Marchesa, the Black Rose

Legendary Creature — Human Wizard

Dethrone *(Whenever this creature attacks the player with the most life or tied for most life, put a +1/+1 counter on it.) *

Other creatures you control have dethrone.

Whenever a creature you control with a +1/+1 counter on it dies, return that card to the battlefield under your control at the beginning of the next end step.

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Marchesa, the Black Rose Discussion

BasedGod22 on Evolving for Optimization

20 hours ago

@VesuvanDoppelbanger Thanks for the suggestions!

I agree with the Mana Echoes I just need to get my hands on one. As for the other two, Cryptic Gateway seems a bit too slow for what I'm looking for, and Marchesa, the Black Rose doesn't really fit the theme of my deck. I appreciate the feedback nevertheless.

VesuvanDoppelbanger on Evolving for Optimization

1 day ago

I enjoy Marchesa, the Black Rose in my own Sliver deck - easy recursion.

Mana Echoes goes infinite with the Queen, and is a great enabler without her.

Cryptic Gateway can push slivers into play quickly as well.

Bhaal666 on Best Copy-cat colors

5 days ago

well Marchesa, the Black Rose is going to be the best in that you will have access to the most steal and copy effects. Blue/red has the largest amount of copy and steal effects, black is really nice too though. Marchesa would even allow you to easily run all of their instant and sorceries with Fork, Radiate, Reiterate, Reverberate, and/or Wild Ricochet. I think that is most of them, I don't know any blue ones. Radiate may not be one you run but I find it funny...

Insurrection seems like a perfect in flavor win con.

Raging_Squiggle on Best Copy-cat colors

5 days ago

So, on to my next, semi-casual EDH deck. I've had it on the back burner for quite some time now, and I've decided to try my hand at creating a clone deck with a subtheme of stealing or reanimating.

The reason for this deck's creation is I occasionally get complaints from people not liking my decks or it's too mean. This deck will only be as good as my opponent's, so if they complain, they end up inadvertently bashing their own deck building skills. (Lol).

Anyway! I have a couple ideas in mind, and I'd like to know what you all think!

  1. Lazav, Dimir Mastermind (Non mill)
    I used to have a mill Lazav deck. But that wasn't very fun in the long term. 2 Colors, less ability for reactions, but more consistent. Only has to see the creature enter the graveyard from anywhere. Copies, doesn't steal. 4 Mana. Hexproof.

  2. The Mimeoplasm
    I have most of the land base for BUG, as I used to run Damia. Adds green for ramp and Progenitor Mimic and Altered Ego. Adds reanimator cards like Meren of Clan Nel Toth. Provides reaction cards for artifacts and enchantments. But is more expensive to cast, and requires 2 creatures in graveyards to interact with.

  3. Merieke Ri Berit & Rubinia Soulsinger
    I haven't played with these before, so I don't know how I would like them. They have decent abilities, however each one either lacks a good color for thieving/copying, or has a color that is not suited for the theme.

  4. Sakashima the Impostor
    I have probably 3 mono-U decks, so a fourth isn't too appealing to me. On top of that, it loses both black and green, making me resort to more preemptive responses to threats, making me run more counterspells. Which at that point ends up being my Baral, Chief of Compliance deck. But if someone can make a good argument for this one, i'll take it into consideration.

  5. Marchesa, the Black Rose
    Trading Green for Red, or just adding Red, has come across my mind before. It allows for Dack's Duplicant, and more steal effects. However, I feel like this deck would turn into a combo deck at some point with Marchesa, which I'm not intending to do here.

Anyway! I'd love to hear your thoughts! As a side tangent, but still relevant, if there are commanders in some combinations of these colors, while not sticking to the theme of copy/steal, that you think would be good to use, let me know!

VesuvanDoppelbanger on Sliver control - in progress

1 week ago

Cheap was to grab your winter orb:Fabricate, Shred Memory

More pricey ways:Enlightened Tutor, Demonic Tutor

I enjoy Marchesa, the Black Rose in my own Sliver build.

Bhaal666 on making a Group-Slug Chaos deck

1 week ago

So making a Group-Slug Chaos deck but having difficulty deciding on the commander. Currently stuck between the following:

Norin the Wary- out fast, easy manabase, keeps funny things like Confusion in the Ranks going.

Jhoira of the Ghitu- still a simple manabase, no mana curve, easily use the big dumb chaos cards as they tend to be mana intensive and she doesn't care.

Marchesa, the Black Rose- I see this as a better norin, most difficult manabase but it still isnt 5 colors at least, I'm already using some of the things I'd want in here in another deck, largest selection of fun things to use, easily recover from any board wipe, just plain powerful.

I've considered a lot of others as well but feel free to throw more at me. If your curious about other things I'm considering here is some of what I'm looking at You Go Boom, I Go Boom, We All Go Boom!

Daedalus19876 on Reyhan and Silas Renn (Affinity)

1 week ago

I like the idea of the deck! It seems unfinished, though: could use a Greater Good and Attrition as powerful sac outlets, and possibly a Cauldron of Souls to make your board much more resilient.

