Commander vs Multiplayer 60 Card
Commander (EDH) forum
Posted on May 28, 2025, 7:37 p.m. by Niko9
I really like both formats, but just wanted to see what everyone thought on how 60 card multiplayer games go in your groups compared to commander.
4+ player casual 60 card is the first format I played back in the day, and it's still kind of my favorite if I have the choice. Games don't go as long as commander, everyone's deck does it's thing, and players seem to build closer to 1v1 decks just with added toolbox functions for the late game.
I do think that commander does create bigger and crazier board states and that can be so fun, but I really struggle sometimes with the first few turn cycles in EDH where not much is happening and players get quickly disinterested until bigger things start happening.
Though I will say that 20 life multiplayer takes a really good group to have fun with because two players can almost always team up to take someone out, and if it's not friends, that would probably be super tough to deal with. But what do you all think? Could there be a world where multiplayer 20 life non-singleton can ever be a format? Would it take an insane ruleset and banlist to make it work?
Also, I do think that multiplayer 60 has to have a few specific rules to go well. I feel like there almost needs to be a no deals rule, because players can so often knock each other out, it would make the game unbearable to say, if I don't attack you have to do X thing. Plus, it's part of the fun to not attack people because they can help you with a bigger threat, and then sometimes that player who was kicking around on 2 life for a while can steal wins, and that's awesome. The other is no deck outs, we usually play to shuffle up your graveyard because otherwise people just randomly drop out of the game with 0 interaction to it.
I used to play a fair bit of 60-card multiplayer games. I don't think that the overall dynamics are that different from commander aside from games generally being a bit faster due to the smaller life totals. Aggro decks still have issues putting out enough pressure to beat 3 opponents before they stabilize and infinite combos are still the easiest way to win through 3 opponents' worth of resources.
60-card decks are more focused on their game plans though, so they are going to play out the way they are supposed to more often than casual commander decks despite not having a guaranteed card in the commander zone. The smaller deck sizes and not being restricted to singleton means that 60-card decks probably won't run the same range of possible removal/answers that commander decks do so I think that there is a higher chance of strong non-creature cards running away with the game.
I'd say that there are, in general, less opportunities for the weirdness and crazy interactions that happen in Commander to happen in 60-card multiplayer games. You also lose out on the deck-building restrictions that colour identity imposes on commander decks. Without those, I think that 60-card multiplayer games lack a bit of the charm that commander games provide, thus why Commander is so popular while 60-card multiplayer isn't.
If you want an example of what a 60-card deck designed for multiplayer games could look like, this is a list that I built that scales up in power with the more opponents that it is facing: Waste Not Your Foolish Lives - Archenemy
May 30, 2025 6:23 a.m.
One time we had a pod of 3 people and tried playing a game of Two-Headed Giant with one of the partners being Garruk the Slayer (that M15 prerelease mega-ultra planswalker).... it was a unique experience.
Jank ideas aside I love the concept of 60 card multiplayer formats like oathbreaker and others but have yet to really like them in the same way it can be so hard to get balanced games on a whim in EDH it just takes so much work and planning with rules to make it feel right.
May 30, 2025 11:03 a.m.
FormOverFunction says... #5
I played a lot of multiplayer 60-card as well, back in the 1990s. We had fun, but started adding variants to shake things up. One of the game types that I remember was “four seasons” where you put an effect into play for each season. So we start in summer with Mana Flare. After turn one for everyone, you then swap in something else for autumn. It’s the only way people have really enjoyed Winter Orb in my experience; it’s coming next turn, and will go away the turn after that. The other game we loved was “five-pointed star.” You need five players, each with a mono-color deck; one white, one blue, one black, one red, and one green. The players sit in the same pattern as on the back of magic cards. The white player is adjacent to two semi-teammates (blue and green) and facing two enemies (red and black). They would stack their decks with stuff like Justice and White Knights to really slam their opponents. The person to eliminate their two opponents gets 2 points and their (surviving?) teammates each get one point. The difficulty is that Green’s teammate White is trying to kill Green’s teammate Red. I miss those days so much. It’s probably easier to skip the color requirement for the decks and just get five people to sit in a circle and utilize the “overlapping teams” structure for the game… though I do LOVE restrictions.
May 30, 2025 12:55 p.m.
Crow_Umbra says... #6
My friends and I first started playing MtG via 60 card table top jank around 2013, when we were in college. We used the Modern card pool to keep things defined for ourselves, but nothing we brewed was anywhere near the meta at the time.
Depending on how many of us there were at any given game night, we typically played either 2 Headed Giant, or a more Commander-esque free for all. We quickly learned that Group slug and Edicts were pretty strong in our battle-cruisery games, when most of us were trying to go wide in some way.
