|Commander / EDH||Legal|
Printings View all
|Iconic Masters (IMA)||Common|
|Duel Decks: Jace vs. Vraska (DDM)||Uncommon|
|Magic 2013 (M13)||Uncommon|
Combos Browse all
Creature — Illusion
Jace's Phantasm gets +4/+4 as long as an opponent has ten or more cards in his or her graveyard.
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Jace's Phantasm Discussion
3 days ago
Jace's Phantasm - kind of a trap card.
It looks great and tailor made for the deck. But it's not. It's just going to killed.
Even Tome Scour is better.
It mills at an efficient rate. 5 for 1 Blue
3 days ago
I did some playtesting using your current list, and came up with the following suggestions:
I think you should get rid of Evolving Wilds. Modern is far, far too fast for lands that enter the battlefield tapped. Instead run Watery Grave. I was having problems in my playtest of receiving the colours that I wanted to play, which Watery Grave will fix. I would also cut two of your Islands to run a full playset of Watery Grave--making sure you have the colours you need as quickly as possible is critical (particularly if you want by turn 2).
I don't think Ipnu Rivulet is a big enough impact to be worth playing. It's three mana to mill four cards, and puts you down a mana for the rest of the game. Instead, consider Flooded Strand or other Black/Blue fetch lands (Flooded Strand is currently the least expensive, which is why I suggested it in particular). Flooded Strand can be used to fetch Watery Graves, ensuring you have the mana you need by turn 2 (and also mill for a total of 6 with Hedron Crab).
I was not impressed how Blink of an Eye worked. There were a couple instances where it helped remove an enemy creature or protect a Hedron Crab, but I almost always found myself wishing I had another mill card. Same goes for Jace's Phantasm.
3 days ago
@cdkime thank you so much for your insight and suggestions! I agree with your points and have been feeling the same regarding some cards such as Patient Rebuilding and Startled Awake Flip, as well as removing the Planeswalkers altogether.
Syncopate... Let's forget I even made that choice, no idea why I had that in a deck like this.
For my meta regarding the people I play on a the regular, Jace's Phantasm has indeed helped me out in utilizing them as a blocker while I prep in the early game, but it does take away one mana I could be using on a Hedron Crab, Visions of Beyond or a milling spell. For now they will serve as a placeholder until I find a more suitable replacement, as well as easy sideboard option for other cards like Sentinel Totem, Mind Funeral, or Surgical Extraction.
I'd love to hear your feedback on the changes I made accordingly to your advice and more or less if I also adjusted my lands to compensate for adding Glimpse the Unthinkable to the main and both Surgical Extraction and Mind Funeral to the sideboard.
@PhoenixNest I did test out Fleet Swallower in a very early build when I first started to play, but for the same reason you both stated before the cost is too high to resolve its effect consistently. Thank you though for all your suggestions! :)
4 days ago
Before getting into suggestions, I have some general feedback. A lot of the cards you currently have are fantastic, but don't really belong in mill. Mill is a bit of a strange archetype--because it is Blue, lots of players think "control" when they play mill. In my experience, this is not a great way to think about it. Mill is far closer to mono-Red burn than it is to other blue decks--your goal is to "burn" the opponent as quickly as possible. The difficulty with mill is that your opponent has 60 health, as opposed to 20, meaning you have much further to go than with a traditional burn deck.
To that end, the following cards do not help you very much:
Any of your Planeswalkers: Jace, the Mind Sculptor is arguably the best planeswalker ever printed, but doesn't add much to your overall game plan. Further, the earliest he comes out is turn 4--that's the turn where you want to go for the kill, having played your Fraying Sanity on turn 3. Jace Beleren comes out when you want to play other cards, without adding to your victory. Jace, Memory Adept comes out too late to really make a difference--you're better off blitzing them with your remaining mill spells on turn 5.
Syncopate - you have better things to do with your open mana. Turn 1, this card is useless. Turn 2, you ideally want to hit with a mill spell or drop another Hedron Crab, making this card again useless. Turn 3 is Fraying Sanity. Turn 4 is burn. There's not really a good time to play this card.
Patient Rebuilding is a pretty fun, flavourful card, but also comes out too late to really make a difference.
