Weird ruling on multiple ETBs going off at the same time
Asked by Bewmz 9 years ago
So I had this pop up last night in an EDH game.
My opponent has Notion Thief on board. I have Marchesa, the Black Rose and Inferno Titan come into play off Marchesa's trigger (third part of text on the card) with a River Kelpie in play. I was trying to stack my triggers so that Inferno Titan's ETB would go off first to kill the Notion Thief so I would draw two cards with River Kelpie's trigger. My opponent said that the way they would HAVE to stack, he would get at least one draw off the Notion Thief before the titan bolts it, but that didn't sound quite right to me.
I was under the impression that when there is a bunch of triggers that would go on the stack during my turn, as active player I choose how they stack and therefore in which order they resolve. Am I wrong, or was my opponent correct in this case?
Rhadamanthus says... #2
More detail: whose turn it is doesn't decide who orders all the triggers, but who goes first in ordering their own triggers. The active player orders his triggers first, then the non active player orders his triggers on top of those. The NAP's triggers will end up resolving before the AP's.
March 19, 2015 5 p.m.
The Kelpie's second ability wouldn't go off at all, because the Titan wasn't cast from the graveyard. It entered the battlefield from the graveyard through an ability.
But let's say you did cast it. The Kelpie's ability triggers from the spell being cast, so the stack would then be the creature spell on the bottom and the Kelpie ability on top of that. The Titan wouldn't be able to do anything until after it hits the field, so your opponent would get a card draw from it.
March 19, 2015 5:02 p.m.
Thanks Rhadamanthus I was 99.99% certain I was right, but being that the guy I was playing was the guy who works behind the counter and we had sat there for a few minutes already trying to explain how it works to no avail we just let him have it.
I marked your first answer as the accepted answer for anyone who looks at this question later so they can find the answer without needing to understand too much of the more detailed rules.
March 19, 2015 5:05 p.m.
Read the first part of River Kelpie again acbooster "Whenever River Kelpie or another permanent is put into play from a graveyard, draw a card."
March 19, 2015 5:07 p.m.
I never said anything about the first part because Rhad already talked about it. I was clarifying that the second ability wouldn't trigger because he said both triggers from the Kelpie.
March 19, 2015 5:09 p.m.
But there is two triggers.... o.0 Two permanents got put into play out of my graveyard
March 19, 2015 5:11 p.m.
But would Marchesa come back from her own ability? I thought she would have to be on the battlefield from when the creature died to the end step.
March 19, 2015 5:13 p.m.
Ok I looked at her gatherer page. The initial wording of the question made me think that you had Marchesa on the board and the Titan coming in because of the ability.
March 19, 2015 5:19 p.m.
Rhadamanthus says... #10
A "dies" trigger is a special kind of "leaves the battlefield" trigger, and LTBs use information from the last moment something was on the battlefield to determine if and how they trigger. Marchesa, the Black Rose can trigger from herself dying if she has a +1/+1 counter. As that trigger resolves it creates a delayed triggered ability that triggers "at the beginning of the next end step". An object that creates a delayed triggered ability doesn't have to still be around at the time the ability would finally trigger.
March 19, 2015 5:21 p.m.
Yeah, she counts herself according to gatherer. I had sac'd her and the titan to an Altar of Dementia during another opponent's turn in response to a wrath.
March 19, 2015 5:24 p.m.
Double ninja'd on my own question thread.... well played sirs.
Rhadamanthus says... Accepted answer #1
You're right. You control the trigger from Inferno Titan and both triggers from River Kelpie and they're all trying to be put onto the stack at the same time. You choose the order.
March 19, 2015 4:59 p.m.