If there were ever more than 4-6 of us (I think the most we had any given point was 8), we would either split off into two groups, and shuffle group makeups between matches, or we would do an especially crazy free for all variant one of our friends called "Lunch Room". All of our Lunch Room games were like Super Smash Bros with all of the items enabled, just absolutely wacky stuff. For Lunch Room, players draw up to the full 7 at each of their turns, but also get to drop all of their lands each turn. Thankfully, I don't think any of us ran Landfall at the time. My friend said the name was coined from trying to play MtG during high school lunch breaks, and trying to make the games as quick as possible.
I'd recommend trying Lunch Room shenanigans at least once for the laughs. My friends and I are overdue for one of those games, but we mostly play Commander now.
May 30, 2025 1:54 p.m.
legendofa I actually forgot about 2 headed giant, and I don't know emperor, so may have to look into a few things : ) But yeah, so true about group dynamics and how it can make different formats work. We usually have at most one more competitive player, so it often balances that they get ganged up on, but I can see how more than that can devolve quick.
June 9, 2025 7:54 p.m.
SaberTech So true about the crazy charm of commander, and yep, I love me some commander games too, but I think what I really enjoy in 60multi is that I can bring a few decks, play a few games, switch in between and adjust to what's going on.
And I will say, I actually see a lot more spot removal in 60 card, and I kind of like that better than boardwipes that are often just way more efficient in EDH. I feel like everyone just stays more engaged and making decisions rather than people sitting on boardwipes until things get out of hand. It lowkey drives me nuts when someone in commander is not playing much of anything and waiting to clear everything to start playing.
June 9, 2025 8:01 p.m.
Icbrgr I hear that! I guess in the end, balance is everything, and wherever a group can find a fun balance is where it will be the best time for everyone.
Commander is definitely still the best way to jump into a new group and get some games, I just feel like after a while with a group you can go down a really deep meta hole in 60multi where every player is changing up who and how they target, because every player can't possibly defend themselves against everyone else together, where in EDH players can much more feasibly 1v3 everyone if they have insane plays.
June 9, 2025 8:11 p.m.
FormOverFunction Those are some really creative and awesome game ideas! The five pointed star game seems like it would have so much going on and everyone would be so engaged with everything because of how fast things can flip in a 5 way alliance/standoff. I really love commander but I think the thing I find the hardest in it is how much of the game can be something where there isn't a lot of interaction, sometimes it feels like each player is just doing their deck's set up thing then pass. The crazy turns in commander are the best, but like the first 5 turns...they might be typically the least interactive in all of magic, and I more and more struggle with it.
Maybe every play group just needs somebody every now and then who's like, hey I've got an idea for a subgame like 5-pointed star, let's play a few : )
June 15, 2025 7:28 p.m.
Crow_Umbra Lunch room sounds amazing! I'd love to try it out sometime with a deck full of combat tricks like Giant Growth The explosive attacks that come from drawing all new seven and then using every single one, sounds kinda amazing : ) Though maybe it's a format where it's best just to bring existing decks and jam games. If everyone really put their minds to making broken Lunch Room decks, it would be the most brutal meta ever : )
Such a good idea!
June 15, 2025 7:37 p.m.
Crow_Umbra says... #12
It's funny that you mention Giant Growth, Niko9, as that was one of the "staples" of our playgroup at the time. Combat tricks were the name of the game, and we had a blast.
We typically only did Lunch Room if we had a big enough group that warranted the accelerated play. Sometimes we'd leave it for one of the last couple games of the night, to squeeze in one more before everyone realized it was 3am lol.
June 15, 2025 7:48 p.m.
Crow_Umbra Great minds : ) Though I do maybe just like combat tricks way too much. I feel like most of my deck ideas are, how do I make this jank thing work, and I'm always like...hmmm...combat tricks?
And yep, love those game nights that go maybe too far, every now and then at least.
legendofa says... #2
I assume this is all free-for-all, and not a team game like Two-Headed Giant or Emperor.
My group played a lot of casual Modern for a while, and there could be some ganging up. It wasn't unusual for the more competitive-minded players to take over the table and wipe everyone else, then face each other for the win. I ended up defaulting to a deck that just loaded up on instant-speed alt-wins and combos. But that group had other deeper issues.
I do recommend checking out some of the semi-official team formats, if you haven't tried them. Most of them can easily be played under any format deck restrictions--Modern, Legacy, EDH, Cube, the collection chaff formats from the other threads, whatever you want. It's been a long time since I played Modern 2HG, but it's a good way to change things up.
May 28, 2025 9:43 p.m.