This game depresses me
General forum
Posted on Aug. 15, 2015, 11:03 p.m. by icehit6
I've been having a rough few weeks lately. Among other things, and as pathetic as it seems, Magic has actually kind of been bothering me.
First off, I feel like it's a huge part of my life now since I've started playing, and for that reason, I want to go competitive. Which is bad, because competition is expensive.
So, on to the next thing that's getting me down about this game. It's super expensive. In order to make an even somewhat competitive deck, you've gotta drop a few hundred dollars. I own a pretty competitive elf deck, but there's always room for upgrades even if I like it the way is is, and I just can't afford it. My deck is already reaching the 450 dollar range - which is a lot of money.
And then there's my friends who don't like playing me because literally the only deck I own is competitive and they can't keep up with it. They've been playing for years, and I've been playing since March, so I always say make something competitive, I'm trying to improve my deck, so I can't afford to make something bad.
Either way I look at it, I'm losing something - I'm either spending more money to improve a deck, and my friends complain at me because it's too competitive for them, or I stop improving my deck and focus on making a fair deck for them to play.
Trading isn't much of an option because in the amount of time I've played, I haven't bought a ton of packs. My collection is small, and I don't particularly have anything worth trading. So I've got a few questions.
How do I make my friends not hate me, but still focus on improving my elf deck and make it more competitive?
Are there other, cheaper ways I can acquire cards for a trade binder? Or are booster packs the best ways to get things for a trade binder?
By the way, my friends I play don't have bad decks. They're fairly good, just not 100% competitive. They don't have like 20 dollar starter decks, rather have 100-200 dollar decks but don't have enough reliability or consistency to keep up with my competition deck. That's why I'm having trouble prioritizing.
ThisIsBullshit says... #3
I asked a buddy of mine for a bunch of his commons and uncommons to boost my collection a bit.
I've got a problem similar to yours, and I solved it by making decks with just uncommons and commons or pauper decks, and playing my friends with those instead.
August 15, 2015 11:12 p.m.
I play competitively regularly at FNMs and I haven't been doing too badly. Consistent 3-1 records for three weeks now. With my friends, though, I just play casually. However, I don't really have a casual deck that can keep up with theirs other than my elves. And I don't play to lose really. I like at least a little fair ground.
Maybe I'll ask them to start doing drafts to acquire my trade binder. Doesn't sound like a terrible idea. I don't like buying decks outright because it just get's damn expensive, and takes up my paychecks. So I want to start acquring a trade binder.
August 15, 2015 11:12 p.m.
As for your first problem I had that issue except most of my magic playing friends play competitive too though I do try to build a goofy cheap deck on the side to use against non competitive players. As an idea that my competive and no competive friends found that worked decently is that if you have a decent amount of you, 6-8 you can always pool some cash for a booster box to draft from. At that point it comes down to skill of drafting and as a player with some luck and not who shelled out the most cash for a deck.
As for the second issue try going to an fnm in your area that runs draft. Usually it's about 15 bucks and that can help build a collection of cards. That's my best advice hope it helps.
August 15, 2015 11:15 p.m.
Thanks guys, I appreciate it. I'm really caught on this. Kinda gets annoying after a while as well. It's hard to choose between what you want to do and what your friends are pressuring you to do.
August 15, 2015 11:19 p.m.
Well, if you are buying packs, then I am surprised that you have little to trade!
You could build a set of decks across differing levels of competitiveness for your friends.
If you are going to buy sealed product, then a good option is to look for events and drafts and things.
If you aren' t playing standard AND you know what you already want (possibly by proxy playtesting), then buying singles online can be an affordable option.
A hidden benefit of going with events and drafting is that you can start having a wider pool of people to trade with. This opens the door to things like keeping up to date in standard with almost no additional cost by trading or selling off your value cards at rotation.
