Kiki-Jiki, Mirror Breaker + Feldon of the Third Path
Asked by DJSeras 9 years ago
If Feldon makes a token from some non-legendary creature in the graveyard,
then Kiki makes a token copy of the first token,
will both of them need to be sacrificed at the end of turn, or just the initial copy?
merrowMania says... #2
No. The delayed trigger from Feldon only applies to the first token
July 30, 2015 6:52 p.m.
UpsetYoMama says... #3
Yes, you will have to sacrifice the token that was copied from the already copied token.
Check the rulings on Kiki-Jiki, Mirror Breaker.
July 30, 2015 6:54 p.m.
PepsiAddicted says... #4
Feldons token will be sacrificed at the beginning of the next end step because his card text says so.
Kikis token will be sacrificed at the beginning of the next end step because his card text says so.
But if the 2nd token would be generated with something else that doesnt say "sacrificed at the beginning of the next end step" then it will stay. was that the question?
July 30, 2015 6:58 p.m. Edited.
UpsetYoMama says... #5
@merrowMania The thing is that the token becomes a copy of the other token, which includes everything on the card.
"Sacrifice it at the beginning of the next end step" also applies to the token.
July 30, 2015 7 p.m. Edited.
Epochalyptik says... Accepted answer #6
Let's clear up some confusion.
Feldon of the Third Path's ability creates a token copy of a creature card in a graveyard. The token is an exact copy of that card except it's also an artifact in addition to its other types. The token then gains haste, but haste is not added to the card's text. It's something that becomes true after the token is created. Feldon of the Third Path's ability then creates a delayed triggered ability that forces you to sacrifice that card at the beginning of the next end step. This DTA is NOT written on the card; DTAs never are. Rather, they simply exist and trigger at the prescribed time.
Therefore, anything that copies the token created by Feldon of the Third Path's ability will only copy the exact printed values of the original card plus the additional type "Artifact." Neither haste nor the DTA are copied.
However, if you have a replacement effect such as Parallel Lives, which modifies the number of tokens created by Feldon of the Third Path's ability, then the DTA will apply to each of those tokens because they were both created by Feldon of the Third Path's ability.
Kiki-Jiki, Mirror Breaker's ability is slightly different. Note the difference in wording regarding haste. With Kiki-Jiki, Mirror Breaker's ability, haste is now one of the written properties of the token, and it's a copiable value. Kiki-Jiki, Mirror Breaker's ability also creates its own DTA. Thus, copies of tokens created by Kiki-Jiki, Mirror Breaker's ability will have haste, but they will not have the DTA.
July 30, 2015 7:14 p.m. Edited.
PepsiAddicted says... #7
oh yes kiki exiles its token instead of sacrifice, ofc. just copy+pasted my first line, being lazy doesnt pay out.
anyway, just use sculpting steel to make a non-token copy of feldons token. it will stay
July 30, 2015 7:32 p.m. Edited.
Rhadamanthus says... #8
Kiki-Jiki, Mirror Breaker doesn't exile anything. The delayed triggered ability causes the token to be sacrificed.
July 30, 2015 8:55 p.m.
Epochalyptik says... #9
So it does; I should have double checked. Thanks for the catch.
July 30, 2015 9:32 p.m.
Alright, just needed some clarification for a new EDH deck I'm constructing, Thanks for all the answers
DJSeras says... #1
Sorry, lemme rephrase, Kiki is a bad example, say I generate a copy with after the fact with something else, would both need to be sacrificed
July 30, 2015 6:47 p.m.