Question on a Sequence of a Turn
Asked by DaddyRabbit78 9 years ago
I'm a beginning player, this was my first game and my friend (who has played enough to be able to teach) was showing me how to play. He had a customized Mono-Black and I was playing with stock "Seize Control" which is Red/Blue.
Even he said that he wasn't sure on how we were to proceed, so this is definitely NOT a "did my friend cheat me" sort of post. It may get confusing, so here we go:
He put Skithiryx, the Blight Dragon out with Haste and an Artifact Equipment that allowed for him to immediately equip it. In the end, Skythy was able to deal -7/-7. Of course, I couldn't block so down 7 poison counters I was.
On the next two turns, I played Gigantoplasm, made a copy of Skithiryx with 3/3, and hit him for -3/-3 so now he has 3 poison counters.
Over the next few turns, I cast AEtherize to send his Skithiryx back to the Command Zone and he cast a flying creature that had 2/2 and Infect. So, with my next turn, we have his Skithiryx in the Command Zone, my copy of his Skithiryx (Gigantoplasm) with his lone 2/2 flying Infect creature on the battlefield.
Here's where it gets tricky:
I try to play Rite of Replication. I turn my lands to play it, put my card on the table, and announce, "Rite of Replication. I want to make a copy of Gigantoplasm which my Skithiryx" (I'm thinking that should have just made a copy of Gigantoplasm instead of a "copy of a copy", but he didn't correct that). Immediately he says, "Stop!", then casts an Instant that says "Destroy target creature". He declares that he is going to destroy my Gigantoplasm/Skithiryx. So, I said, "Okay, I just copied this creature and you get to destroy one of them." He said, "This is not a counter, this an interrupt."
So, he destroyed my Gigantoplasm leaving his 2/2 creature as the only creature on the field. So I said, "Since I didn't get to cast this (you interrupted it), I get to put it back in my hand and use the unspent lands." He said I can't do that. My choices were:
Discard Rite of Replication (using it on nothing) and tap the lands used to cast it or use Rite of Replication to copy his 2/2 creature and tap my lands. Either way, RoR was going in the graveyard and the lands would be tapped. Of course, so the Sorcery wouldn't go to waste, I made a token of the 2/2. On the next turn, they killed each other, he brought Skithiryx back out, and hit me for the remaining 3 poison counters.
Game Over.
Did we follow the rules correctly?
Side questions: If I were to hit his Commander with Infect and put, say, -3/-3 on him, if his Commander went back into the command zone (by either defeat or magic), would those counters remain when he brings him back out? Two, I used Mizzix of the Izmagnus as my Commander. If she's forced back to the command zone with experience counters, does she lose the experience counters when she comes back out?
Sorry for the long post, but thanks!
DERPLINGSUPREME says... #2
if I'm understanding correctly, this is sooo wrong
if the spell resolved with no legal targets no lands should untap. the mana is spent.
also, should be in Q&A
March 16, 2016 11:52 p.m.
BloodoftheBloodMoon says... #3
You shouldn't have been able to retarget something after casting a spell. Once you cast a spell, you announce the targets. In this case, your Gigantoplasm copying the Skithiryx, the Blight Dragon. Once you cast the spell and announce the targets, your opponent has the opportunity to respond to your spell. In this case he kills the target. Now that your target has died, Rite of Replication no longer has a legal target, and therefore fizzles (meaning it does nothing) and goes to the graveyard.
As for the side question, the counters would leave unless told to otherwise. As for the experience counters, you gain the experience counters like you do with poison counters. They're not on a creature, they're just there. So you get to keep the experience counters. -1/-1 and +1/+1 counters do leave though.
March 16, 2016 11:55 p.m.
PhotogenicParasympathetic says... #4
Also worth nothing, Skithiryx, the Blight Dragon is a 4/4. When you Gigantoplasm enters the battlefield, it becomes a copy of Skythryx, which makes it ALSO a 4/4. However, at any time, you may tap X mana to make it an X/X instead. So when you hit him for 3 infect, you spent three extra mana, to hit for one less poison.
March 17, 2016 12:10 a.m.
Raging_Squiggle says... #5
It's worth noting that when targeting Gigantoplasm, you aren't obliged to say what it's going to come in as a copy of until the token copy begins to enter the battlefield, which at that point it's too late for anyone to do anything.
Let's slow things down a second:
Non-active players cannot perform any action until they receive priority. In this scenario, the time your opponent gets priority would be after you have cast your spell and declared your target(s). In response to Rite of Replication your opponent can cast Murder on the creature being targeted. Then as the ROR goes to resolve, it fizzled due to lack of a legal target. Your mana has already been spent, and you cannot reverse the game backwards to re-target just because he destroyed Gigantoplasm.
Whenever any permanent changed zones, any counters on that permanent cease to exist. This is because the permanent card becomes a new object with no history of its previous existence. (Note that Skullbriar, the Walking Grave keeps the counters because his ability specifically says so and abilities on cards always overrule the game rules.)
note that Mizzix of the Izmagnus says "...you get an experience counter." You. They are put on the player like poison counters. Note that there is currently no method to remove experience counters, but they can be proliferated via cards like Inexorable Tide because proliferate can affect all types of counters in the game.
March 17, 2016 12:17 a.m.
DaddyRabbit78 says... #6
Thanks for the responses, I'll let him know he/we proceeded correctly!
As I said, it was my very first game and we weren't really clear on the procedure.
March 17, 2016 12:44 a.m.
Steelspike says... #7
Tolarian Community College on youtube has instructional videos on how to play. I'd recommend checking that out for a good, detailed tutorial/walk through.
March 17, 2016 2:40 a.m.
VaraSatoshiOfficial says... #8
If a spell would make the target no longer valid before the spell resolves, it would fizzle, and because you already declared your target as your Skithiryx, the Blight Dragon, as you cast the spell, the target was permanently decided. You cannot change your target to his creature, and your spell fizzles.
pskinn01 says... Accepted answer #1
WHen you cast Rite of Replication you have to pick a target. If all targets of a spell are no longer valid, the spell does nothing and is put in it's owner's graveyard. All the mana was still spent on the spell, it just is countered by not having any of the chosen targets being legal anymore.
Counters on permanents (like creatures) do not normally follow them into other zonez (there are exceptions to most rules).
Experience counters are given to the player not the commander, so they do not reset just because the commander changes zones.
Also, this should of been put in the rules Q & A forum linked at the top (or in the menu if on mobile).
And Rite of Replication on a legendary creature (or a copy of a legendary creature) that you control will result in all but one of them going to the graveyard due to legendary rules.
March 16, 2016 11:51 p.m. Edited.