Jace's Archivist is another card taking up your valuable three-drop slot, and doesn't really do much. By turn 4, when you can first activate the ability, your opponent is likely down to 2-4 cards, making the additional mill insignificant. Further, Archivist does nothing the turn you drop it--not ideal in such a fast-paced gameplan.
Jace's Phantasm can be helpful as a blocker, but in my experience, there's always something better to play. This might be worth keeping depending on the other decks in your meta.
Here are some cards to add (as well as a few few more cards to cut directly followed by their upgraded version):
Surgical Extraction is a must in any mill sideboard - Emrakul, the Aeons Torn is a common enough card that you need a way to deal with her being placed into the graveyard. Because it uses Phyrexian mana, there’s no need to run any lands that produce Black.
I'm going to second PhoenixNest's Archive Trap and Ghost Quarter suggestion. This is just a wonderful combo, and enough players are running fetches that you can usually Archive Trap without Ghost Quarter (or, at the very least, slow down their mana as they'll be scared to fetch).
1 week ago
currently this deck dies to Pithing Needle...Ratchet Bomb is my reflex answer for touching artifacts/enchantments in these colors...Annul and Hurkyl's Recall are also options. Maybe a combination of Jace's Phantasm and Wight of Precinct Six could be used for a beatdown wincon?... perhaps Thought Scour/Dream Twist used on yourself could be a sneaky means to "draw."
1 week ago
@Murphy77 Thanks for the suggestions! I have an appreciation for Fraying Sanity as it basically Doubles the net mill throughout the game; However this particular mill deck is not a turbo-mill brew. Im still working on my description.... but basically this Mill style is meant to be more of a control/slower playstyle. The creatures are more about defending than anything and meant to bottleneck the field; and spot removal for opponents with bigger creatures. when it comes to Memory Sluice its a nice early play especially and the hybrid mana is very appealing because its easy to cast in many situations. in the later game it can double in mill effectiveness which is nice for when Silent Arbiter is in play and the extra creatures for blocking/attacking are not needed. Trepanation Blade/Mindcrank are fun but the success of piloting this deck lies with defense/attrition... If i am swinging with creatures then combat damage is probably gonna be enough to win no matter what... and Jace's Phantasm is the only evasive creatures but a chump block is a chump block either way whether the opponents has an army of Storm Crows or Elite Vanguard. As far as my flex slots are concerned for match-ups in the event that aggro isnt a problem and Silent Arbiter got Sideboarded for Trepanation Blade then the overall effectiveness of both Wight of Precinct Six and the blade are reduced because then the opponent likely has less creatures for wright to feed on and more lands in the deck.
2 weeks ago
@cdkime I think those are some pretty good points on all accounts regarding both cards in question... Throughout this conversation and more play testing those points are becoming more and more apparent.
As far as the goal/motivation behind the deck... I am aiming to have it revolve around the creatures mostly... Hedron Crab, Jace's Phantasm, Wight of Precinct Six and or Consuming Aberration/Phenax, God of Deception... I am just a fan of Ashiok, Nightmare Weaver for his +2 making him difficult to kill making him being a "Mill" engine that can also plop down more creatures as well as a devotion enabler tentatively...
But because I want these creatures... It severly limits how many Mill spells I can have so I need as much bang/Mill as I can efficiently have... Hence why I was pretty interested in pursuing Mind Funeral with Howling Mine... But It might not be as great of an idea as I originally thought.
2 weeks ago
Although Howling Mine not only gives extra draw for the opponent but also gives that extra draw BEFORE I get a chance to benefit from it... but the motivation behind it being that the extra draw results in less cards in the library to mill as well as making it more likely to draw into lands therefore making Mind Funeral that much more potent.
To cancel out the advantage of extra draw from the opponent precision discard via Thoughtseize/Duress double as removing the most foreseeable threat as well as fuel the opponents graveyard. Mesmeric Orb is the deterrent from opponents going on a casting/attacking spree.
Mill doesn't have to be a win condition by itself. What Mill does in this Decklist is populate the opponents graveyard, which is handy for pumping up Jace's Phantasm/Wight of Precinct Six to act as formidable bodies to block and Consuming Aberration not only being an obnoxious blocker... but Howling Mine providing enough spells to have additional "mini-Mind Funerals" finish off the opponent in the event of a stand-off.
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