Zombie Tribal - Deciding My Commander
Commander Deck Help forum
Posted on March 27, 2023, 10:47 p.m. by 77hi77
Hey all!
I have the Wilhelt, the Rotcleaver precon, I've been going through the wealth of resources online to see how I want to upgrade it. Then I learned of Nevinyrral, Urborg Tyrant. Down the line, if I ever become one of the people with like 50+ decks, I might built two separate decks for them, but for now I'm deciding which one suits what I want to do more.
I guess I'm trying to wrap my head around whether they'd need different setups (aside from the obvious colour differences). Ultimately, regardless of which one is my commander, I want the deck to go wide with zombie tokens and pump them up. Wilhelt is more involved, I feel like the deck will have other token generators and sac outlets, then Wilhelt is there to get extra value out of saccing the non-decayed tokens.
Nevy feels like a wincon. I wouldn't cast him to build up and generate value in the same way as Wilhelt. He feels more like a: let the deck do its own thing, cast Nevy, give him something like Malakir Rebirth  Flip, sac him, board wipe, he comes back and I have a full board. I've seen the combo with him and Phyrexian Altar, but I want more of a casual setting with no obvious infinite combos.
My question is, do they feel like different decks to you? I'm thinking they both need to spam token generators, lords, and sac outlets. The decks would play differently just based on how they interact with the commander, but I don't know how different the base of each deck would be (compared to, say, Gisa and Geralf, which is much more of a milling focus). Thoughts?
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March 28, 2023 3:34 a.m.
I built Varina, Lich Queen when she first came out and it's fun being able to rip through my deck with her ability. But I must admit the white doesn't offer a ton in terms of zombies
March 28, 2023 10:51 a.m.
FormOverFunction says... #5
My only zombie commander deck is headed by Hogaak, Arisen Necropolis so I’m probably not smart enough to help lol but my vote would be for Wilhelt.
March 28, 2023 12:35 p.m.
shadow63 Varina also seems super cool! She seems like she'd benefit from a lot of graveyard interaction, I definitely want to build that deck in the future. Probably also the same premise that I'm looking at with Wilhelt and Nevinyrral would work well with her, go wide, beef up the zombie tokens, then she draws my whole deck. That does sound fun!
FormOverFunction that sounds awesome! Do you have a link to that deck? I love new takes on these sorts of things.
I think, over the next few days, I'll be making different zombie lists to see if they look wildly different to each other and what mechanics I'd focus on. I'll definitely post the Nevinyrral one here
March 28, 2023 10:31 p.m.
GodzSoldier says... #7
Pick the one with Card draw in it. It's more likely to go well when building it. Unless you really want a third colour which will inevitably force you to play it differently. I'd pick Varina though if you do. I've never been a zombie expert, but she seems way better than Nevrinywal
March 29, 2023 12:10 a.m.
My three favorite zombie commanders personally are Wilhelt, the Rotcleaver, Grimgrin, Corpse-Born, and The Scarab God. Wilhelt is great because he gives you a nice bit of card draw with his sac ability. If you are trying to build a go wide deck, Wilhelt will be more of a value engine to get you running the first couple of turns. However, if you aren't making your deck a sacrifice deck the extra decayed tokens aren't quite as useful. My Wilhelt deck was built to drain my opponents through sac payoffs, and while it was definitely my highest powered zombie deck, repeating the same infinite combos with Gravecrawler became a little boring. Scarab God is really fun because it does a little bit of everything. The upkeep ability is nice when going wide because you should have quite a few zombies, which will drain your opponents over time and also allow you to grab your best cards depending on the situation. Add in cards like Paradox Haze and Wound Reflection and it really starts to add up. Being able to use the reanimate effect is really fun too and can make each game & wincon unique depending on whats in your opponents graveyards. Right now, I'm having the most fun with Grimgrin. He gives you removal in the command zone, and gives you versatility with your attack strategy. You can pump up your zombies with lords and go wide (and use Grimgrin to remove the biggest threats), or you can sac your zombies to him and go tall with commander damage. Most satisfying win I've had was pumping up Grimgrin, swinging with Wand of Orcus equipped to eliminate one player with commander damage, and then knocking out the other two players with the resulting zombie tokens. Overall I just think he's a blast to play, even if he's not the most high powered.
March 29, 2023 4:12 p.m.
Varina, Lich Queen is definitely a commander to consider if you do go the Esper route. Rewards going wide, draws cards en masse and fills your Graveyard at the same time while also giving you access to a 3rd color option
March 29, 2023 6:09 p.m.
Max_Hammer says... #10
I'd prefer to sit down at a table with Wilhelt for sure. Nevy, and Esper in general, usually ends up leaving a bad taste in my mouth afterwards. That said, the Nevy players I've seen have been a bit tryhardy, so really it's just up to you to not be a baboon and put mean stuff in there, lol.
Not to mention that Wilhelt feels like the more flavorful option. He's your commander and his art has him in front of a horde of undead, pointing to the enemy? Feels very on-point.
Other than that, BK said it best up above, Grimgrin is radical and The Scarab God is just plain terrifying.
Another zombie commander I dig is Sidisi, Brood Tyrant. You'd have to change your deck up a fair bit to constitute more milling, but she's super fun to play.
