Venser Ability
Asked by senhor114 13 years ago
Can you place Pacifism on a hexproof creature when using Venser, the Sojourner's plus 2 ability?
It works because hexproof prevents targeting from spells and abilities. When you use Venser, the Sojourner's Flicker ability on a Pacifism (or any other aura) it will come back in attached to a legal target. It doesn't target what will will enchant at this point, it just comes in attached to any legal target of its owner's choosing. If there is no legal target when it returns then it will just go to the graveyard.
January 25, 2012 8:52 p.m.
Epochalyptik says... #3
Virlym: Your answer is misleading. Nothing is targeted at all when an Aura enters the battlefield. Therefore, it may enchant anything which meets its enchantment restrictions (for example, an Aura with "Enchant Creature" can enchant any creature, even hexproof/shroud ones, which do not have protection from it).
January 25, 2012 9:07 p.m.
So you shouldn't say "attached to a legal target." It creates confusion, even to someone who knows the rules. I had to read it over several times to make sure I understood your post.
The correct statement is that an Aura that is put directly into play is immediately attached to an object which it can legally enchant. This means that shroud and its variants are not involved, but protection is, since one of the abilities protection represents is the inability to be enchanted by Auras of the stated quality.
303.4f If an Aura is entering the battlefield under a player's control by any means other than by resolving as an Aura spell, and the effect putting it onto the battlefield doesn't specify the object or player the Aura will enchant, that player chooses what it will enchant as the Aura enters the battlefield. The player must choose a legal object or player according to the Aura's enchant ability and any other applicable effects.
The Aura comes into play attached to the chosen legal object. This technicality becomes significant if, for example, there were no creatures in play at the time that the delayed triggered ability from Venser, the Sojourner's first ability is put onto the stack. The ability will resolve, and during its resolution, the Pacifism will not be able to enter the battlefield at all. It will not enter and then be placed into its owner's graveyard because it is not attached to anything; it will remain in exile, barring any Pull from Eternity effects, for the rest of the game. The ability will not trigger again.
303.4g If an Aura is entering the battlefield and there is no legal object or player for it to enchant, the Aura remains in its current zone, unless that zone is the stack. In that case, the Aura is put into its owner's graveyard instead of entering the battlefield.
January 25, 2012 9:12 p.m.
Also does this work on creatures with protection from a color?
January 25, 2012 9:16 p.m.
Epochalyptik says... #6
No. The last two posts confirmed that this does not work. Permanents with protection from A can't be enchanted by anything with or of quality A.
January 25, 2012 9:19 p.m.
Sorry I forgot to bold targeting in the first line. I was trying to stress that hexproof only deals with targeting. While Venser, the Sojourner's Flicker ability, when used on an aura, will return the aura to the battlefield already attached to a permanent that meets the enchantment requirements. ie, "enchant creature" auras will come into play attached to any creature that the aura's owner wishes (Unless that creature has protection from the color of the aura, protection from auras/enchantments, or protection from everything. I believe that covers the possibilities. Note, it can have protection from colored spells because the aura is not a spell when it is being Flickered.). Hopefully that cleared up my last statement a little.
January 25, 2012 11:58 p.m.
dragonstryke58 says... #8
I was just wondering about the context of the question. Are you using Venser, the Sojourner's flicker on the Pacifism you placed on an opponent's creature to place it on another creature the opponent controls that has hexproof? It sounds like the most probable case, but I might be wrong. If it is, then like it was posted above the hexproof prevents that.
The only way for it to work is if the Pacifism was owned by you and the hexproof creature is under your control.
January 26, 2012 9:18 p.m.
That is the context of the question. However, I don't see what post you are referring to. Nowhere on this thread has anyone said that hexproof prevents an aura from being directly attached to something.
Auras target only as a spell. When an aura is put directly into play, it does not target but is instead attached directly to any object it can legally enchant. All the rules quoted confirm this:
114.1b Aura spells are always targeted. These are the only permanent spells with targets. An Auras target is specified by its enchant keyword ability (see rule 702.5, Enchant). The target(s) are chosen as the spell is cast; see rule 601.2c. An Aura permanent doesn't target anything; only the spell is targeted. (An activated or triggered ability of an Aura permanent can also be targeted.)
303.4f If an Aura is entering the battlefield under a player's control by any means other than by resolving as an Aura spell, and the effect putting it onto the battlefield doesn't specify the object or player the Aura will enchant, that player chooses what it will enchant as the Aura enters the battlefield. The player must choose a legal object or player according to the Aura's enchant ability and any other applicable effects.
January 26, 2012 9:25 p.m.
dragonstryke58 says... #10
Sorry I misread that wrong. I've always thought that auras need to target when coming into play (regardless of where they are coming in from). I missed the second ruling...
So this will work as long as Pacifism is owned by you, correct?
January 26, 2012 9:32 p.m.
As long as the Pacifism is being put onto the battlefield under your control, to more precise.
Spoofed says... Accepted answer #1
Yes.
MtG Comprehensive rules
January 25, 2012 8:42 p.m.