Turn 4
Modern forum
Posted on June 2, 2013, 10:33 a.m. by HarbingerJK
I'm still a fairly new player to Magic, been playing just over a year now. I'm decidedly more of a kitchen table player but I have a few friends who play tournaments. Modern is also a preferred format for me because a majority of cards I like are not standard anymore. But recently I had a friend tell me that my modern decks are lacking a turn 4 strategy and that turn 4 is super important for modern. Can someone please explain to me why turn 4 is so important?
HarbingerJK says... #3
but why is it so dire to have a deck that can win by turn 4? Is it just because there a lot of decks that rush to victory?
June 2, 2013 11:50 a.m.
Turn 4 - simple answer modern is a fast format
Is the moment mid range decks really start to pick up steam, and hit that point where they can get out of control very quickly. a ramp deck is going to drop a fatty on your head, unless they really miss fire. Most aggro decks will have you looking at lethal if you have not already scooped. If a combo deck has not already gone off this is normally where they have corrected what ever they were missing through card filtering
Turn 4 is generally the point you know if you win or lose, turn 3-4 kills are very common in the modern format. Your 4 drops generally need to be bombs on this light. Unless you are a ramp deck then you can push to 6 drop bombs unless you are cheeky then the sky is the limit
There are also the life gain decks that push the limit of reason healing themselves for an nightmarish amount of life they simply grind you down as your attacks are in effective against the life gain. Infect decks make these decks into bad jokes
There are decks that will turn 4 Emrakul, the Aeons Torn given half a chance. Affinity and infect can push out lethal turn 2
in the case of control decks if they have board control at this point. You may as well bend over or have multiple threats/ outs waiting for them, because unless they miss play or the deck seriously misbehaves you are on their grind clock
T4 is also the board wipe round. Or at least where this threat becomes really viable .
These are all possibilities in competitive/ tournament decks, and more often than not true if you know your deck. If the decks or players are lop sided in terms if skills or quality of build this gap narrows to almost certain. If they are on equal footing this is more like a road side warning sign, have answer, a win condition or lose.
The other thing to remember is modern is a funny format that allows rogue decks to shine and pull down established decks, standard is more the flavour of the week with Thragtusk or Voice of Resurgence sprinkles
June 2, 2013 12:18 p.m.
alpinefroggy says... #5
Basically the above, but it doesn't have to mean a win by then. Only the fast decks can end the game then, instead the other decks that allow the game to continue probably have a board state or some set up has already won but the game isn't technically over.
June 2, 2013 12:32 p.m.
HarbingerJK says... #6
thanks toysm1th, everybody I've talked to has been like "cuz that's the way it is" and I hate answers like that. Magic is such a large game with so many possibilities, "cuz that's the way it is" just holds no water because the game is so complicated.
June 2, 2013 12:59 p.m.
4th turn "game over" isnt that rare, atleast to me and my friends. i've actually won the game done lethal damage (or won otherwice) at round 3 couple of times with my decks. and modern pyromancer ascension deck can easily win at round 3. but generally if you make a modern deck that will win "allways" at round 4 its gonna be really vunerable to anything that will brake the combo :P
June 18, 2013 3:53 a.m.
gheridarigaaz says... #8
Its why you'd run cheap cards (sadly in terms of mana cost, not price) that stifle opponents decks... hence the popularity of Spell Pierce , Thoughtseize etc...
They're not turn 4, but set back what would've been the fourth turn's combo-off to the 5th, 6th or 7th turn on your opponents side of the table.
i run a turn 2 win deck, if i'm lucky enough to draw a certain hand. A single disruption and i can't do a thing...
June 18, 2013 5:56 a.m.
both my modern decks burn and mill can take wins easy. Burn has a ton of 1 drops that do 3 damage and you have mill which i have cards that mill 10/8/7 for only two mana its a very fast format
July 7, 2013 1:46 a.m.
Decks don't normally win on turn 4, since the other player has an answer to it. Most decks if given an open player who just passes continuously can win by turn 4, but when you're playing against someone with removal, creatures to block etc. turn 4 wins aren't very common. It's only when the player doesn't do anything that turn 4 wins happen. You just need a way to answer early threats so you can achieve your deck's aim. Such cards are Damnation , and to survive until you can play it you may need something like Path to Exile or Doom Blade .
July 7, 2013 9:38 a.m.
gheridarigaaz says... #12
Infect.
I've only done it once.
Turn 1 land, Glistener Elf
Turn 2 land, 3x Mutagenic Growth and Groundswell ...swing
Mind you, my opponent was up against infect for the first time ever, so i doubt the scenario would ever play out the same way again...
July 8, 2013 10:46 a.m.
Also check out Todd Anderson's 11th place deck from GP Kansas City this weekend, a reanimator deck that tries to play Griselbrand on turn 2 and then attack with him enough times to kill his opponent before turn 2 is over (through Fury of the Horde and lots of card drawing). This one is consistent enough that I'd be surprised if it escapes the banhammer next time around. He said he got four turn 2 kills during the tournament, and one of them happened on camera. (He didn't win or even Top 8, but remember, a deck doesn't have to be successful to get the hammer: see Seething Song .)
Don't be scared off by the turn 4 thing though. Many decks can win on turn 4, not not many actually do win on turn 4. I think the speed of the format is very good right now.
MagicalHacker says... #2
A turn 4 win is not uncommon for a modern deck, I have also heard that a good modern deck can win by turn four consistently. There is one exception: decks that try to slow the game down through control. Just keep this in mind: the more cards you can choose from, the harder the competitive format. So Vintage > Legacy > Modern > Extended > Standard > Block.
June 2, 2013 11:47 a.m.