Do +X/+X Effects persist through "Creature becomes X/X" spells?

Asked by gigagloin 8 years ago

I played kitchen table Magic with my flatmate. He played Quillspike. I attacked him, he wanted to block with it. I then cast Turn to Frog and in response he uses Quillspike's effect 33x times.

Is the creature after Turn to Frog a 100/100 (e.g. has +99/+99) or a 1/1?

My understanding is that if the creature would get counters, they would persist. But, since the ability would resolve first, the creature is a 100/100 when it is turned into a 1/1, without regaining the bonus from it's ability.

Sam_I_am says... Accepted answer #1

the creature is a 100/100. Turn to Frog does not affect temporary power/toughness effects, nor does it affect +1/+1 counters.

the power and toughness setting ability of Turn to Frog applies to layer 7B, since it is a power/toughness setting effect.

Quillspike's ability is a power/toughness changing effect, which is applied in layer 7C

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Cards with that sort of effect have recently been re-templated to make this a bit more clear.

Until end of turn, target creature loses all abilities and becomes a blue Frog with base power and toughness 1/1.

in case you don't believe me, here's what the gatherer ruling says

7/18/2014 Effects that modify a creatures power and/or toughness, such as the effect of Titanic Growth, will apply to the creature no matter when they started to take effect. The same is true for any counters that change its power and/or toughness and effects that switch its power and toughness.

September 4, 2015 2:25 p.m. Edited.

Devonin says... #2

There were 33 -1/-1 counters scattered among creatures he controlled, and they were still alive? What the hell deck was he playing?

September 4, 2015 11:41 p.m.

gigagloin says... #3

The Combo is Quillspike and Devoted Druid.

September 6, 2015 9:55 p.m.