How does Sudden Spoiling affect Combat Phases?
Asked by Hydronvanquisher 7 years ago
Hi all, I've been reading up on Sudden Spoiling for a little while now and believe I have a basic understanding of it. However, I am still a little confused on how it would play out in the following scenario:
My opponent is the active player. Let's say I have a Zulaport Cutthroat and a Butcher of Malakir already out on the battlefield and my opponent has Void Winnower, Prized Unicorn and a Skyrider Elf on the battlefield.
My opponent decides to attack me with everything. After he declares attackers, and finishes casting any spells, he passes priority. I presume this is where I would either declare blockers or cast an instant and then declare blockers.
Could I cast Sudden Spoiling and then since the spell temporarily negates the static ability of Void Winnower (meaning I can block with an even CMC creature), declare my two creatures as blockers and then proceed?
I'm assuming I can but wanted to confirm I wasn't overlooking anything.
As a new wrinkle, what if during my casting step (prior to declaring blockers and prior to casting Sudden Spoiling) I decide to cast Quicken and then Act of Treason on his Void Winnower? I then decide to cast Sudden Spoiling and let combat proceed. What happens to his already declared Skyrider Elf if the CMC is even? He's declared it as an attacker but now that I have a Void Winnower on the battlefield (albeit temporarily) under my control, is it still an attacker or does it remain tapped but no longer have the ability to proceed to combat damage?
Sorry if this is a bit convoluted but I wanted to make sure I have an understanding. Thanks for any advice/info you can all offer.
Also, once a creature is declared as an attacker or blocker, it remains attacking or blocking unless it is removed from combat. Even if something happens to make it so the attack or block wouldn't have been legal, as long as it was legal while it happened, it remains fine. (such as if you stole a Blazing Archon instead of a Void Winnower.
October 9, 2017 12:10 a.m.
Hydronvanquisher says... #3
Thanks Bio and Neotrup, I appreciate the quick reply and explanation/confirmation.
So for my second question, it appears that since attackers have been officially declared it won't matter once I take control of Void Winnower and use it to defend against my attacking opponent. He can attack with both even numbered and odd numbered cmc critters; correct? Bio's response indicates my opponent can't attack (but still can with odd numbered cmc creatures) but Neotrup's response indicates my opponent can attack with both even/odd numbered cmc critters. Sorry to belabor this point but it can be a tad confusing.
As a last question on this topic (Question 2), what would happen if I decided to first cast Sudden Spoiling before I declared blockers and then decide to cast an even cmc spell such as Grab the Reins? The Void Winnower and all other creatures my opponent controls become base 0/2 and lose some of their abilities due to the Sudden Spoiling so I'm presuming those effects take precedence and remain in effect once I take control of the Void Winnower. Is that correct? If so, it doesn't sound like a feasible option I'd want to pursue.
October 9, 2017 2:14 p.m.
Rhadamanthus says... #4
I'm not sure which part of Blo's response is causing the confusion, but that's not what it says. The point is that in your example attackers have already been declared and there's no way to go back in time and change any of the declarations as a result of your responses.
In your follow-up question: yes, the creature you steal will be a 0/2 with no abilities if you played Sudden Spoiling first. If a resolving spell or ability changes the characteristics of any objects, the set of objects it will affect is locked in at the time it resolves. Changing control of the creatures after Sudden Spoiling resolves won't change which ones it affects.
October 9, 2017 2:31 p.m.
Hydronvanquisher says... #5
Got it. Thank you Rhadamanthus. I think my uncertainty stemmed from what appeared to be two slightly different worded responses to my question. I appreciate the clarification.
I think I was initially struggling with the concept of the limitations of Sudden Spoiling and previously resolved actions. However, I understand now.
Thanks all, for your patient answers.
October 9, 2017 2:57 p.m.
I think the main point of confusion is that Void Winnower does nothing, in any circumstance, to prevent attacking. It's effects only prevent casting of spells and blocking.
October 9, 2017 5:35 p.m.
That was what I said indeed. But that's okay, I can see how it caused confusion. I'll try to rephrase my wording next time, and formulate clear and simple.
Glad you understood it anyways ;) Even though it took a few more posts.
Blo says... Accepted answer #1
Hiya, thanks for the elaborated question ;).
First scenario, your opponent has two creatures with effects that affect the blocking phase. In order to utilize Sudden Spoiling to block freely, you'd have to cast it before blockers and after attackers. This way you get to block whatever you want and will most likely kill the 0/2. Your question does all this correctly.
Then for your second question, please remember that Void Winnower does nothing to prevent your opponent from attacking with (un)even mana costs. So all that does nothing good. Also remember that creatures with a cost of X in their cost on the battlefield will be counted as X=0 as far as Void Winnower goes, so the Skyrider Elf, no matter the casting cost, will have a converted mana cost of on the battlefield.
If you have more questions, feel free to ask them ;)
October 8, 2017 5:27 p.m.