Mimic Vat vs Grave Betrayal
Asked by drhumbra 12 years ago
This came up the other night during a game.
I have a Mimic Vat in play. my opponent has is playing zombies and has Grave Betrayal on the board. he wipes the board (multiplayer) with black sun zenith.
Here is the question: since Mimic Vat can only exile 1 card, but I get a trigger for every creature before I imprint, I choose to imprint and replace every creature (putting the replaced creature into the graveyard), stacking the triggers so that the last creature I imprint remains on the vat. Do the creatures that were imprinted then returned to the graveyard trigger Grave Betrayal ? Since the imprint trigger goes on "dies" and then the card passed through the vat and back to the graveyeard, does Grave Betrayal lose a target when I imprint? Also, my opponenet did the board wipe, so he had prioity.
Thanks for the help.
The most unusual way to negate Grave Betrayal 's ability!
November 20, 2012 12:20 p.m.
thank you for the responses.
Unfortunately, the group did not think the vat could do that.
on the upside, everyone (multiplayer) dealt direct damage to the player once he did this, so he was out the game before he could attack with his army. :)
November 20, 2012 12:32 p.m.
Are you sure about the Leyline of the Void statement?
Although I can see the logic in it, I'm fairly certain that creatures that get exiled instead of being put into the graveyard wouldn't be returned.
A common example of this is Rest in Peace being used to prevent undying creatures from returning.
Do you know where there might be a written official ruling on this, or which mtg comprehensive rule explains this?
If you are correct, the people at FNM where I live will be a little shocked when I explain this.
November 20, 2012 3:30 p.m.
After reading the ruling on Rest in Peace , I'm certain you are mistaken.
"10/1/2012 - While Rest in Peace is on the battlefield, abilities that trigger whenever a creature dies wont trigger because cards and tokens never reach a players graveyard."
This would prevent Undying, Grave Betrayal , and other 'dies' effects, such as Blood Artist .
November 20, 2012 3:41 p.m.
Rhadamanthus says... #6
Sorry, I misspoke. I confused myself when I was working up my response by thinking about the exception with It That Betrays . If a replacement effect ships a creature off to a zone other than the graveyard, then any "dies" triggers don't even trigger in the first place. Disregard my comment about Leyline of the Void .
Good catch.
Rhadamanthus says... Accepted answer #1
Though I suppose it does matter in a purely technical sense who has priority here, it doesn't affect the end result of the situation, since the part of Grave Betrayal that actually returns the creature is a delayed triggered ability that waits until the beginning of the next end step.
A "zone-change" ability ("dies" triggers are probably the most common example) tracks an object to the first zone it moves to, even if that first zone isn't the expected one (that is, Leyline of the Void won't block a Grave Betrayal - the creatures will get returned from exile). However, that ability will lose track of the object if it changes zones again. Each time you stuff a newly dead creature into the Mimic Vat , the Betrayal trigger will lose track of it. The card that ends up in the graveyard after you switch it for something else in the Vat is a different object than whatever triggered Betrayal, and Betrayal won't return it.
November 20, 2012 11:41 a.m.