split cards and Isochron Scepter
Asked by linkofhyrule 12 years ago
If i were to cast Isochron Scepter , imprinting a split card (provided one or both halves were CMC of 2), would i be able to choose which half of the spell i cast? And if only one half was CMC of (1 or) 2, could i choose the other half, with CMC of 3+?
examples:
Both 2 or less: Fire/Ice , Trial/Error , Hide/Seek , Wax/Wane
Only one side 2 or less: Bound/Determined , Night/Day , Dead/Gone , stand/deliver]], Research/Development , Odds/Ends , Illusion/Reality
708.2. In every zone except the stack, split cards have two sets of characteristics and two converted mana costs. As long as a split card is a spell on the stack, only the characteristics of the half being cast exist. The other half's characteristics are treated as though they didn't exist.
708.2a If a player casts a split card, that player chooses which half of that split card he or she is casting before putting it onto the stack. Only the half that is being cast is considered to be put onto the stack. Only that half is evaluated to see if it can be cast.
When you imprint a split card, you must choose which part of the card you are imprinting. Then you may only play that half of the card while exiled. The other half is treated as it doesn't exist.
February 6, 2013 5:34 p.m.
Absinthman says... #3
This is a bit hard to explain, but I will try. In all zones except the stack, split cards have two sets of characteristics that come from the two halves. If at least one of those halves satisfies Isochron Scepter 's prerequisites, it can be imprinted on it. In exile, the imprinted split card still has both sides. The side that will be used is determined at the time of casting. So when you activate the Scepter with a split card, you cast a copy of that split card and then choose which half you want to use. Long story short, you can, for example, cast the Bound half or Bound/Determined using the Scepter. It will be legal play.
February 6, 2013 5:36 p.m.
Absinthman says... #4
Now this is interesting. JMANNO33O and I have a different point of view. Could someone else please comment on this? I could be wrong here, and I really want to know.
February 6, 2013 5:38 p.m.
708.2a says that a split card only has one half when it's on the stack.
Exiling doesn't use the stack, correct?
In this case, you are correct. But it seems confusing if one half's mana cost is 2 or less, and the other is more, that you could play it. Seems to almost break the rules.
February 6, 2013 5:40 p.m.
Absinthman says... #6
When imprinting a card onto something, the card itself doesn't go throught the stack. Only the Imprint ability goes there. The card is just directly exiled. I'd still like to hear another opinion though.
February 6, 2013 5:42 p.m.
MagnorCriol says... #7
It does almost break the rules. Split cards + Isochron Scepter is a classic example of a way the MtG rules feel like they break themselves. Absinthman has the correct explanation; you can cast either side of a split card exiled with the Scepter.
Think of it this way: A split card effectively has both characteristics. When you're imprinting a card, it doesn't ask "does this card not have a CMC higher than 2?" it only asks "does this card have a CMC less than 2?" As long as one of the two halves of the split have CMC less than 2, it fits that bill, and can be imprinted.
Then when you activate its ability, it doesn't care about the CMC anymore. It has nothing that checks that; the only time it cares about the CMC is when it's imprinting. And because the Scepter has the all-important word "cast" - "you may cast the copy" - that means you're, well, casting the copy of the split card, and as per the rules, when you cast a split card you get to choose which half.
February 6, 2013 6:17 p.m.
Absinthman says... #8
Thanks to MagnorCriol for a very detailed explanation. I actually meant to say something like this, but lacked the vocabular capacity to put it in such a clear way.
February 6, 2013 6:55 p.m.
Epochalyptik says... Accepted answer #9
You could just look at the Gatherer ruling for Isochron Scepter , which states:
12/1/2004: If the copied card is a split card, you may choose to cast either side of the split card, but not both. The split cards Fire/Ice, Illusion/Reality, Night/Day, Stand/Deliver, and Wax/Wane all have at least one side with converted mana cost 2 or less.)
I will explain. A split card has the properties of both of its halves. For example, the split card Bound/Determined has the mana cost 3BG and the mana cost GU. It has the qualities at all times except when it is on the stack. At that time, the split card has only the properties of the half being cast.
708.2. In every zone except the stack, split cards have two sets of characteristics and two converted mana costs. As long as a split card is a spell on the stack, only the characteristics of the half being cast exist. The other half's characteristics are treated as though they didn't exist.
Because exile is not the stack, a split card imprinted on Isochron Scepter still has both of its sets of qualities. Isochron Scepter doesn't specify that you may only copy the side of a card with CMC 2 or less, even though it is implied that the card has CMC 2 or less to begin with. Bound/Determined does have CMC 2 or less, but it also has a CMC of 5. Because one set of properties satisfies Isochron Scepter 's imprint ability, the card may be imprinted. That doesn't preclude you from casting the other half of the card, though.
February 6, 2013 8:30 p.m.
KrazyCaley says... #10
TL;DR - You can imprint any split card onto an Isochron Scepter as long as one of the halves has a CMC of 2 or less. Then you can use the Scepter to cast EITHER half of the split card.
linkofhyrule says... #1
*Stand/Deliver
February 6, 2013 4:43 p.m.