I really wish that your colors included red; Marchesa, the Black Rose would be bonkers in this deck. Lifeline does something similar.

You do need a way to manage to actually HIT with your big creatures (and Silas Renn), though. Champion of Lambholt might work, but my go-to is usually Eldrazi Monument or Akroma's Memorial (both of which Kuldotha Forgemaster can find).

The mana base seems rough, but a tri-color list is relatively forgiving when your commander isn't a must-have. Does it play okay?

From your maybeboard I'd add Ashnod's Altar, Hangarback Walker, Lifecrafter's Gift, and Master Biomancer.

Hope this helps!

GS10 on Breya EDH

1 week ago

No problem! ;) I'm glad to be helpful.

I'm running Tezzeret, Master of Metal and this weekend I took my copy of Tezzeret the Seeker from my Brago deck to try it out in Breya (and I didn't really need to try it because I know it should be in there). Master of Metal is cool, but not straight up necessary. It gets worse as your meta gets faster, not only because it just slowly provides card advantage, but because the real use of it's minus ability will never be game ending unless you are already one on one, and in Breya by my experience that means the game is not going too well anyway. I will change my deck a bit and include both, but between one or another (and regarding the fact that you can only keep one of them on the battlefield at the same time) I'd always favor Tezzeret the Seeker because it tutors for your combo pieces for "free". As for Darksteel Forge, I'm not a huge fan of it, but I get that some people include it in Breya decks. I favor recrusion over indestructibility (especially because there are always cards like Merciless Eviction and such), but if you feel like you can spare a slot for it, yes it definitely doesn't hurt you.

About being the target, I usually deal with that running different decks. And if you are thinking of building new decks, I'd definitely recommend it to change things up a bit and make the games more about fun and less about "you win everytime so we are gonna kill you first". You can end up winning with a different deck anyway, but the games feel different, and so you become the target less often.

There is no particular answer to that problem in deckbuilding, sure you can defend yourself by building your deck in such a way that your opponents' typical answers to you don't hurt you that much, but that will lower the overall power of your deck, and turn it into a dud against most other playgroups if you tend to play with different people. I've been dealing with this problem with my Marchesa, the Black Rose deck. It is very sub-optimal as a deck. Budget and not that fast, but once I build up a board, people get frightened and try to kill me. I've tried to change the deck, even made a quicker version of it with proxies so I could maybe outpace that table alliance against me, but nothing can really deal with that once your playgroup hits a certain power level. Maybe Brago Stax, or a super fast Narset deck can do good in an Archenemy-like game because they are so broken and powerful, but in my experience that is not that fun when you really want to play EDH. So after all this rant, what I want to get across is that whatever you do, with whatever deck you play, it's hard to overcome the table turning against you by building differently.

It depends on each meta, but in my case I think I'll be running Torrential Gearhulk, Evacuation and a suite of countermagic and removal, that will help me not only protect myself and my combos better, but also get the most out of my resources. I'll DM you as soon as I change my list with some tips if you feel like that can help you as well. This is not a way to deal with your problem directly, since it is a way to make the deck stronger as a whole anyway, that incidentally might deal with that problem. But as I said, above a certain power level, that might protect you better, but not make a huge dent on your opponents.

You can try and make deals while playing, be political, to avoid all of your opponents to turn against you, or at least have some kind of protection to buy you enough time to win on a combo.

Also, since your main win cons are combos, I'd keep my shields up. I personally rarely attack with my own Breya deck, that dissuades people from coming at you, and makes you less of a menace while you're not touching any of them in particular.

But mostly, I'd really recommend you try different decks, even budget ones, or high concept ones, even if you just proxy them for one or two games once in a while. The fact that you have the ability to change how the game feels, makes people less aggressive towards you even if you are the strongest player, and overall makes the playgroup healthier (and when playing a combo deck, keeps less informed players forgetting of your win conditions :) which is also nice!). I'd recommend you check out Omnath, Locus of Rage and Nekusar, the Mindrazer as potential budget commanders (that aren't very encouraging to attack into as well) if you want to build a deck for that matter, and obviously, each commander deck release from WotC is a cheap way to play something different usually.

I'm not saying that you shouldn't play Breya, you definitely should, I'm just saying that she's one of the most underrated generals out there, and once people see how powerful she can be, they tend to get salty and target you naturally - again my own experience, I play a Narset deck, and I tried it out for the first time with a playgroup I had never played against. As soon as they saw Narset they said to each other "We've got to kill that one first!" and I've never been able to even cast Narset against them because of that. My deck is not that powerful, but since they've played against broken Narset decks, they target me as a precaution. I believe that Breya will sometimes get the same treatment if people played against her before, but I don't believe you should change your deck almost like you're sideboarding it against hate, just to deal with that. At least I wouldn't. Personally I try to show people something like "see, I'm just here to have fun, if you don't like Breya I'll even play something else, but let me play the game too". I'm sorry I went on a huge rant, but this is hard to explain and it often becomes a taboo-like issue that tears some playgroups apart. If people don't enjoy playing against something and take revenge instead of talking about it, it's hard to have fun games, so keep that in mind and try to change things up sometimes if you feel you're being hate-targeted too often.

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