Finally, this is just a thought, but if you are finding that the competitive scene isn't contributing to your enjoyment, there is nothing forcing you to go that way. For comparison, lots of people enjoy cooking, gardening, playing music, and even playing sports without ever going competitive? Think about what it is that makes you feel the need to do that. If it's the presence of a meeting peanut gallery calling you 'bad', why would you care? Are you playing for them? Think maybe about what you are trying to get out of the game and about your expectations are - since you say you are feeling depressed about it ... Just a thought ...
August 15, 2015 11:21 p.m.
No, no, guessling, you're misunderstanding. I love the competitive scene. I'm depressed because it's expensive and my friends are pressuring me to make a fair deck for them while I'm trying to improve my current competition deck. I'm playtesting it, and as well I am using it in competitions and I love it. The downside it's expensive, but I can deal with that. I'm wanting to do it through trading to finish it off (it's competitive enough right now to destroy in FNMs, it's just a matter of lands now).
I don't play standard. I play Modern. Standard seems a lot more expensive to me because you constantly have to spend a very good amount of money upgrading your deck.
August 15, 2015 11:28 p.m.
I've never played EDH before. Is it fun? How does it work, and is it expensive? I don't want to spend any more money on magic than I already have. Unless it's for entertainment purposes like drafting.
August 15, 2015 11:29 p.m.
ThisIsBullshit says... #11
EDH is fun, yes.
Expense is all up to you, you can spend as much or as little as you want. I've got a Kaalia of the Vast deck that hit $1000, but I've seen people with $10-20 EDH decks.
Also, good luck building competitive if you can't drop the money on it. Magic is expensive, and I think we as players just have to realize it and suck it up.
August 15, 2015 11:34 p.m.
army88strong says... #12
I think I might have a solution to your first question. You can try introducing them to Pauper. In a format were only commons are allowed, you can buy a competitive deck and sideboard for ~$30-$40. This allows you to not only get into a format that has tournaments which allows you to be competitive, but you don't have to worry about the upgrading the deck with new staples as anything that you could need, would cost you just pennies on the dollar in most cases. Granted, some decks are more expensive because they run a playset of things like Serum Visions but that is completely dependent on the deck. most decks don't break the $40 mark for the 75.
As for your second question, I can't really help you out there except by saying to try Draft. It will help a little build your collection and, if your LGS is anything like mine, they hold Standard and Draft at the same time so when you are done drafting, you can trade away some of the big money cards for either upgrades for your competitive deck, or trade for some lower cost cards to make your collection grow a little.
If your friends play EDH, you could also get into it. If you buy a precon, you have a lot of the things needed for the deck. If you do go the draft idea, you can trade your draft pulls for random things to upgrade your commander deck.
August 15, 2015 11:44 p.m.
What you want out of the game is now different from what your initial play group of friends is still getting out of your afternoons of magic.
I'd suggest making friends with some of the competitive players at your local FNM spot, go early and play with those people. Then you can expand your competitive love of the game while still retaining your afternoons with your initial play group, which seems to be content staying at their more 'casual' level.
Know going into those afternoons that your there to have fun with friends, not sharpen your FNM skills. You've made it clear that they can't/won't step their game up, and getting depressed about their lack of desire to become more competitive isn't helping anyone.
Accept that they are staying at their current level of play and transcend above them, while also not making it their fault you don't have a decent group with which to hone your own competetive skills. It's not their fault. You need to find a group of players who you can do this with, likely at your local FNM spot.
August 15, 2015 11:44 p.m.
Well, I'm primarily an EDH player. My group of friends is very competitive. We all have certain interests we're very dedicated to but we're bound by a common love of EDH. Some spend tons of money on Standard. Others, like myself, prefer to build expensive ass modern decks. We're kinda left with 0 money at all to build towards the EDH decks that we want. That's a problem since we all want to play the very best the other people in the group can put together. As a result, we all proxy EDH decks with no restrictions whatsoever. Now, obviously this is a rather unique situation, but it illustrates how flexible EDH can be. Groups usually tend to accommodate the needs of their members.
