Another Phage question
Asked by Poptart50100 13 years ago
So what would happen if you had Phage the Untouchable copied via Clone or some other copying card. Would you lose the game because the new Phage wasn't played from your hand or does it resolve without you losing the game?
Clone specifically states: "You may have Clone enter the battlefield as a copy of any creature on the battlefield."
However Clone won't trigger Phage the Untouchable 's trigger since Clone becomes Phage the Untouchable entering the battlefield, it is no longer Clone . Since you cast Phage the Untouchable from your hand you don't lose.
May 25, 2011 2:08 p.m.
Rhadamanthus says... #3
Whenever a card uses its own name, it really means "this specific game object". The Clone of Phage wants to know whether you cast it from your hand, and you did, so you have nothing to worry about.
Just don't forget to apply the Legend Rule, since there are now 2 copies of a legendary permanent with the same name on the battlefield.
May 25, 2011 2:33 p.m.
Poptart50100 says... #4
So then what would happen if you Reanimate d clone and used that to copy phage, would you lose then because it wasn't from the hand?
May 25, 2011 2:46 p.m.
Rhadamanthus says... #5
Huh. It looks like we all assumed you were casting it, but now I realize your original question doesn't specify.
Yes, you would lose the game in that case.
May 25, 2011 3:28 p.m.
BrightGreenLine says... Accepted answer #6
When you cast Clone the permanent it becomes remembers everything about how it came into play, such as how it was cast and what colors of mana were used to pay for it. If you Phyrexian Metamorph a Sunburst permanent it will enter play with the appropriate number of counters. Here's the specific rule, to back up Rhadamanthus's statement:
706.2. When copying an object, the copy acquires the copiable values of the original object's characteristics and, for an object on the stack, choices made when casting or activating it (mode, targets, the value of X, whether it was kicked, how it will affect multiple targets, and so on). The "copiable values" are the values derived from the text printed on the object (that text being name, mana cost, card type, subtype, supertype, expansion symbol, rules text, power, toughness, and/or loyalty), as modified by other copy effects, by "as . . . enters the battlefield" and "as . . . is turned face up" abilities that set characteristics, and by abilities that caused the object to be face down. Other effects (including type-changing and text-changing effects), status, and counters are not copied.
May 25, 2011 6:24 p.m.
lukemwillis says... #7
@oulani... whoops! misread that one. Thanks for catching that.
May 25, 2011 7:58 p.m.
If you play Clone from your hand copying a Phage the Untouchable , it will come in as Phage. Therefore she'll check if she was played from your hand, which she was, and will be happy.
Until she dies immediately from the Legend Rule, which would make her very angry indeed.
If you Reanimate d a Clone targeting Phage, she'd again check if she was played from your hand, find out she wasn't, and would kill you for your insolence.
May 26, 2011 7:54 a.m.
@Rhadamanthus
Hey at least if the Phage the Untouchable was on the opponent's side, legend rule makes Clone a 4 mana kill spell.
May 26, 2011 10:10 a.m.
Poptart50100 says... #10
Thanks guys yeah I just wanted to know both ways, the 2nd question arose after wondering what would happen in another situation.
May 26, 2011 10:35 a.m.
nathanwobbe says... #11
What about mirrorweave and phage? If creatures already in play become her do they check their original cast state? Or does nothing happen and you have an army of legends to immediately sacrefice?
April 25, 2015 10:52 p.m.
Rhadamanthus says... #12
The way the posting system works here, posting in an old topic doesn't bump it to the top. The only users who will know about a new comment are the ones who have previously commented on it. It's better to make a new topic than to post in a very old one.
Mirrorweave can't target Legendary creatures, so your situation can't happen as described. Regardless, Mirrorweave doesn't cause anything to enter the battlefield, rather it changes the characteristics of creatures already on the battlefield. Phage the Untouchable's enters-the-battlefield ability wouldn't trigger but you would still have the Legend Rule to deal with (which is probably the main reason why Mirrorweave can't target Legendary creatures).
lukemwillis says... #1
You could do this because the Clone is not entering the battlefield as a Phage the Untouchable , it is turning into one after it has already entered the battlefield. Hope this helps!
May 25, 2011 1:59 p.m.