How does Avatar of Woe perform in Commander?
Commander Deck Help forum
Posted on Dec. 18, 2016, 11:50 a.m. by Argy
I've got a Mono-Black Commander deck and was thinking of adding Avatar of Woe to it.
Does anyone have any real world experience in playing with it?
How often do you get to cast it for ?
Does it get shot down as soon as you cast it or it enters the field?
Sim_Will_CMcantfindmehopefully says... #3
Wait that was dumb, I meant to say by turn 4 is normal.
December 18, 2016 12:05 p.m.
I play a mono-black reanimator deck that intentionally discards to fill my graveyard, and a great deal of kill to fill others. In my experience, I often cast her for or I cheat her into play. Generally it will get removed before taking out a creature, but I see that as a win. The few times it doesn't you can really mess with people. It'll depend on how your deck operates really. If you can't reliably fill graveyards, I wouldnt.
December 18, 2016 12:06 p.m.
Playgroup dependent. Some groups have more targeted removal than others, some have more wrath, some play Control Magic type effects. So try it out.
I thinking of putting it in my Meren deck, where it will not always be problem number one for my opponents, and will have sac outlets to prevent theft.
December 18, 2016 2:37 p.m.
That's a good way of looking at it.
I tend to try to fly under the radar in my playgroup.
My deck is one of my more aggressive decks.
Hopefully if they take out Avatar of Woe that will mean they can't take out one of my other important Creatures.
I've got Volrath's Stronghold anyway. If they don't Exile it I can just bring it on back.
December 18, 2016 3:49 p.m.
Lord_Khaine says... #7
I typically play Avatar of Woe alongside Thornbite Staff to kill anything I don't like on the board, and I usually do this alongside discard to keep opponents from having an immediate answer.
December 18, 2016 8:16 p.m.
bushido_man96 says... #8
Like others mentioned, I like to run it in reanimator themes. I've got a deck with Ertai, the Corrupted that I run it in. With blue, you can run a little countermagic to protect her.
I also run her in a Volrath the Fallen Commander, with reanimate/graveyard recursion theme.
December 18, 2016 11:15 p.m.
Avatar doesn't do anything on ETB, LTB, or have a game-breaking effect. I just don't have room in any Black deck I run for a creature like that, regardless of whether the creature costs BB or is overcosted at 6BB. If I'm going to spend one of my reanimate spells/abilities on a creature I want it to be something that has a larger payoff.
December 19, 2016 6:30 p.m.
PookandPie says... #10
It almost entirely depends on what your playgroup plays.
Like, you hold an Avatar of Woe in your hand in a combo meta and you're going to be cursing that it costs like 3BB while your opponents are dropping Thopter Foundrys, Exquisite Bloods, Deadeye Navigators, Rings of Brighthearth, Reveillarks, Auriok Salvagers, Mycosynth Lattices, Mind Over Matters, or, God forbid, Ad Nauseams and Doomsdays.
If your meta is mostly battlecruiser decks that win through a variety of combat strategies, Avatar of Woe will work. Most things work in this kind of a meta, so don't be too worried about it. If people mostly play with creatures, then most likely 1 or 2 sweepers will wind up bringing Avatar down to BB or so, no big deal.
If you're doing some kind of repeatable reanimation, you're probably just better off running Fleshbag Marauder and company (Merciless Executioner) than Avatar, who can cost too much mana when you need it, has summoning sickness when it finally comes in, and can't deal with any Voltron Commander because they almost ubiquitously run hexproof, shroud, and pro-black in one of the best Swords in Commander. Voltron tends to be a third tier strategy, too, so if Avatar can't deal with that, then why run it in the first place?
Odds are, though, if you're asking the question that you're right on the cusp of a meta slow enough where it could work and one where it would get destroyed the moment it becomes a nuisance- which, if that's the case, just run a more effective removal method over Avatar (one-shot removal that does its job well once is better than removal that never actually got to remove anything). It looks a lot better than it actually is since it is so incredibly conditional- a good example of a win-more card in that it will literally never help you win if you're behind (IE, the conditions aren't met due to a variety of opponent interference), and is a card that only helps you if you're already ahead.
Sim_Will_CMcantfindmehopefully says... #2
In my experience it never performs like I'd want it to, although by turn 4 is higher than normal cost, it just draws too much hate for it's effect.
December 18, 2016 12:04 p.m.