Edrek Sahr + "can't be sacrificed" causes infinite loop?

Asked by TehGrief 1 year ago

Recently, an argument has been held regarding Endrek Sahr, Master Breeder equipped with Assault Suit.

Endrek Sahr, Master Breeder's ability reads "When you control seven or more Thrulls, sacrifice Endrek Sahr, Master Breeder.",

however, Assault Suit's ability reads "...and can't be sacrificed."

Does Assault Suit negate Endrek Sahr, Master Breeder's self-sacrifice ability? Or does this become an endless loop that causes the game to become a draw?

Thank you for your time.

TehGrief says... #1

The rule, for reference, is;

"104.4b If a game somehow enters a loop of mandatory actions, repeating a sequence of events with no way to stop, the game is a draw."

December 5, 2017 10:35 p.m.

Neotrup says... #2

When you control seven or more Thrulls, Endrek Sahr, Master Breeder's last ability triggers. It will not trigger again while it's on the stack. When it resolves, the ability will do nothing, because Assault Suit prevents you from sacrificing Endrek Sahr, Master Breeder. Then, if you still control seven or more Thrulls, the ability will trigger again. This loop can be shortcutted to nothing happening and thus evoking rule 104.4b, unless there is a method in revealed zones (such as a Ashnod's Altar on the battlefield under your control) or a player chooses to use a method that is not revealed (such as a Rout in hand). In the case of the former, you are required to end the loop, but in the case of the latter you are not.

December 6, 2017 1:37 a.m.

chosenone124 says... #3

Neotrup They do not have to end the loop by sacrificing to Ashnod's.

719.5. No player can be forced to perform an action that would end a loop other than actions called for by objects involved in the loop.

Example: A player controls Seal of Cleansing, an enchantment that reads, "Sacrifice Seal of Cleansing: Destroy target artifact or enchantment." A mandatory loop that involves an artifact begins. The player is not forced to sacrifice Seal of Cleansing to destroy the artifact and end the loop.

December 6, 2017 8:30 a.m.

Neotrup says... #4

I stand corrected. I might be referring to how the rules used to work, or was misinformed at a previous point.

December 6, 2017 12:20 p.m.

TehGrief says... #5

chosenone124, Neotrup;

To confirm,

With or without a way to end this loop, it is still entering the conditions listed in 104.4b?

December 6, 2017 6:13 p.m.

chosenone124 says... Accepted answer #6

Yes. If neither player is both willing and able to end the loop the game will end in a draw

December 6, 2017 7:07 p.m.

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