April 4, 2023 11:16 p.m.
bklounge Thanks for that! Yeah, I was definitely looking at Grimgrin as a possible option because he does seem like a blast.
To your point about Gravecrawler, the reason why I started thinking about all of this (and I'm considering much more than just Wilhelt vs Nevinyrral) was because, in every video or post about upgrading the Wilhelt precon, the advice was always to build the deck around Phyrexian Altar + Gravecrawler and Rooftop Storm + Acererak the Archlich, and it was turning into the same deck each time. I'm not trying to be the hipster that's different to everyone else just for the sake of it, but I don't want to play the exact same deck that every podcaster and youtuber tells me to play.
The other hindrance that my preferences have put on me is that I like my tribal decks to stay truly tribal. The Scarab God is fantastic and supports the tribe very well, I know that, but isn't a Zombie, and in a Zombie tribal I want every single creature to be a Zombie. Really I'm here to make my own life hard. You should see me play Warhammer, I take factions that excel at long range and I try to make a close-combat armies out of them, it's always a disaster.
Max_Hammer Fair enough! Yeah, it's definitely tempting to get really mean with Nevy. I built a sloppy, inefficient, incredibly low-powered version of a Nevy deck and it still has enough board wipes to make everyone hate me.
My original question was whether I can get away with building essentially the same deck (adapting the mana base if I'm changing colours, but not the actual meat of the deck) but swapping commanders. Even if the way the commander plays is completely different, can they do just as well with the same deck if I just want to go wide with Zombie tokens? It seems like the answer is no, they need similar elements but tailored specifically to each commander if I want the deck to be halfway decent.
All that said, I do love Wilhelt's backstory. Gets absolutely smitten by Gisa, dies, comes back to life and raises and army just to impress her, she's like "meh".
April 7, 2023 1:43 p.m.
Well, I just went ahead and got myself Varina, Lich Queen, Nevinyrral, Urborg Tyrant, and Grimgrin, Corpse-Born. Each deck will play differently, but I feel pretty good about them all being based on the Wilhelt, the Rotcleaver precon for the spine of the deck. I might even go wild and pick up a Sedris, the Traitor King to go for yet another colour route. For now I'll leave it at dimir and esper, figure those out and how I want those to play.
Now to decide which Liliana suits how I want each commander to play best (and try to justify the answer not being Liliana, Dreadhorde General because she ain't cheap)
April 9, 2023 10:37 p.m.
Max_Hammer says... #13
www.ProxyMore.com (Not an actual website)
If you don't like that idea, here's some actual suggestions.
For Grimgrin Liliana, Death's Majesty is just a good all-rounder and makes easy-to-sac tokens.
For Varina, same thing. Easy to swing with and not care too much about and it mills. If not her, then Liliana, Death Mage will work well for both of them.
For Nevvy, don't. Don't do Nevvy, I beg of you. At least infect/proliferate kills me quickly through sedation. Please, no-
April 10, 2023 11 p.m.
Max_Hammer I do actually have Liliana, Dreadhorde General, she's just in another deck (which would probably benefit more from Liliana of the Dark Realms, it's a whole thing). I think you're right, Varina will involve more milling and would enjoy Liliana, Death's Majesty. I've never considered Liliana, Death Mage, thank you!
You know what, I'm getting a very subtle sense that you don't like Nevvy, but I'm not so sure.
No, I definitely hear you, I think the biggest challenge in building that deck will be to make it fun to play against. The other deck I'm referencing (the one that my Dreadhorde General is currently in), I BEG YOUR F@CKING PARDON??!!! - Razaketh, is so far proving to be a failure at that. I was hoping to make something chaotic that results in a laugh, I ended up building a deck where the wincons involve no interaction with the other players, I just tutor and cast two cards (Fraying Omnipotence and Wound Reflection), and it really doesn't matter what the actual board state looks like. Everyone calls it my bullshit deck, it's not overpowered or tuned in any real way, it just lives in its own world and ends the game way too suddenly to be fun.
So with Nevvy, I like him because he seems to bring that same self-destructive chaos I was hoping to capture (and, down the line, will hope to capture again when I build a Rakdos the Defiler deck), my challenge will be to have that chaos without it feeling like I'm stopping others from playing. It's why I'm exploring a few different commanders, I want to see what leads to the most fun Zombie deck, without it being the exact same Zombie deck that everyone plays/expects to see.
As an aside, I do also have a proliferate deck in mind, but it'd be to pull off shenanigans like Vraska, Scheming Gorgon's -10.
April 11, 2023 12:44 a.m.
Max_Hammer says... #15
I don't dislike Nevvy I'm just scared of him... And I dislike him.
I do want to be clear though, I've been hating on Nevvy a lot, but solely as a joke. In the right climate, a more competitive one where I'm bringing an equally scary commander, I'm more than happy to see him at a table. I play Atraxa proliferate/infect, I have no room to judge here.
Either way, I believe in you, mate. You can make a fun Nevvy if you believe in yourself.
P.S. I love Vraska so much
77hi77 says... #2
Just realized I posted this in the wrong section. If a mod could move this to Commander Deck Help, I'd love that
March 28, 2023 2:50 a.m.