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sora719, Hi again! I'm so glad you've been keeping up with the deck since the start!
Funnily enough, 3 of the 4 suggestions you made I've been silently questioning myself over as well.
To get Vilis, Broker of Blood out of the way, assuming we use the same 8 mana for Debt to the Deathless, that IS a gain 24 life and a drain of 8 per opponent. As of now, I consider that a worthy value and will make the change.
I've done the math for Divinity of Pride and Archangel of Thune, and assuming I only have the given creature and Liesa out, DoP has more lifegain for the first 3 turns of combat. After that, AoT has the better lifegain rate, as it increases every turn. Notably, I have 17 possible ways to gain life in the deck, so it's likely I could make AoT buff even faster. My only worry is that a growing board/ growing Liesa will incentivise my opponents to kill it/her more than DoP ever would.
However Archangel of Thune is my favorite angel (after mistress Liesa of course), so I'm inclined to use it. Given the fact that it also isn't as color restrictive as DoP, I'll go ahead and make the change.
I have more than enough copies of Erebos, God of the Dead laying around, and the indestructible creature makes it very versatile, so I'll make that change too.
Finally, Heliod's Intervention. I did originally have it in the maybe board, but I couldn't find a slot for it. Anyone who's seen my Karametra, God of Harvests deck knows I love me some enchantment and artifact removal. That being said, I'm still not sure what I would remove for it.
I'll add it back to the maybe board, and hope I grow tired of some other card so I can make the switch.
Thank you so much for the comment and help!
December 2, 2020 1:30 p.m.
mrdoctorman yeah, I was thinking that'd be the only option. I'll make the change and see how it does.
November 28, 2020 7:23 p.m.
Sphere of Safety can usually tax for 3-4 mana per creature in the average game with this deck. 1/5 of the cards are enchantments.
Syphon Mind I think is very good, as it's 4 mana for 6 card advantage.
As for Angel of Destiny, opponents gain a net 0 life off of it. I run it for the lose-con and the life gain. Winning with combat damage isn't a priority; it basically says "skip your combat to gain life equal to your creatures combined power" except that it stacks with lifelink so Liesa would gain me 10 not 5. For what it's worth, it also synergizes with Tainted Remedy.
If you have suggestions for more efficient versions of those cards, feel free to suggest them. Angel of Destiny is nonnegotiable though lol
November 25, 2020 7:12 p.m.
jmozer33, it would be ok, but the main focus of the deck is life drain. I'm not trying to run too many stax pieces because I don't want to get hated out of the game, I have a ton of stax already for a deck whose focus isn't stax, and I do want my opponents to be able to fight back 99/100 times, as it makes it more fun and interesting.
Idk if that makes sense. Like, the goal of the deck is to drain opponents out, and that's a slower strategy. So I utilize some stax effects to put other players on a clock more similar to mine. If I'm going to run a card that completely destroys a deck archetype (like Rest in Peace for gy decks) I would rather run Drannith Magistrate which turns off decks who need their commander or want to cheat spells (and I do run it).
Another factor is that I play in optimized games so some stax is ok but dedicated stax decks are still frowned upon and I feel like if I add much more it'll be too much. Also the problem of I can't imagine what I'd remove to put it in.
November 24, 2020 1:53 p.m. Edited.
jmozer33 I'll put Hushbringer on the maybe board, though I'm not sure what I would take out. I'll make the change for Mind Stone. Mana Crypt is too expensive and it's can also feel super bad to play against, so I don't want to draw too much aggro since I'm already abusing opponents. As for Vampiric Tutor, yeah the price is decently high but I also try not to run too many tutors over straight card draw because I like having some variance and I'd probably just end up tutoring for Bolas's Citadel every game (is it bad that I like Citadel over Necropotence?)
November 24, 2020 1:38 a.m.
jmozer33 not at all (a little, but I'll get to that in a second). You may be missing that Liesa herself has lifelink. Swinging with her every turn gives you enough life to cast 5 spells every 2 turns and break even. You probably wont be casting this many spells. You may also notice that a lot of card still gain us life even though they aren't in the Masochism section; this is because while they do gain us life, its more of a bonus while they're true purpose is whatever section they are in; for example, Twilight Prophet, Crypt Ghast, and Authority of the Consuls are all in separate sections yet can all gain us life. But again, Liesa will be gaining us 5 every turn which more or less negates her tax.
The only problems I've really had is when I get Bolas's Citadel out while Liesa is in play. Like I mention in the primer, it's extra bone-hurty. Doubly so if you run into a card that requires lifeloss to cast like Anguished Unmaking or Read the Bones. But I haven't found it to be enough of a problem to warrant replacing tax effects with lifegain, and Citadel provides such an advantage I think it's worth it.
November 23, 2020 5:56 p.m.
Samimaru, thanks for the upvote and suggestions!
Unfortunately, those cards are much better when you are playing around creature deaths (especially your own). I have them all in my Teysa Karlov deck since the main goal of that deck is to make as many tokens as possible and sac and recur creatures that produce tokens on death. This deck does NOT want our creature to die, as their value lies in what they do while in play. I also run a lot of exile effects for opponents creatures so even Blood Artist wouldn't be utilized to its fullest extent were I to run it, despite triggering on any creature.
I definitely think those creatures are good but they have a place and purpose to fulfill, neither of which really fit into this deck.
November 23, 2020 4:09 p.m.
Goldbranner, thanks for the praise :)
I agree with you about Drana's Emissary being underwhelming. I'll make the suggested change right now.
And I'll never undervalue Magic's goodest boi(s)
November 22, 2020 8:18 p.m.
sora719, Thank you for the compliment! I love Orzhov and I'm really proud of how this deck turned out.
Sorin Markov is a bit too expensive for me, considering he only removes one player and he paints a giant target on your back. I could see it being worth it if you run into it using Bolas's Citadel... I guess basically I only feel comfortable running it if I already have a monopoly on the game/ severe resource advantage over my opponents. Once it takes care of one player, the others will be scrambling to knock me down several pegs.
Wound Reflection is a card that I've been contemplating for a while but not added due to it's similar high cmc. However, I don't think it paints as large a target, and it does something that I am in general more looking for than Sorin Markov. Doubling the Liesa damage (among all other damage) is super good, and I feel like once the enchantment is removed, opponents will kind of forget how much it hurt them (to a reasonable extent) since it's a "do nothing" enchantment. For now, I'll add it to the maybe board.
November 21, 2020 2:50 a.m.
Hello! I just finished my primer for Liesa here
I recommend not going so hard on the enchantment synergies. You'll have a decent amount, but it's not the main focus of the deck, unless you really want it to be. I STRONGLY recommend you add some lands and try to get your average cmc to around 3.
November 19, 2020 6:48 p.m. Edited.
Commander / EDH
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Commander / EDH
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Commander / EDH
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|Avg. deck rating||7.78|
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