why is Liliana of the Veil so damn expensive.
General forum
Posted on Oct. 10, 2011, 4:34 p.m. by Martymo
Question is in the title, I just don't see what warrants her non foil to run up around 60 bucks. Is it simply because she's new or is there some really wicked good combo that I'm not seeing?
Liliana was always my favorite planeswalker, and it saddens me that I wont get my hands on one unless I pull it from a pack (there is no way I'm dropping 60 bucks on 1 card)
Yea I noticed that as well. That is batshit crazy. I remember when she was spoiled and everyone was upset at her (low?)power level. Then solar flare pops up wahbam. Being able to be brought back by Sun Titan only helps her cause.
October 10, 2011 4:50 p.m.
Because she is wicked good in Two solid decks. Maybe 3.
u/b control- deck:what-do-distress-mana-leak-have-in-common-1
solar flare - Standard Solar Flare
and mono black Liliana of the Veil
October 10, 2011 4:52 p.m.
Whenever a new set hits, that set's planeswalkers are always way expensive. Unfortunately with solar flare, she probably won't come down all that soon.
October 10, 2011 5:16 p.m.
mozerdozer says... #7
...It's not because of standard guys. There was only one Solar Flare deck in the most recent SCG tournament and Solar Flare didn't even break the top 20. I have hard that there is an interesting combo in her in legacy that gets a win on turn 3 or 4 usually. Saying she is expensive because her use in standard is saying Mental Misstep was 7 dollars because of its uses in standard.
I realize that the Solar Flare deck was probably badly played, but Solar Flare is also not a god deck.
October 10, 2011 5:44 p.m.
Did you miss the fact that Solar Flare got second place in the SCG Open this past weekend and it was in 7 of the top 16 slots?
October 10, 2011 5:57 p.m.
Supply and demand. With a new set demand is always high because no one has the cards so everyone that wants one pretty much needs to buy it. It'll go lower once they stop selling out so much.
October 10, 2011 6:09 p.m.
Even if there is this mysterious combo that no one has seen, it's not happening in any events, and is not fueling her popularity and price. I haven't seen any top legacy decks use Liliana AT ALL.
Fact is, it's strictly her standard appeal that is driving the price up.
http://www.starcitygames.com/magic/standard/22885_Flow_Of_Ideas_The_Return_Of_Solar_Flare.html
October 10, 2011 6:11 p.m.
t1: Sawmp, Dark Ritual, Liliana, Pitch Progenitus
t2: Any Land, Reanimate
t3: Beat face.
t4: Win.
You only need 4 cards in your hand (including the swamp) for this to work, the rest can be FoW, Daze, etc. Progenitus can be replaced with any huge creature that's hard to get rid of.
October 10, 2011 6:52 p.m.
kbrannon12 says... #12
@Spoofed-Progenitus gets reshuffled. But yeah any big beater would work.
October 10, 2011 6:57 p.m.
Opps, I completely forgot about that. But yeah, all Liliana does is make reanimator decks more powerfull.
October 10, 2011 7:09 p.m.
Having played against it, Liliana in solar flare is just rediculous. Her price tag isn't because she is new, the "new planeswalker" price tag default seems to be around $30, it really is unfortunate that she became so popular. Hoping that solar flare doesn't adapt like caw blade did so that her price tag might go back down.
October 10, 2011 7:12 p.m.
Solar Flare will stay relevant until Unburial Rites rotates out, and that'll be when Lilana does as well. So unless Wizard decides to make an entire set of graveyard hate easily accessible to all colors Liliana is gonna stay high.
October 10, 2011 8:38 p.m.
mozerdozer says... #16
They're bringing unearth back as well, so she might increase still. For those who want evidence of the return of unearth, ready daily mtg.
October 10, 2011 9:53 p.m.
the sets been legal a little over a week and people have already decided that a deck was good enough to make Liliana a 60 dollar card? lol ok...
October 10, 2011 10:13 p.m.
@mozerdozer: Can you give a link so I can see that they are bringing back unearth?
October 10, 2011 11:58 p.m.
mozerdozer says... #19
Why did you choose flashback over unearth? It seems like unearth is even more horror themed.
