Wild Ricochet + copy spell="infinite"?

Asked by Nightstlkr 9 years ago

if Wild Ricochet copies and type of Twincast type effect, does it create infinite copies? have Twincast copy Wild Ricochet putting 2 copy effects on the stack. because there will now be two targets of Twincast on Wild Ricochet you do this again for 4 copies, 8, 16, etc etc etc

MindAblaze says... #1

Wild Ricochet has to resolve to get the copy of Twincast so you can't target Wild Ricochet with the copy because it no longer exists on the stack.

November 14, 2014 11:27 a.m.

Nightstlkr says... #2

Can the ricochet copy itself though?

November 14, 2014 12:13 p.m.

Nightstlkr says... #3

I misread your comment, thank you.

November 14, 2014 12:16 p.m.

Epochalyptik says... Accepted answer #4

@MindAblaze!: That's not wholly true.

So let's say the stack is like this:
TOP
Wild Ricochet targeting Twincast
Twincast targeting Shock
Shock
BOTTOM

Wild Ricochet will resolve, allowing you to change the target of Twincast and copy it. Wild Ricochet is still on the stack at this time (a spell or ability leaves the stack as the last step in its resolution), so it is a legal target for either the original or the copy (or both). However, targeting Wild Ricochet won't get you anywhere because Wild Ricochet will leave the stack before either Twincast resolves, and any spell targeting it will fizzle.

In any event, you can repeatedly copy the original Twincast with the copy, but nowhere do any of these spells state that you produce multiple copies of anything. You'd just have a loop of copy-resolve-copy-resolve going on, and the end result would be that when the final copy targets something else, you'll get a copy of that spell and a copy of whatever the original Twincast is targeting.

This isn't even useful for storm because none of the copies are cast.

November 14, 2014 12:16 p.m.

Epochalyptik says... #5

Remember that spells on the stack are illegal targets for themselves.

November 14, 2014 12:17 p.m.

MindAblaze says... #6

Hm. That's interesting that it works that way, seems like it would almost never be relevant that it leaves the stack after it resolves opposed to as it resolves. Thanks Epoch, learn something new every day.

November 14, 2014 12:57 p.m.

Epochalyptik says... #7

It's actually very important in some cases. Take Misdirection for example. You can effectively use Misdirection as a counterspell by changing the target spell's target to Misdirection. The original spell will fizzle because Misdirection, although a legal target at the time the effect is applied, is an illegal target when the original spell would resolve.

It's great in EDH, since it basically gives me another Force of Will in Dominus - Dreamcrusher Edition.

November 14, 2014 1:16 p.m.

MindAblaze says... #8

Yeah, I can see how the cases where it is relevant it would be absolutely vital to getting the most out of the card. That's cool. I like it.

November 14, 2014 2:02 p.m.

TelleoStar says... #9

So, to expand on this, what if the stack looked like this:

TOP

Wild Richochet

Wild Richochet

Shock

BOTTOM

In this case, could the resolution result in infinite shocks?

November 14, 2014 8:14 p.m.

No. Once again, Wild Ricochet only produces one copy.

November 14, 2014 8:15 p.m.

This discussion has been closed