Thoughts on the cancellation of SCG Baltimore and Syracuse?
General forum
Posted on March 11, 2020, 8:07 p.m. by Ice_Water
I’d love to hear from others what they think about Star City Games cancelling their events in the wake of the Coronavirus.
Personally, I can’t help but feel a little annoyed at the lack of communication from SCG because of how infrequently the tour comes to Baltimore anyway. I feel like a lot of people got the short end of the stick and there won’t be a mid-Atlantic location hosting a tournament until Philadelphia hosts one in late May.
Thoughts?
I'm not against the decision. I support it. My point is that there likely won't be an event in either location until the second half of the year at least. Not everyone can afford to travel three or four states away for an event. I just want a statement saying something is in the works.
Folks who take part in these tournaments don't always have the best hygiene, so I'm on board. I just want some semblance of a plan.
March 11, 2020 8:18 p.m.
KingBahamut says... #4
Ice_Water: lets not keep spreading the stereotype that Magic players are unhygienic.
March 11, 2020 8:51 p.m.
I didn't say all. I'm a magic player, not just someone trying to break into it. There are plenty that don't, I've been to events where it's clear that some are unhygienic.
March 11, 2020 8:55 p.m.
KingBahamut says... #6
Ice_Water: i didn't say all either. but regardless of whether the word "all" is used, even just talking about it at all is enough to reinforce the stereotype to people who don't play magic. and the people who "do" play don't like hearing it either. i actively go out of my way to smell and dress my best before any event because i feel i have to fight this stigma.
"Folks who take part in these tournaments don't always have the best hygiene" is a grossly incorrect statement. its not "folks who take part in these tournaments", its "folks in general". lets stop enforcing some idea of any correlation whatsoever between magic and being unhygienic.
March 11, 2020 9:11 p.m.
We’re talking about an infectious disease the likes of which hasn’t really been seen since the Spanish Flu towards the end of WWI.
It’s probably wise to shut down extraneous events that could further contribute to the rapid spread. This is a virus that is likely to have to infect 50-75% of the world’s population before the effects it has on society at large are mitigated by peoples’ immune systems creating antibodies that inoculate them from illness. Stressing the health infrastructure systems too much would have disastrous consequences when the possibility exists for governments and businesses to make decisions that decrease that stress by slowing the rate of infection.
If you’re annoyed by wise and prudent choices that ultimately could save tens of thousands or even hundreds of thousands of lives then shame on you. There are things in this world that are bigger than playing a game at a tournament. Maybe you’ll understand better when you grow up a little.
March 11, 2020 9:31 p.m.
KingBahamut says... #11
March 11, 2020 10:11 p.m.
I pulled that number straight out of my butt as I have zero credible information to support using it.
Logically, it’s a number that makes sense given previous viral epidemics throughout history. If, for example, half the population has been previously infected and created antibodies then the other half can no longer infect them, the spread of infections slows and eventually stops when the viral strain no longer has viable hosts. Logical reasoning, supported by some historical examples. But this is a new virus and there’s no assurances it will follow a small number of historical examples, even if it’s current progression, transmission method, mortality rate, and other factors highly resemble some of those historical examples (primarily and strikingly Spanish Flu).
In the particular example of Spanish Flu the majority of the world population was estimated (exact numbers dependent on source used) to have been infected before the virus abated. You, your parents, everyone you know in fact, has antibodies from that virus which is why that strain does not affect you even though it still exists in some parts of the world today.
Currently, the most credible sources predict (conservatively in their words) 450,000 deaths minimum for the US over the course of the viruses transmission throughout the US taking into account different risk factors present in US societal structure and likely lower mortality rate due to significantly higher than reported infection rates globally.
March 11, 2020 10:27 p.m. Edited.
KingBahamut says... #13
jaymc1130 as of today, the death toll in the U.S. is 38. what are these "credible sources" that say another 449,962 "at minimum" will die? and "antibodies" do not equal "immunity".
March 11, 2020 11:13 p.m.
Michael Osterholm. CIDRAP. The litany of medical professionals producing the articles found on that website. Quite educational. You might consider doing some reading. This is a serious issue, but I found myself much less scared (though much more wary) after becoming more informed.
