Suspend, Replication and Kicker

Asked by Akromathia 6 years ago

So, pretend for a second that I have Primal Amulet  ^Flip in play, and that Fight with Fire was suspended by Jhoira of the Ghitu.

a) When I cast Fight with Fire with no mana cost, can I pay de kicker cost?
b) If so, this cost is affected by Primal Amulet  ^Flip?
c) If I were to kick the spell, and the make a copy of it, would it be the kicked or normal version of it?
d) If I pay the kicker cost of Fight with Fire with Primal Wellspring, would it be copied?

Thank you in advance

Rhadamanthus says... Accepted answer #1

Yes, yes, kicked version, yes.

• Flashback is an additional cost, and you're allowed to pay it if you're using an alternative cost for the spell's base mana cost ("without paying its mana cost" is a type of alternative cost)
• Primal Amulet affects the total cost to cast a spell, including the effect of any alternative or additional costs
• Copy effects copy the decisions made when casting the original spell, including whether the kicker cost was paid. A copy of a kicked spell will be kicked
• The mana from Primal Wellspring will cause a copy to be made as long as you spend it on any part of the spell's total casting cost, whether it's the normal mana cost, an alternative mana cost, or an additional cost.

October 23, 2018 2:15 p.m.

Pieguy396 says... #2

a) yes, because it's an additional cost, as opposed to an alternate cost.

b) yes, for the same reason.

c) yes, because copies of kicked spells are also kicked.

d) yes, for the same reason as a.

October 23, 2018 2:16 p.m. Edited.

Caerwyn says... #3

One really tiny clarification, Rhadamanthus wrote "Flashback" when they meant "Kicker." I think that's apparent from the context, but I just wanted to be sure and clarify. Flashback is an alternative cost, not an additional cost, as was written.

October 23, 2018 3:27 p.m.

Rhadamanthus says... #4

Whoops. I was thinking about possible examples to give for alternative costs and got my thoughts all mixed up. Yes, I meant to say "Kicker" (I almost typed "Flashback" again right there).

October 23, 2018 3:35 p.m.

Akromathia says... #5

Rhadamanthus First of all, thank you so much for your answer, and for sharing your wisdom with this noob girl.

Well, this is marvellous... just one more question to make sure I got the right idea before going like crazy over this with my deck.

a) Just as with Primal Amulet  ^Flip, the kicker is also affected by Goblin Electromancer?

If so... Fight with Fire kicker cost, after resolving from suspension (Jhoira of the Ghitu) and with the above cards in play would only cost ?

If so, I am going to pass out xD

October 23, 2018 4:43 p.m.

Caerwyn says... #6

Correct - cost adjustments like Primal Amulet  ^Flip and Goblin Electromancer stack with one another.

Theoretically, with Primal Amulet  ^Flip, Goblin Electromancer, Arcane Melee, and Baral, Chief of Compliance, you could get the casting cost down to for a kicked version of the spell.

Alas, the only cards that reduce coloured mana symbols are Ragemonger and Edgewalker, and neither are particularly useful to you. So, you can't quite cost-reduce down to nothing.

October 23, 2018 4:55 p.m.

Akromathia says... #7

cdkime thank you so much for the clarification!

Ilumiridielli! This is nuts! and if we add the Primal Wellspring effect, 20 damage could be tossed to the face for as much as 1 or 2 mana.

And adding the Thousand-Year Storm effect, the damage output is insane!

Well, thank you so much... time to do some deck building :D

October 23, 2018 5:52 p.m.