August 15, 2015 11:53 p.m.
Thanks guys, I appreciate it. ThisIsBullshit I have no issue dropping some cash to make a competitive deck. I've already done that and my deck has come out quite nice, it just has a few things to clean up here and there with the landbase :) I know competitive is expensive and I'm willing to go with it.
It's just sad because my current friends (which are the ones who got me into the game) would always be so competitive with me and make me better, but once I took the time to research and take the game to a different level than them they just bash me all the time. Constantly telling me that I'm no fun to play and that I should drop 75-100 bucks on a deck that's fair for them to play, and getting ignored in the group because none of them like my deck. It's just not fun being bashed because I take the game a different way than them.
August 15, 2015 11:54 p.m.
I've tried to accomodate to their needs of making a deck that's more fair for them. In fact, I've made decks a lot more fair for them. Because my collection is tiny, I have like a few bulk rares and a bunch of uncommons and commons. Creating a deck that's maybe like 20 bucks to compete with 100 dollar decks gets difficult and ends up not being fun for me because I play and just get stomped because I can't compete with theirs. So it kind of gets like they expect me to take 100 dollars and make a deck that can compete with theirs, but not use my competitive deck. And they wont make decks that are crap to compete with my crap deck. So it's just a never ending circle of arguments I guess.
August 15, 2015 11:57 p.m.
Considering you don't already play standard, I wouldn't suggest arbitrarily going to a few magic origins drafts. It's expensive for one, and you'll likely go home after a draft with a hand full of useless bulk rares and uncommons you have literally no use for and worth nothing but pennies in trade value. For $15 you could buy a shock land for your elf deck or something comprable. Again, I do not advocate drafting if your not already playing standard. It's the equivalent of buying packs to start a trade binder, which we've already established is not a very good idea for someone in your position.
August 15, 2015 11:58 p.m.
If I shouldn't be doing drafts, how should I acquire my trade binder? I have my deck like 99% complete, I have maybe 25 dollars in lands to buy. 2 Nykthos, Shrine to Nyx, Pendelhaven, and Okina, Temple to the Grandfathers. I think after I acquire those, I should start to make a trade binder, correct? My deck is complete enough to start it I think.
August 16, 2015 12:01 a.m.
GlistenerAgent says... #19
This is unfortunate. The fact of the matter is that you are lucky as shit to own a competitive Magic deck. Becoming depressed over a game you started playing for the fun of it is silly.
The only Magic cards I own are four Scalding Tarns. I still have fun because I play the game for what it is, and I'm able to stay highly competitive because I learn what I can while making sure to avoid feeling bad. Magic isn't your job, so whenever it doesn't feel right to you, stop.
When it comes to your friends, either find new ones or deal. If they don't like your deck, bring a casual deck and play competitively at home. That, or find some people who can play at your competition level!
August 16, 2015 12:03 a.m.
Thanks GlistenerAgent :) I feel like I may not have been clear and made people misunderstand with my title and a little bit from my description. I'm not depressed at the game because I own a competitive deck and it's expensive. My friends are just difficult and I'm trying to cater and it's hard.
I love the game. It's fun, and playing competitively is my thing, and I really, really love it. I love learning about the game, and learning new tricks, and combos, and new ways to beat other players. It's just fun and my knowledge is ever expanding.
August 16, 2015 12:06 a.m.
GlistenerAgent says... #21
Try handing them proxied up competitive decks. I recommend Abzan at first because they won't think it's stupid (were you to give them Burn) or too complicated (Storm or some such). Figure out what they like to play and introduce them to competition through that style if you're bent on turning them to it.
August 16, 2015 12:12 a.m.
I just told you. For the cost of 1-2 draft's you could just buy the missing lands for your deck. Besides, let's say you do draft, let's be generous and say you go to four drafts, you get lucky and pull a Jace, Vryn's Prodigy Flip now you need to find a player at your shop willing to trade for that card in order to get the lands you need. OR, you could just buy the lands you need.