There are two answers to this question:
Answer #1) Most of the other aspects of the set were eating up creature space. For example, tribal mechanics obviously revolve around creatures. If too many aspects of your set fight for the same space, you don't have the room you need for one part of your design and you struggle to fill up the other. To stop this from happening, it's important to spread your mechanics across various types of cards. Since the mechanics we already had were going to be creature focused, it felt like moving some of the graveyard mechanics to instants and sorceries was important. Also, flashback is much more flexible than unearth in how you can use it.
Answer #2) Later in the block, we... oh, I can't tell you about this yet. Never mind. Um, this is awkward. Don't worry, you'll see what I'm talking about later in the block.
From: http://www.wizards.com/Magic/Magazine/Article.aspx?x=mtg/daily/mm/164
The mechanic will either be unearth or something similar, such as Reassembling Skeleton .
October 11, 2011 12:04 a.m.
What about Nihil Spellbomb for easy graveyard hate for all colors? Its a retarded version of card:Tormod's Crypt which works great in legacy, so maybe the spellbomb will catch on in standard to help keep solar flare and other graveyard decks in check.
October 11, 2011 12:48 a.m.
Congratulations Spoofed, you just found a more difficult way to play turn 1 Horrifying Revelation , turn 2 Reanimate . Oh wait, even that doesn't see play in legacy.
Face it, dredge/reanimation is much faster and has better card choices than Liliana. The rise is price is strictly due to standard.
October 11, 2011 1:10 a.m.
And really mozerdozer? Mental Misstep completely warped the legacy format while only saw play in sideboards of standard, while Liliana is in several popular standard decks, while seeing essentially no play in legacy. You can not seriously make that comparison.
October 11, 2011 1:13 a.m.
mafteechr just.. (puts on sunglasses) took you to school.
YEAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAH
October 11, 2011 1:18 a.m.
HAHAHA nice @ Leafs_suck!
if i can throw in my 2 cents, isnt it also because there are only 2 walkers in this set and the chances of pulling 1 sucks, i know 1 of the guys at FNM bought 4 boxes of boosters without getting a single walker. of the 5 boxes i know where sold of this set so far only 1 garruk and 1 lilly have been pulled at our FNM, hence the high price.
October 11, 2011 2:51 a.m.
Surgical Extraction seems like fairly substantial graveyard hate. Sure, it only targets 1 card, but it's going to get rid of ALL of that card. For 2 life as well, you're getting a lot of gas out of their deck. She's not going to be as ridiculous as Jace, the Mind Sculptor , more being like Elspeth, Knight-Errant . Jace went from 'playable Planeswalker', namely in Shards Block - M11 - Zendikar Block, being playable in Junk and UW Tap-Out, to 'I burn holes through your wallet and liquidate all your assets' when they released Batterskull and the Swords. Elspeth, conversely, went from a $45 card on release to like, $20 after a couple of months when the hype died down. Liliana is the same in my opinion. She's not good enough for Legacy, Modern she may get play, Extended she's pretty insane, and Standard she's very good. However, being as Red Deck Wins has done well, and that there will likely be a surge of non-black aggro decks, supplemented by either Gavony Township or Kessig Wolf Run , and possibly even raw UW Control through Moorland Haunt , there will be enough variance in the format to make her price come down.
It's also due to the fact that Liliana isn't going to rotate for 2 years, compared to the M12 set, who unless re-released, will rotate next year. She's more permanently fixed into the format.
October 11, 2011 6:58 a.m.
JTMS was at $80 before the Scars block was released, and he hit $110 before Batterskull was released. After Batterskull, he was back around $80.
Your claim that his rise in price and fame based on swords and caw blade in general is flawed.
http://ark42.com/mtg/pricehistory.php?q=Jace,+the+Mind+Sculptor&d=0
October 11, 2011 7:20 a.m.
Because he and the stone forge mystic got ban some time after the release of Batterskull for being ridiculous. I do not miss them at all, mostly out of jealousy for those who had enough money to throw around to have a set of Jace's and mystics at the time, lol.
October 11, 2011 9:10 a.m.
He was $80 until he was banned, then he dropped to $60. If anything, his value dropped from before ($110) to after ($80) Batterskull was released and Caw Blade rose to complete domination.
October 11, 2011 9:39 a.m.
I feel like as soon as there are 4+ Solar Flare decks in the top 8 Nihil Spellbomb is gonna jump up to around $1 a piece
October 11, 2011 9:54 a.m.
Then Solar Flare will sideboard Mental Misstep to fight Surgical Extraction and Nihil Spellbomb .
