Help with Modern Jund without Tarmogoyf and Dark Confidant
Deck Help forum
Posted on July 12, 2017, 12:13 a.m. by Knight_of_Aces
I know this is a lengthy post but please bare with me. I've only been playing for maybe a year. Most of my knowledge is from what's in Standard right now. With so many cards I've missed, I have no idea where to start. What does a Jund deck want to accomplish? I know the basics but that's it. Budget is roughly $100. I'm just looking for a decent deck to play with friends but can be upgraded later. I also got lucky at pre-release and got a Nicol Bolas God Pharaoh. So I guess the same questions for Grixis as well. And how do you determine the mana base for a 3 color deck. Thanks for reading. I appreciate it.
rockleemyhero says... #3
Jund is a deck that is based off of value cards and attrition. That's why you see cards like Bob and goyf, both a bargain for 2 mana that can keep the pressure on your opponents while you use cheap removal such as Lightning Bolt, Abrupt Decay, and Inquisition of Kozilek to throw wrenches in their plans and keep them on the defensive.
That being said, you can absolutely make a budget rendition of jund! Use cards such as Putrid Leech, Blightning, and Sprouting Thrinax from the original jund deck that started it all. You can use cards such as Siege-Gang Commander to top your curve off, which was actually played in some of the original builds to help finish your opponents off. Lightning Bolt and Terminate aren't too expensive and shouldnt be excluded. Even cards like Sylvan Advocate is a decent substitution for goyf. There's a derelium 2 drop that can become a 4/4 that shouldnt be missed. Also, some of the delve creatures such as Hooting Mandrills or the black one aren't bad.
No offensive to glisteneragent, but if you are playing with friends and want to make a budget version of the same play style, you can absolutely build jund. Don't let budget become an obstacle for you; you aren't taking this to the pro tour or anything. Have fun, play what you want, and one of the most fun things you can do is find creative ways to build a deck within your budget. You'll surprise yourself (and others) with the powerlevel :). Let me know if youd like budget options for a decent mana base too. Good luck!
July 12, 2017 12:33 a.m.
Knight_of_Aces says... #4
rockleemyhero I appreciate your help. Any suggestions for mana, creatures or anything would help alot. GlistenerAgent Thanks for your suggestions too.
July 12, 2017 1:06 a.m.
ASocialistCactus says... #5
I'll go ahead and address your points one by one.
What does a Jund deck want to accomplish?
A Jund deck is a textbook example of what's called a "midrange" deck. A midrange deck is very special in that it can shift paradigms from being an aggressive, tempo-oriented deck to a grindy control suite that can pick your opponent's life total away. Jund is a shining example of this mostly because it can shift to whatever it needs to be at any given moment. Because if this, Jund is one of the most well-rounded decks in the format, with a roughly 50/50 matchup (give or take) against most any other deck that exists.
Budget is roughly $100
I'm looking for a decent deck to play with friends that can be upgraded later
If this is your end goal in mind, then you are essentially bringing an M1 Abrams to a water balloon fight. Jund is not a happy-go-lucky fun deck to sit down and casually play on the kitchen table to impress your friends. Jund is a monster, a tiger in it's jungle kingdom ready to pounce at any moment and tear you limb from limb before beating you to death with your own severed elbow. Playing Jund requires a trained mind, a good knowledge of the meta, and a whole lot of experience. I've been playing for about three years now and I'm still not too confident in my ability to pilot a Jund deck successfully at any Modern event.
So I guess the same for Grixis as well.
Jund and Grixis are two completely separate entities and very rarely play alike. Within Grixis there are many different archetypes, such as but not limited to: Grixis Delver (a personal favorite), Grixis Control, Grixis Cruel Control (yes, there is a difference), Grixis Death's Shadow, Grixis Reanimator, and so on and so forth. Grixis is a card combination that allows for many different strategies even within it's own colors. Jund Midrange is the dominant strategy within it's colors and (besides Jund Shadow which is very similar in construction) the only deck within it's colors that can put up tourney results.
And how do you determine the mana base for a 3 color deck?
It's simple. What are the three colors you play? For Jund, it's Red/Green/Black. My advice is pick lands that fit in most with your deck's strategy. If you run multiple colors in a deck, try not to run lands that only give you colorless mana. ESPECIALLY IF YOU'RE RUNNING THREE COLORS AND ABOVE. You do not want a hand full of spells that you can't play because you have the only colorless land in your deck in hand.
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My main emphasis is don't automatically assume that you have to play the highest tier deck. Experiment. See what cards work best together. Make your deck your very own. And above all, have as much fun with the game as you can.
July 12, 2017 1:23 a.m.
$100 won't get you a Jund deck in Modern. Don't be intimidated by the card pool. It's a lot to learn up front but the cards don't change like they do in Standard either. Serum Visions is the same card now as it was 5 years ago, as is Thoughtseize. It's actually easier to follow updates to the format once you've learned the staple cards and decks.
The easiest way to do a manabase for a 3 color deck is to count up all they symbols for each of the colors. Write them down if you have to. Then you just balance it like a fraction. If you have 8 blue symbols and 4 white symbols, that means you need 2 Islands for every 1 Plains. Try to avoid double color symbols in more than one color if you can.
July 12, 2017 3:30 a.m.
My advice is to leave the idea of budget-jund behind. It's just not the same, literally card for card.
Duress is not Thoughtseize. With the budget card, you get to look at your opponents Death's Shadow, with the non-budget card, you get to remove it.
Sylvan Advocate is not Tarmogoyf. It's not a threat until you've finally gotten to those 6 lands.
All the fixed-bobs isn't real-bob. Not even Asylum Visitor.
There is only one Liliana of the Veil. You can't really replace her meaningfully - either the casting cost then goes up, or the powerlevel down, or both.
Terramorphic Expanse is not a fetchland. It makes your playing slower, and makes you rely on basic lands, which are not as flexible as shocklands.
The thing about jund is that it plays the individually most powerful cards available, each of them not really relying much on other cards. So a jund player will be happy to put the game in top-deck-mode with neither player having anything on the table apart from lands, as it is probable that the jund deck plays a better threat on an empty table than most other decks. And this is also where the budget decks simply put "are not the same": Their ability to trade cards is smaller, and the threats they play can't end the game in the same way as the non-budget cards can.
I recommend going for something that works better of cheaper cards. There's plenty of decks like that. Start with rakdos, perhaps - you get some of the same spells for removal, discard, and damage, and you could start aquiring some of the BR lands for jund.
July 12, 2017 3:53 a.m.
Play R/G Ponza or B/G Death Cloud. Trying to play Jund Midrange on a $100 budget is like trying to compete in the Indy 500 using a beat-up Pinto that already has 10,000 miles on it.
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GlistenerAgent says... #2
I think you'd be better off starting with a cheaper deck. Mono-red Burn, Elves, GW Aggro could be good starting points. Most of the midrange decks are pretty expensive, as they play a lot of high-power cards that are staples of the format.
July 12, 2017 12:16 a.m.