If I played Mycosynth Lattice and March of the Machines, would it make my planeswalkers creatures or not?
Asked by ThatGuy_OhWhatsHisName 1 year ago
Mycosynth Lattice makes all permanents artifacts so would that apply to planeswalkers? If so, surely by the same logic March of the Machines would make them creatures, right? Am I missing a rule that stops this interaction from happening?
I was just looking at the rules of planeswalkers now and I couldn't found a specific rule saying it couldn't happen. In a part of the wiki it said:
- Planeswalkers can't attack (unless an effect such as the one from Gideon Jura's third ability turns the planeswalker into a creature).
Which sounds like it could include this interaction. The only other mention of creatures states that:
- Creatures can attack planeswalkers (which has nothing to do with my question).
- Planeswalkers are not creatures (which I assume is stating that planeswalkers in their natural form are not creature but not necessarily stating that they can never be creatures which would contradict Gideon Jura's third ability).
I have always lead to believe that the interaction couldn't happen. I never got an explanation why though. Seeing a lack of clear ruling on the matter has just made me doubt what I had been told. Any help on this matter would be greatly appreciated.
The interaction in question would happen the way you think it does.
A planeswalker permanent is not a creature ("Creature" on the type line) unless some outside effect turns it into one, like the ability you'll find on every (or at least almost every) Gideon planeswalker, and also some Sarkhan planeswalkers.
Mycosynth Lattice essentially adds "Artifact" to the type line of any permanent that isn't already an artifact. This includes planeswalkers.
March of the Machines turns any artifact that isn't already a creature into an artifact creature, adding "Creature" to its type line. This includes any non-creature permanents that have been turned into artifacts by Mycosynth Lattice, like planeswalkers.
So after the two cards' effects have been applied, Gideon Jura will have a type line that reads "Legendary Artifact Creature Planeswalker - Gideon."
October 15, 2018 2:01 a.m.
Kogarashi, could I give a planeswalker indestructible once it is a creature? If so, does that mean that it doesn't die when taking lethal damage?
October 15, 2018 6:50 a.m.
Yes, you could give a planeswalker indestructible once it's a creature. There are also three cards that can give a planeswalker indestructible when it's not a creature (Aegis Angel, Boros Charm, and Renegade's Getaway), just for reference.
However this won't necessarily protect it. While it won't die due to taking lethal damage due to having indestructible as a creature, as long as "Planeswalker" is still one of its types, taking damage will also cause it to lose loyalty counters, and if it reaches zero loyalty, it will be put into the graveyard as a state-based action, even if it's indestructible, same as if a creature with indestructible is given -X/-X such that it's toughness becomes zero. You would need damage prevention to save your planeswalker.
October 15, 2018 8:35 a.m.
Kogarashi, I forgot about the loyalty counter being take off for damage. I understand it all now. Thanks for all the info. I wish you all the best.
October 15, 2018 9:03 a.m.
Also important for this scenario: 0/0 lands die, which makes having mana difficult for all players.
October 15, 2018 10:26 a.m.
Neotrup, fortunately not for me. I have a way of giving my lands +X/+X upon entering the battlefield, where X is the number of creature I control. It's a combo/interaction between a couple cards in my sliver deck and will be set up before summoning both Mycosynth Lattice and March of the Machines, well at the very least summoning them both together. Thanks for the tip though. I held off from including both the cards together for the very reason you stated. Then after realise I could pull it off, I added it in. Regardless, your input is greatly appreciated and I wish you all the best.
October 15, 2018 3:04 p.m.
Also, please remember to mark Neotrup's answer as accepted so this can be removed from the unanswered queue.