If a player attacks me when I have Ob Nixilis, Captive Kingpin and Hissing Miasma on the field, will Ob trigger and get his counters before or after I declare my blockers?
Asked by MartinEMcArthur 2 months ago
Basically I’m wondering if I’ll have a stronger Ob to block with when I’m getting swung at in this scenario. Last night I was playing and I was in a similar situation when I had Ob Nixilis, Captive Kingpin and Hellrider out at the same time. In that scenario I attacked with three creatures triggering both Hellrider and Ob three times. When I was putting counters on Ob my buddy told me he doesn’t get those counters until after the combat phase. I didn’t argue but I wasn’t sure if that was really how it worked. In both of these scenarios, wouldn’t he get his counters before the blockers are declared? Thanks for clarifying.
Situation 1 - Using Ob Nixilis, Captive Kingpin and Hissing Miasma together:
The combat phase is separated into different steps. Here, the relevant step is the Declare Attackers step. During the Declare Attackers Step, first attackers are declared through the processes set forth in the rules. As part of declaring attackers, "Any abilities that trigger on attackers being declared trigger." (Rule 508.1m).
Once the attackers are declared, the active player gains "priority"--this is when spells can be cast and abilities resolve (See Rule 508.2).
When the active player gets priority per Rule 508.2, the triggers which occurred pursuant to Rule 508.1m get put on the stack. At this point, we are still in the Declare Attackers Step.
The Hissing Miasma triggered ability will go on the stack--one trigger will be placed on the stack for each attacking creature. When each triggered ability resolves, it will cause the attacking player to lose one life.
Upon that player losing one life, Ob Nixilis, Captive Kingpin will trigger and his ability goes on the stack. When that ability resolves, it will give him the +1/+1 counter. We are still in the priority stage of the Declare Attackers Step for this entire process.
Only after every player has passed priority and nothing is on the stack will we advance to the next step--the Declare Blockers Step. It is during that step, after all the Hissing Miasma and Ob Nixilis, Captive Kingpin triggers have finished resolving that you declare your blockers.
Situation 2: Ob Nixilis, Captive Kingpin and Hellrider
Your buddy was wrong. As with above, all the triggers will occur during the Declare Attackers Step and will resolve during the priority component of the Declare Attackers Step. Ob Nixilis, Captive Kingpin's triggers will resolve before you move on to the Declare Blockers Step and get to choose blockers.
February 23, 2024 10:49 a.m. Edited.
Rhadamanthus says... #3
If it wasn't clear from the above: this works and the other person was wrong about the Hellrider interaction. The game can only move to the next step or phase after both players pass priority over an empty stack. That means any triggered abilities that trigger during a given step have to be dealt with and fully resolved before the game moves forward. In both the Hissing Miasma and Hellrider examples, Ob Nixilis, Captive Kingpin will get the +1/+1 counters during the Declare Attackers step of combat. There's nothing in the ability or the rules of the game that tells you to wait and deal with the trigger later.
February 23, 2024 10:55 a.m.
MartinEMcArthur says... #4
Rhadamanthus Caerwyn cool I had a feeling he was wrong haha, Thank you both!
February 23, 2024 4:01 p.m.
Rhadamanthus says... #5
MartinEMcArthur: Since it's clear you got a satisfactory answer to your question and there don't seem to be any more follow-ups or corrections that need to be made, I marked one of them as the "Accepted answer" so this topic can move out of the list of unanswered questions. In the future you can take care of this yourself using the "Mark as Answer" button on the response that you feel is the most helpful answer to your question.
MartinEMcArthur says... #1
Also when I had Hellrider out I was attacking with Ob, just to clarify
February 23, 2024 10:28 a.m.