Additionally, Nihil Spellbomb isn't super effective against Solar Flare. I would much rather play Surgical Extraction and remove all of one threat rather than just one of a few.
October 11, 2011 10:12 a.m.
yep and get them while they are cheap because there are lots of decs like zombie deck for instance that could use removal hate not just solar flare. Besides I think G/U Hex Blade will eventually take the cake.
October 11, 2011 11:17 a.m.
staggerleet says... #34
so the guy at the local card shop told me that boxes of innistrad are selling out everywhere and wizards didn't anticipate the demand. more cards are being printed so there will be more going around and the price will drop. that just what i was told
October 11, 2011 11:39 a.m.
So he was. My bad, I was going by one of the guys I know, who played UW Tapout at GP Brussels. Managed to pick up his set for basically peanuts. Either way, Liliana shouldn't get any more expensive that she is now, because her abilities aren't as game changing as Jace's. Brainstorm every turn is pretty intense, compared to Rix Maadi, Dungeon Palace , which is good, but it's not a Legacy worthy ability.
October 11, 2011 12:10 p.m.
@sprinkles
More than a few people have been singing the praises of Nihil Spellbomb . Expect to see it in a lot of sideboards if nothing else.
October 12, 2011 12:44 a.m.
It's in mine for sure right now. People here like to do weird things, including myself, so I though the spellbomb would fight Boneyard Wurm , Splinterfright , and Skaab Ruinator well enough.
October 12, 2011 9:11 a.m.
DeckBuilder345 says... #38
Several reasons i believe contribute to Liliana of the Veil being so expensive.
- She only takes 3 mana to bring out
- she is new
- she has graveyard help in a set that cares about graveyards
- the set has only been out a short time
- She may be viable in one of the major decks running in standard atm, and she is therefore hard to get, because of the very short time she has been on the market.
- She was released as a part of a new set which forced the rotation of a much loved old and more powerful set (which had been dominating the old standard format. Seems to me return to mirridon block has been a weaker overall set, and people are anxious for this new one to fill the power void)(admittedly the final set in the mirridon block was more unbalancing and powerful than the rest of the block but one set in a block does not make up for the entire rest of the block).
October 12, 2011 4:04 p.m.
I'll reanimate this thread and ask what everyone thinks about Liliana of the Veil now? Seems like ALOT of people (all over the web) expected Liliana to plummet.
December 26, 2014 12:33 a.m.
i think shell come down more than she has (and she has come down a decent chunk) when the RPTQ promos start getting passed out, last i heard there was an estimated 10-12k promos that will be getting handed out over the next year for a card thats a 2-3 of in a deck thats not king of the jungle anymore in modern, and losing favor in legacy.
im holding my 2 since i got them at $40 in trade a year and a half ago (SCG trade value) and play them on and off but i wouldnt be picking up a dozen to spec on
December 26, 2014 2:08 a.m.
SkyRaider42 says... #41
Why would you necro a thread when you could just start your own?
December 26, 2014 10:31 a.m.
Dalektable says... #42
Copy and paste what SkyRaider42 said. But I think Liliana might fall IF (and this is a big if) they reprint her soon. Wizards said that they almost put her into M15 but didn't, throwing her into M16 as a kick off to the core sets and as a selling point for it seems like a smart move on their part.
December 26, 2014 11:17 a.m.
SkyRaider42 because I wanted to hear from some of the original poster's and if they've changed their minds now 3 years later but that probably makes too much sense for you. I heard the promo quantity was going to be way less than that (actually on this forum). Where did you get the numbers or is it a guess?
December 26, 2014 5:13 p.m.
SkyRaider42 says... #44
Now I don't think there was any need to insult me like that. I did think your reasoning made sense btw
December 26, 2014 9:21 p.m.
Sorry, I'm a bit defensive I guess after 4 years on various card forums. If I start a new thread you get trolls whining about there already being a similar thread or that it's posted in the wrong section. Bring up a dead thread and people complain just to complain. I'm honestly curious what people that thought Liliana would plummet think about the card now, but mainly because I have a foil one and I'm not sure I should hold or dump it now that I hear something like 10k+ promo foils will be given out (if that's an accurate number).
nsecord says... #2
Partially because shes all new and shiney and partially cause everyone is flocking to Solar Flare decks, which she is perfect for. It saddens me too that she's running with a J, tMS price tag.. i thought we were beyond this stuff :(
October 10, 2011 4:45 p.m.