rent. its not cool. the card has the price tag for a reason. If you cannot afford/do not want to shell out the money for said card you shouldn't be using it.
If your sitting there proxying cards that cost 50 cents....just buy the card. If you dont like the art buy the card still and use the proxy.
EDIT> Im in portland Oregon. I play at Red Castle Games. there is some casual there but most of the EDH players arent new to it and are Highlander converts or have several thousand dollar collections.
June 2, 2015 11:04 p.m. Edited.
SimicPower says... #39
I allow proxies in the same situations that vault previously specified. However, reading through this thread did make me think: Is playing with expensive proxies that much worse than playing with an expensive deck you borrowed from a friend? In both of the situations, you didn't have to drop any cash for the deck, or go out of your way to obtain the cards.
Either way, I still don't like it when people play expensive proxies versus me. I always play my decks without proxies, except when I am initially constructing them, or testing out a new card to see if it is playable. I just don't like the aesthetics of proxies.
I actually have a funny story about this. When I built my first EDH deck, Crystal Ball was in it. My LGS had it listed on their website as in stock. I printed out all of the cards my LGS didn't have in stock in hopes of obtaining them later, then headed down to my LGS to buy the cards they did have. When I got there, however, Crystal Ball was already sold out. I bought the rest, and when I returned home I printed out Crystal Ball. Since it was just one card, I thought, "What harm could it be to print this in color?" Well, it turns out after playing with the color proxy for long enough, I actually forgot it was a proxy. After I had my entire deck finished, one day I was looking back over it and noticed my Crystal Ball looked a little weird. Then I realized it wasn't an actual card. Oops!
End of story: Instead of buying Crystal Ball, I cut it for a better card.
June 2, 2015 11:21 p.m.
To everyone who disagrees, does the art or form of the cars effect the way the game goes?
June 2, 2015 11:23 p.m.
Epochalyptik says... #41
I don't think the appearance of the proxy has any affect on whether I'm inclined to allow it unless it's difficult to read or distinguish.
June 2, 2015 11:25 p.m. Edited.
In my playground a lot of people proxy cards they own or have already ordered which I think is perfectly fine. I also started to playtest cards as proxy in my deck to avoid expensive mistakes like I did in the past (simply ordered too many cards that did not make it in the decks...). But I do not like if people proxy really expensive cards they won't buy. I built my decks on a certain budget too and therefore do not play Gaea's Cradle and other expensive cards. It simply comes down to this : I do not mind anyone to use proxys as long as they are not "pretend" to own they most expensive magic cards...
June 2, 2015 11:31 p.m.
I don't think I'd be ok with someone with alters that contain blatantly offensive or inappropriate content. Never had that issue before. Most alters I've seen are pretty cool and express a ton of creativity and effort. I'm ok with tasteless stuff though. Whatever floats your boat, man.
June 2, 2015 11:31 p.m.
Exactly. So it's all just paper, and the fact that we have people pay who knows how much for a peice of paper can be ridiculous. I'm a student and have proxied tons of decks, do I first look at budget options, sure. But proxies make no difference on the actual game play.
June 2, 2015 11:32 p.m.
Gidgetimer says... #45
In my play group we are ok with proxies if:
- You own the card
or
- You intend to buy the card if you like the deck
Between me and a friend of mine we have 10 assembled decks that people can play if they want to play something other than what they own. We are not trying to create a barrier to entry and will both give away many cards to facilitate building decks. But we expect people to either buy the cards for their deck or find a budget alternative that they will buy.
June 2, 2015 11:32 p.m.
aeonstoremyliver says... #46
My playgroup and friends use proxies for the following reasons, which can be said of any format:
You're testing a deck
You've ordered the card, it hasn't arrived, and can show proof
The card is super expensive and you own a physical copy
The card is tied up in another deck that is sitting across the table.
That being said, proxying cards for the sheer sake of doing so for super good and expensive cards puts the other players at an unfair disadvantage. Keeping it real with physical copies, unless referenced above, brings an even playing field to the game.
My playgroup is a bit more casual with EDH vs Modern and Legacy, though. That's a variable.
All in all, it's if you and your playgroup has fun and what you allow as a group. If you and your group wish to proxy, than so be it. BTW, I'd love to proxy Vintage decks with my playgroup. That's where I believe proxying en masse would be accepted, save a sanctioned event.
June 2, 2015 11:32 p.m.
Didgeridooda says... #47
Lifa I know you are trying to make a point, but if you read the responses you will understand the other side of the discussion.
June 2, 2015 11:34 p.m.
Epochalyptik says... #48
@Lifa: I can see why you think that's a conclusive argument, but it isn't. As Didgeridooda said, the responses above should make it clear that we are not dealing with equal pieces of paper here. Some of them are cards and some of them are just paper. If you're not using cards, you had better have a good reason for doing so, and it had better have been approved by the other players for whatever reasons they may have.
If you demand to proxy Imperial Seal because it costs too much for you, then I'm not going to let you join my games because you're not playing with a real card and you don't have a sufficient reason for that choice.
June 2, 2015 11:37 p.m.
Cobthecobbler says... #49
Proxies have always been a touchy subject. I say if you own the card elsewhere, or plan on owning the card then by all means go for it. I am however very against someone proxying power, or something completely financially impossible. I for one have used Proxies since I started my five color edh deck. I started with 22 Proxies and and now only have 3. I plan on getting the rest but cannot, and my playgroup is okay with that.
So if you're going to use Proxies, have a good reason for it and check with your playgroup. Make sure you have substitutions with you if you're playing with new people and don't get salty of someone asks you to play fair. No one likes losing to a fake Karn.
June 3, 2015 12:01 a.m.
I've seen both sides of the coin.
One guy we play with has an entire proxied deck with all altered art. I don't mind as I'm pretty sure he owns most of the deck, but more than that he isn't deliberately proxying power cards. The other thing is his attitude is good. That makes s real difference.
On the flipside, I've played with people proxying ABURs who have then acted quite smug. For me, that's not on. I'm not going to get angry about proxies, but if you have a lousy attitude when using then, I will take offense. Especially when some of the other players are using real ABURs or real FoWs.
I'm cool with people proxying cards they own and especially if they're wanting alt art. I have an alt foil Saffi which I use as my commander, but I have the real one sitting next to it.
As for the whole "multiple decks" thing, this might sound silly but I prefer it when people buy copies of a card. I have 2 Sensei's Divining Tops, 2 Sylvan Library (granted not the pretty one) multiple fetches because I own multiple decks. But that's a personal thing.
ABadMagicPlayer100 says... #2
In my playgroup, we only allow proxies if you have intent to obtain the cards in the future. Prevents people from running OP expensive cards like Black Lotus. I'm in Washington (state, not DC).
June 2, 2015 7:12 p.m.