General edh ratios
Commander (EDH) forum
Posted on June 9, 2014, 9:40 p.m. by thirtydirtybirds
Hello, I'm working on putting together my first edh deck (Vorosh, the Hunter ). It's basic idea is creatures that make +1/+1 counters, and moving those counters around for shenanigans, including Sage of Hours abuse (with Sanguine Bond /Exquisite Blood combo for extra hilarity). I'm trying to get a general ratio for the various base elements I need in the deck. So far my basic layout is as follows:
Lands 36-40
Creatures 20-30
Disruption/Destruction 10-15
Graveyard recurring (creature/artifact/enchantment) 10-15
Enchantments 5-10
Artifacts 5-10
Moving +1/+1 counters 5-10 (I've only found about 5 so far)
Tutor/card draw 10-15
Now I understand there can and should be a significant amount of overlap like cycling lands, enchantments that recur creatures and others. I just am trying to get a good idea for how to balance the deck. Any advice or tips? Do these numbers look even close? Anything I've missed that is essential to have in a good edh deck? Not going for ultra competitive, i like a good dynamic game and do enjoy winning though. Thanks in advance!
"Enchantments" and "artifacts" are pretty broad strokes. An artifact could be anything from Sol Ring to Darksteel Forge to Arcbound Ravager to Lux Cannon . An enchantment could be anything from Wild Growth to Coastal Piracy to Phyresis to Oubliette .
Also, ratios vary wildly from deck to deck, and even from color to color. A Talrand, Sky Summoner or Melek, Izzet Paragon deck probably will run much fewer creatures, while a deck like Mayael the Anima or Ruric Thar, the Unbowed will want to run as many as possible.
One big thing I've noticed you're missing, like peru_soldi said in comment 1, is slots for ramp spells (unless you included that in tutor?).
June 9, 2014 10:03 p.m.
thirtydirtybirds says... #4
Yeah, I've got some ramp in the plan as well, forgot to add it. Probably 5 or so ramp spells. I don't count land tutoring as ramp, I generally think of ramp as a permanent that produces mana other than land. Plus ramp doesn't generally thin the deck like land fetch/tutor spells do. I only put rough artifact and enchantment counts as a reference for the number of graveyard recurrence spells.
I definitely realize that all of this is dependent on the specific cards, and the meta. I just am trying to lay a foundation to build upon, and don't want to start totally out of balance. I'm really used to standard and just trying to get a rough idea.
June 9, 2014 10:35 p.m.
lemmingllama says... #5
There are no set ratios. The best thing to do is to take all the cards that you want in the deck and add them together, then try to crop it down to 100. After that, try seeing if it ramps the way you want it. No deck will be perfect right off the bat, it takes a lot of playing and refining to get it just the way you want it.
Also you should consider some staples of EDH to fill some slots, like Sol Ring, Chromatic Lantern, etc. Always handy to have.
June 9, 2014 10:46 p.m.
NoPantsParade says... #6
I agree with lemmingllama. When I built my first EDH deck, I just added in cards I liked and that synergized with Thraximundar . After playing your deck, find what works and what doesn't work and then take the ones that don't work. Play cards that synergize with your commander/theme. There really isn't a ratio for a perfect commander deck. I think it depends on your playgroup but it's best to be prepared for anything.
June 9, 2014 11:05 p.m.
thirtydirtybirds says... #7
Yeah, that makes sense. I guess I'm probably overthinking it a bit. I'll get my deck list as it sits now types up and post it later, that will probably warrant better analysis. Thanks!
June 10, 2014 6:41 a.m.
Bobgalarneau says... #8
Only real ratio i use for building is for lands
40 - .5 land for each mana rock you add
Obviously it will also vary depending on your mana curve. I have seen elf deck at arround 32 lands with only 2-3 rock. Also seen big creature/ramp deck go 42-43 lands, even with some mana rocks....
Best advice, test and play your deck often so you can make adjustments
June 10, 2014 6:39 p.m.
I just talked to a friend who said he is doing the same. thirtydirtybirds were you at CJ'S this past Friday?
June 15, 2014 4:31 p.m.
Nevermind. Your decks Garruk the opposite of what my friend uses. I'll tell you what I told him. I always go 37 lands. The rest can vary depending on the deck. It's what you make it dude.
June 15, 2014 4:34 p.m.
Maybe think in terms of theme instead of artifact / instant / enchant / creature.
Land: 35 - 40
Theme: 10 - 40
Protection / Defense / Recovery: 0 -10
Utility (Ramp / Draw / Tutor): 5 - 20
Goodstuff (including Removal / Answers): 0 -20
Some themes overlap with utility / protection. The smaller the number of theme cards (ie if you are running a combo), the more tutors you will probably want. Otherwise, redundancy might provide sufficient consistency. Themes can be a lot of different things including but not limited to keyword, archetype, combo, or tribal.
The best configuration will depend on your meta. If there are many board wipes, lots of removal, or a tendency to "gang up" on players, then upping the defensive slot size is a good idea (or atlernatively, go with a combo and add plenty of tutors). If you use too many tutors, some people will start getting whiny about it, etc.
peru_soldi says... #2
No ramp?
June 9, 2014 9:44 p.m.