The whole idea of a 'trade binder' is the collectors side of the game. Do you want a collection of cards, or a competetive deck. They are two different things. Using a collection as trade fodder to acquire modern staples you need is a means to an end. Another means to the same end is to just buy the singles you need. You already told us you don't have a 'collection'. You also told us you want specific singles.
August 16, 2015 12:12 a.m.
I see. Sorry for misunderstanding.
I don't know what your deck is. I have nostalgia versions of my legacy and vintage (proxied) decks that are also cheaper versions. Some decks can be made in a 20 or 30 dollar version and some really can't.
It is also possible, from what you have said, that there are other issues at play between you and your old friends. Sometimes it happens that as people grow older, they also grow apart.
The beauty is that we can always make new friends. The great part about drafting and events is that while you are collecting cards, you are also meeting other people who are likely to feel the same way that you feel about the game.
Again, sorry if I am still not understanding - just a thought, like I said - take it or leave it. It just seems like there may be a lot going on here that I am not seeing and only you would know!
August 16, 2015 12:16 a.m.
Going to an origins draft won't solve the underlying issues with your 'casusl' play group. It also won't directly lead to you getting the remaining singles you need for your elf deck, however indirectly it might.
If you want to start a collection, drafting will do that for you, but it'll take longer than the grindiest control match you've ever played trying to building a collection one standard draft at a time.
Good luck with your issues.
August 16, 2015 12:43 a.m.
If your friends dont want to spend the money to keep up with your deck take $20 - $30 and build a deck with that. Or look for a deck thats already made in that price range. Its not a lot of money and they decks are sometimes good, not competitive at all, but still good enough to win games against casual players. I had to do this after I made a hyper control deck and people stopped playing with me. I hope this helps you out.
August 16, 2015 1:55 a.m.
Get your friends to build better decks and stop being whiny scrubs :/
August 16, 2015 2:35 a.m.
xlaleclx - Most people can't just drop hundreds of dollars on a competitive deck randomly - that's sort of what this whole thread is about. Before posting a witty comment that doesn't make sense, please consider reading the thing that you're commenting on.
August 16, 2015 10:21 a.m.
Thanks guys - I'm going over to play against them today :| out of the few drafts I've done, I've whipped up a blue red thopter deck to see if I can keep up with them and not piss them off. Hope all goes well.
I guess I'll just buy my last singles I need and then start drafting, because I do want to start a collection as this will be a very long term thing for me, and will be something that will be fun.
Thanks for all the help everyone :) feel free to share your stories on similar things that have happened to you.
August 16, 2015 11:21 a.m.
Didgeridooda says... #29
I build on the cheap. Just takes a little more time. I do use trades to get what I need for decks, but I have built many of my EDH decks for 10 or 20 bucks(money spent). I have a tight budget for the game, so these small assemble fee's are necessary for me. It is very doable to build on a budget.
I went through a bit of time where I was trying to dumb down my deck building to match play of my group. It can be tough, and even on my 10 dollar EDH decks I saw a large amount of hate, and complaints.
When you have the mindset of a competitive person it can be hard to dumb down. I did succeed a little, but I just started to ask them if I could use one of their decks that they weren't using. I just want to play, and have fun. Winning is secondary though always something I strive for.
If you are interested in budget EDH hit me up. That is my jam.
August 16, 2015 4:01 p.m.
Didgeridooda says... #30
Going back, and reading through makes it seem like you are just not compatible with your playgroup. Take the advice of getting to know other competitive players around you.
Not sure what the situation really is, but it sounds like there is more to it. You may have developed an attitude that is not fun to play with. Maybe just ask them directly if it is because your deck is strong, or another reason. If these are friends you want to keep investigate the root of the issue.
August 16, 2015 4:16 p.m.