March 11, 2020 11:29 p.m.
KingBahamut says... #15
jaymc1130 can you provide a link? i'm not find that "450,000" number anywhere, much less anything by michael osterholm.
March 11, 2020 11:35 p.m.
6 minutes is probably not enough time for you to read any of those papers, it’d be difficult to find any information in such a short time span.
Perhaps try something more your speed, something that requires less effort, and check out his interview on the Joe Rogan podcast on YouTube. I’d recommend the whole thing, but that’s likely also too intense so the shorter clips are fine as well.
March 11, 2020 11:48 p.m.
I know from a person working at a major Portland area hospital that they are preparing for what is expected to be a 40-70% infection rate. That doesn't mean every one of those people will require attention, however, our capacity (as a nation) to treat people may be strained beyond capacity in some locations.
The difference between 40 and 70 percent is how much we congregate in general and how well we follow the very simple recommendations by the myriad sources out there.
March 11, 2020 11:53 p.m. Edited.
KingBahamut says... #18
jaymc1130 excuse me? many of those "papers" are super short, not to mention the search function. and you do realize i started looking into your claim before you even mentioned "cidrap" right? maybe don't start making asinine assumptions. you literally even admitted before you were willing to pull numbers out your butt, and you STILL have no link. just admit you are lying, and not in any way a credible source of information. don't think for one second that your reading level is even remotely close to mine. been reading at a college level since 4th grade.
March 11, 2020 11:59 p.m.
Precisely maxon.
The first step to understanding how to decrease the chance you become infected or infect others is to become educated about the topic. I highly recommend everyone investigate the same types of sources I have myself and all new sources as they release new information. Preparedness is the only real tool we have to combat an epidemic of this fashion.
March 12, 2020 midnight
KingBahamut says... #20
jaymc1130: 10:27 to 11:35 is 1 hour 8 minutes. not 6 minutes.
March 12, 2020 12:01 a.m.
Mate, I’ve got a 150 IQ and read the entire Lord of the Rings trilogy in the first grade. Not that this is relevant, just making a point if you want to turn it into a measuring contest.
I literally posted the information you inquired about, if you want to become more educated look into all these sources and more. I’d certainly appreciate any new sources you might be able to point me toward as I try to remain ahead of this issue.
And 11:29 to 11:35 is 6 minutes.
March 12, 2020 12:04 a.m. Edited.
KingBahamut says... #22
jaymc1130: you did not post a link to the information. and 10:27 (when you first used the number 450,000) to 11:35 is ONE HOUR EIGHT MINUTES. again, post the link. you can't just make a claim and then not cite your source. "cidrap" is not specific enough. post. the. link. back. up. your. claim.
March 12, 2020 12:07 a.m.
Well, I think it’s best to ignore the one troll derailing the thread at this point, but to the others I apologize for encouraging said individual to act wildly inappropriately.
For those looking to educate themselves a search for CIDRAP returns the website for the Center for Infectious Disease Research and Policy as the first hit. There’s a wealth of information on the site including an entire subsection devoted exclusively to COVID-19.
Michael Osterholm searches could return any number of his papers or books which are worth reading but I focused mostly on his recent activities which lead me to a rather insightful podcast appearance on the Joe Rogan show that I recommend very highly.
March 12, 2020 12:15 a.m.
I apologize for the miscommunication to those reading the thread. I wasn’t upset with the decision, just the fact that we likely won’t hear about a replacement event in the near future. I hope you all stay safe in this time.
March 12, 2020 12:21 a.m.
Ah, that seems rather understandable. My guess is that it’s tough to give a time frame for a replacement date at this current juncture in time given the climate in terms of health ramifications. No one can really know how long it will take for the virus to play itself out or a vaccine to be created and pinpointing a specific date for a rescheduling of many events is nigh impossible.
March 12, 2020 12:24 a.m.
You’re right. It’s just a shame they don’t come to this region more. I’d love to participate more frequently. This is an awful pandemic, the colleges and even the NBA are shutting down.
I hope everyone makes it through.
