Totally forgot about disciple of the ring, at least she is giving everyone a fun time coming up with lines. Do non drake lines just have to hope for an untap effect in hand?

Define non drake lines? I don't have any drakes in the deck.

When you get to protean hulk, vannifar remains tapped, how do you untap her deterministically in your chain? For example in the trophy lines she gets untapped by a hasted fatestitcher once for 4-5 then reanimated to pod the 5 into great oak, which untaps her for 6 to hulk, and the unearthed fatestitcher as well. Also the sage of hours combo is pretty shitty my man, since you are running 6 entirely dead cards that have no utility outside of the combo and one of them isn't even walking ballista. Why not grand architect pili pala walking ballista Rootwater Diver / Prophet of Distortion after the trophy mage line? Those cards are way less bad and are vannifars unique protean stack. Just my 2 cents.

Because the trophy mage line is shittier. Ezuri Hulk wins without haste, and any of the 0 drops can be cast from hand and/or start a Pod Chain. Our untap for Hulk isn't deterministic but it's also never once been a problem.

Loving the deck!

A question. How come no Natural Order? Should be an easy way to cheat out Hulk and then sacrifice in some way. Or is it too "slow"?

Cheers!

Dessa I never really considered it. My only issue is it doesn't actually sac hulk. I suppose that's a non-issue though lol. Will definitely test it.

This would help some common questions. Maybe have an FAQ in your description about the following

• What's the difference between hulk line in end step & hulk line in your turn?
• Requires more than 5 cards to be in the deck when hulking
• Cards are less effective in a game of cEDH
• Adds storm casting any 0 drops in hand
• More likely to have cards in hand that are hard to cast (ezuri, SoH)
• Allows for fewer interactive cards in deck
• Pieces are not viable to the deck's other strategies

If you address all of this in your description & any other ideas, you'll likely have less headaches (same for those who think you're mad for your choice). Instead of insisting SoH is better, give examples, reasons & statistics!!!

CyborgAeon I'm not sure what you mean on some of those points, can you clarify?

Tl;dr: Bro. So far your counter-arguments have been unsatisfactory, despite having been offered plenty of reasonable alternatives to the current playstyle. Help yourself by giving a satisfying answer with facts, reasonable calculations & examples.

Honestly the answer for the Sage pile question is really simple. It's just the only Simic Hulk pile that wins on its own. Sure there are more slot efficient lines, but they require Trophy Mage chains which take far more mana. And then you can't just win turn 1 or 2 off of Flash Hulk because you can't actually fetch the required haste off of your Hulk trigger. Thanks for clarifying, I'll get to that Q&A.

Hotcake_syrup suggested a hulk line similar to mine. Both can be found in the archives. Actually I believe I've suggested 3 options, of which 2 need an untap / haste... actually I now have a 6 card one that doesn't need haste & makes infinite mana. Here's option 4

Hulk > volrath's shapeshifter & phantasmal image & phyrexian dreadnought (both copies of hulk) > deadeye navigator, peregrine drake & prophet of distortion. Infinite mana. Draw your deck. EZ. Can be 5 cards if you just need infinite mana. Deadeye goes infinite with GoG & mana dorks (among lots of other options), peregrine drake is a deece af pod target (especially with minamo out), phantasmal image is great tech wise for creating copies of important cards on board, extra utility, shapeshifter (a harder to argue card, but not half bad. Can be used if you have another combo available and deadeye in hand - you can pitch him to enable other options.

Not saying this is most optimal. But from the outset - looks promising.

But then you need cards to actually win

I mean. If you change out your current hulk pile for this one, you already have the win included: Draw your deck with prophet. Play concordant crossroads. Play every creature in your deck. Flicker GoG infinitely. Swing for unbounded damage. Was that not obvious from "make infinite mana & draw your deck"?

It was obvious that once you draw your deck you need a wincon

and all those combo pieces are like a million mana, what if one is stuck in hand? That also makes us vulnerable to grave hate

Ok. So please, do tell how your previous combo was impervious to gy hate?

Furthermore: yes. Without sounding rude, I'm afraid that this combo is... pod-able. It also doesn't include creatures with 0 cost, that are just as dead in hand.

This combo includes:

A card that copies a value creature,

A card that enables multiple other combos,

A "reanimation" effect,

A good value pod target in a stax'd game (though it can be dead in hand),

A creature who wins you the game with infinite mana (but is usually quite dead)

A dead card.

This combo cuts out the following (I'll let you be the judge of how relevant the cards are to a game of cEDH based on their descriptions)

A 0/6 that has to be played once another piece is in play.

A 0/2 flier

A 1/1 beater

A 3/3 card that is only goof as a combo piece

A 1/1 card that functions as a win con, in conjunction with 1 other card & set up.

Keeping in mind that all of the 0 drops can't be fetched via pod if flash gets praetor's grasped.

I'm pretty sure you aren't understanding how the deck works. I don't run value creatures that need copied, I don't need to enable multiple combos, reanimation makes us weak to grave hate. My combo is not weak to grave hate because it does not use the grave. Flash is not my primary wincon, Hulk is and I'm not trying to pod into my combo pieces. All of the 0 drops can start a chain and are fetched off of Hulk as part of my wincon. Every single piece of my combo can easily be cast from my hand.