Color Identity Logic

Commander (EDH) forum

Posted on Feb. 21, 2013, 11:57 a.m. by revitev

In another post, we started on the discussion of why spells involving various mana symbols have that as part of their identity whereas spells that produce any color don't. Has there ever been an official explanation of this? There seems to be a conflict which limits edh gameplay.

What would be the downside to only not letting spells with other mana symbols in the casting cost be allowed (unless it is hybrid cost) and disregarding the color identity aspect? What unfair advantages brought color identity into play when creating the edh format?

Epochalyptik says... #2

I'm not quite sure what you're asking. The first sentence confuses me a bit.

February 21, 2013 12:04 p.m.

revitev says... #3

Sorry, just saying there color identity seems to limit game-play. I am asking why it was critical to bring color identity into play as a limitation in edh play. In what situations has a card having a mana symbol not in its generals colors lead to unfair play and why was this larger encompassing rule of color identity included?

February 21, 2013 12:25 p.m.

Epochalyptik says... #4

The rule partly stems from the flavor of the format - the idea is to have a general leading an army, and it doesn't really make sense for that general to have at his or her disposal cards that aren't even associated with his or her own colors/mechanics. It's like giving an army general command over the air force.

Another part of the issue is balance. Color identity is a logical, tangible way to solve the problems of what can and can't be included in a deck. It gives a clear definition of your options. I suppose the argument could be made that card color rather also offers a tangible definition, but then you get into problems with cards that have colors in their text boxes that aren't in their mana costs. You could easily include a card in your deck that has an activated ability you can't even pay for within your general's colors. The Alara battlemages are a prime example. Although it's perhaps a bit more limiting than other rules would have been, it still makes sense, especially when you consider cases like Memnarch . Before the definition of color identity was expanded, Memnarch was an illegal general.

February 21, 2013 12:49 p.m.

revitev says... #5

But creatures that can produce any color are still allowed without that being part of their color identity which seems like an exception to me. Why are they then not every color by identity and instead limited in the mana they can produce under that commander? Under that logic it should just be obvious if you have a spell that agrees in cost but not identity that the ability can't be paid for by mana you would be able to produce. That kind of makes the flavor part edh questionable.

I know triggers that make any other kind of color are now colorless based on your general, I just didn't see the logic in including color identity in edh instead of the less limiting rules that could be in place...especially when edh is already such a nonrestrictive format. Perhaps they weighed out the trade-off and wanted Memnarch to be available. What if color identity was only applicable to commanders?

February 21, 2013 3:14 p.m.

Epochalyptik says... #6

Effects that produce any color of mana aren't really an exception because of the rules of color identity. In EDH, "any color of mana" effectively means "any color of mana in your general's identity." The cards themselves don't actually have every mana symbol in their text box, so their identity is not changed by their ability to produce mana outside their actual card color.

February 21, 2013 3:31 p.m.

Josiah says... #7

does that mean that i cant use Composite Golem in any deck except a WUGBR deck? or does the mana that contradicts the generals identity get turned into colorless?

February 21, 2013 7:01 p.m.

AEtherZero says... #8

Composite Golem can only be used in WUBRG decks because its text box has WUBRG in it. Gilded Lotus can be used in any deck because it has no mana symbols in its text box or mana cost. Phyrexian Metamorph can only be used in blue decks because of having U in its mana cost. The mana symbols in the text box and mana cost limit to what decks the card can be played in.

February 21, 2013 11:35 p.m.

Epochalyptik says... #9

Note that color identity is defined as the sum of all colored mana symbols in a card's mana cost and text box (reminder text, like that for extort, is excluded from color identity) as well as the colors of any color indicators on the card.

February 21, 2013 11:53 p.m.

This discussion has been closed