March 12, 2020 12:33 a.m.
I certainly hope everyone stays safe as well. It's gonna be a tough year.
March 12, 2020 12:42 a.m.
If you have some interested buddies you could organize some events locally, I know it's not the same of course.
Regarding the hygiene stereotype... I agree spreading unwarranted prejudice is bad but there is a reason for this reputation. You couldn't take the infamous buttcrack pics at just any random event, but you can do it at pretty much any magic tournament.
Obviously most people who play magic have normal hygiene, but to try and deny that a certain kind of people are more drawn to certain hobbies than others is delusional. It's not unique to magic, you have similar problems at chess tournaments and rpg conventions to name a few.
March 12, 2020 2:14 a.m.
Doombeard1984 says... #29
I think as a community we need to do all we can to help protect the health of all those who attend these events. Players, organisers, trade stands, judges and anyone else. We don't really fully understand what this disease is capable of, and I for one have already kind of assumed that events like this will be cancelled. I am due to go to Liverpool UK in July, and I am already expecting this to not happen. We need to think proactively, and maybe a little less reactively. The last thing this needs to end up in is throwing barbs at each other. We gotta look out for each other and think about the longer term. The bigger picture so to speak. ScG and CFB etc, will have had these things planned for ages, way before the COVID-19 hammer hit. They are just doing the best they can, in a totally unprecedented situation. Stay safe everyone. Care for each other, respect each other, and best wishes to anyone who is, or become affected by this awful situation
March 12, 2020 5:02 a.m.
Jay and king it almost seems like your both the same person just trying to stir up drama
March 12, 2020 9:46 a.m.
No idea who that individual is tbh. Definitely not the same person.
And no, this is not gong to be mostly over by July in all likelihood. Viral infections aren't driven by seasons or weather. It's more common for people to become infected when their immune systems are most heavily taxed and while winter seasons tend to be more taxing on most people's immune systems serious viral contagions occur year round. As the summer months approach this virus is likely to spread just as fast or faster given the transmission method (airborne, just being in the same building as an infected individual and breathing recirculated air can cause infection) and contagious period (COVID-19 has an incubation period of about 4 or 5 days before illness symptoms, but an infected individual is extremely contagious essentially from the second they become infected rather than after symptoms of the illness begin to show and remain highly contagious for the duration of the illness which is typically 2 weeks give or take) people are less likely to notice symptoms as quickly despite being infected and continue about everyday business transmitting the virus as they do so. There is absolutely zero reason to believe seasonal change will have any affect on the virus at all according to credible sources (which mainstream media, white house releases, etc, are not while perpetrating the spread of misinformation such as what you allude to in terms of seasonal affect). While there isn't a need to panic, there is certainly need to be educated about this topic and individuals should look to quality sources for information on it to best protect themselves and others. This is not a virus that's going to run it's course in the next few months, this is an extremely resilient, highly infectious disease that will only abate once the majority of the world population has been infected and developed immunity to the strain or a vaccine is created that affords immunity to the strain. Stating that "this should all be over by July" is wildly misinformative and could do significant harm, please do not contribute to the spread of misinformation on this topic.
March 12, 2020 11:39 a.m.
It might help to have a visual representation of rate of spread.
Above map is from March 2.
This map is from today.
Map is from CDC website.
March 12, 2020 12:28 p.m.
The above is correct except the virus is not airborne, it is droplet spread which means it can transmit through air a couple meters away directly after a cough or sneeze, but it's not airborne the way that term us used in medicine.
March 14, 2020 7:24 p.m.
wotanaz1337 says... #35
Well shit. It looks like my LGS just temporarily shut down play for a little while. It's not unexpected though it kinda sucks.
I understand why they're doing it. I'm not mad about it considering everything going on. Hopefully things improve for everyone around the world sooner than later. It'd be nice to get back to life.
MTG is a fun hobby but people not dying takes priority. I just wish people would stop panicking so much. It'll pass as long as we all take appropriate precautions.
Here's hoping for the best possible outcomes for everyone.
maxon says... #2
It's to save lives. Suck it up.
March 11, 2020 8:11 p.m.