Render Silent on uncounterable spells

Asked by Apoptosis 11 years ago

Render Silent : Counter target spell. Its controller can't cast spells this turn.

I just wanted to point out that these two sentences are separate and therefore independent of each other. Thus if one casts a Render Silent on a spell that cannot be countered (say casting a creature through Cavern of Souls ), the creature spell still resolves, but the player can not cast more spells that turn. This makes Render Silent useful as a tempo mechanism for control decks even when the counterspell fails. I'm 99.7% sure this is correct and would like someone to confirm my interpretation.

I initiated a similar discussion about Plasm Capture here: http://tappedout.net/mtg-questions/plasm-capture-wording-and-uncounterable-spells/

plasm-capture-wording-and-uncounterable-spells (let's see whether I can link a thread).

and the consensus was that unless there is an "If... then" clause, then the two sentences are mutually exclusive (i.e. independent of each other).

Thoughts?

Thanks again, -Apop.

gufymike says... Accepted answer #1

4/15/2013 A spell that cant be countered is a legal target for Render Silent. The spell wont be countered when Render Silent resolves, but that spells controller wont be able to cast spells for the rest of the turn.

Confirmed from the gather page

May 14, 2013 5:14 p.m.

Dallie says... #2

I believe the answer is the same as to your previous question. They two effects, "counter target spell", and "target opponent can't cast spells this turn", are not dependent on each other. And thus the answer is the same as to your previous question.

To quote Rhadamanthus

"If a resolving effect tries to do something impossible, it just skips that part and keeps resolving normally. If the spell can't be countered, Plasm Capture will still finish resolving completely."

The same applies to Render Silent .

May 14, 2013 5:16 p.m.

Apoptosis says... #3

Hi Dallie, I was pretty sure about it, but it just occurred to me that Render Silent could be used this way as to control tempo even into the teeth of the dreaded "uncounterable". It got me excited enough that I had to post. Maybe this should have been in another forum, since it was more of an "oh cool" moment for me as opposed to a "I wonder whether". But I did want to be sure too.

May 14, 2013 5:35 p.m.

Epochalyptik says... #4

Oh, and by the way, this has nothing to do with the two effects of Render Silent being separate sentences. The only way of indicating dependence is something like "if you do."

May 14, 2013 8:16 p.m.