ComradeJim270 says... #31
I have had this problem before, where there's a huge disparity in deck power level. My solution was to throw together some less powerful decks I can bring out against players who can't handle my more competitive stuff. It works very well, and having multiple decks allows me to offer different levels of difficulty. Sometimes less experienced players or those with weaker decks will request the easy ones, other times they want a challenge and will ask to go up against something harder. I'm happy to oblige either way.
EDH is an idea, it's a good equalizer. Because the decks are not as consistent, even a very expensive and well-constructed EDH deck can fizzle at times. Because it's a multiplayer format, more poorly constructed and inexpensive decks can sometimes take others by surprise and win it. There's also the possibility of a player whose deck is stronger being held in check by having multiple opponents. Also, a lot of good EDH cards aren't too useful in other formats, so you can put together a decent EDH deck or upgrade a pre-con without breaking the bank.
August 17, 2015 4:59 p.m.
If you've got any budget EDH decks you can refer me to, that'd be pretty cool. Always wanted to try EDH anyways, so having a good, cheap one would be nice.
I'm a generally pretty relaxed guy - I play to win obviously though. From what I've seen my friends just dont like the fact that my deck is impossible to beat for them - like none of their decks have even come close, and as well, because they've been very cutthroat with rules in the past, I tend to try to stick by the rules with them (other than friendly mulligans of course!), however I went to hang out with them tonight and all went well. I bought a bulk box and had all of us do a cube draft with it and it worked out really great. No arguments and everyone was happy that we were all on even playing ground.
August 17, 2015 9:26 p.m.
ComradeJim270 says... #33
SirFowler is pretty good with budget EDH. I'm not as skilled, but always looking for opportunities to get better. I usually try to build decks to people's playstyles, so it's hard to do with someone I don't know.
August 17, 2015 9:44 p.m.
Haha you know me man :P I love tribal and aggro! All you need to know
August 17, 2015 9:46 p.m.
ComradeJim270 says... #35
Yeah, I get you! I just don't get your playgroup if you wanted suggestions for them.
August 17, 2015 9:48 p.m.
Oh. Yeah, they can be a difficult bunch, but overall they're alright guys.
August 17, 2015 9:55 p.m.
They way I play is I create multiple low cost decks that have a wide variety of play styles. I have 27 total EDH decks, buts only a select few go above 150 dollars. What I do is create a cheap deck that's usually around 30-50 dollars and slowly build over time. That is because magic has so much to offer than one specific style.
I like having a bunch of variety because it gives me a chance to be the jack of all trades in each play style. I have some that are competitive, some that are hug style, and some that are just plain crazy just because they are fun to play.
Magic can be an addicting game because of all of the variety of cards that can be mixed to win. The best thing about commander is because it is a multiplayer format, you can create a dynamic where you rarely find in any other format. I love decks that have a hug element hidden inside because it gives the opponent an opportunity to help you in the future. It can backfire a bit, but that's the risk that you take when playing in a multiplayer game.
Unlike the 60 card format, edh is more open to possibilities because you are able to add more variety due to the singleton rule. That way you can create unique interactions that you wouldn't be able to see in any other format. It's just fun to see a card that would never be played in any other format be used as a main win condition in EDH.
TL-DR: There is so much variety in EDH that each deck is unique based on the player. Create multiple low cost decks and build over time. Using hug elements such as Howling Mine or Concordant Crossroads can allow the players to help people, which may be able to help you later in the game. Find unique interactions to spice up the game so you won't be bored.
These are the elements that allow me to be interested in the game for over 10 years now. I had an on again, off again relationship with magic, but ever since the edh format, I have been loving it ever since. I may be broke because of the game, but at least I have fun when I play. That's all that matters to me.
Arvail says... #2
You're just playing casually? Proxy a cheap deck that's just for funzies. Or ask them to proxy expensive decks if they want to step it up a notch.
No. Buying boosters to add to a binder is a terrible idea. Always just buy the singles you need to complete decks. If you want misc. value, start drafting regularly. You can even do this with your friends. Solves problem #1 too. Then you can just trade anything valuable for whatever.
August 15, 2015 11:08 p.m.