Questions about Hexproof and Abilities
Asked by ImTriForceGuy 12 years ago
The wording for Hexproof states it "Can't be the target of spells or abilities opponent's control". Which is slightly different from the "protection' wording of, "Can't be targeted by .."
(Important parts between asterisks)
Do static abilities work on Hexproof? Such as Deathouch, Reach etc?
I only ask because the wording would imply no.
Ex. Blocking a Sluiceway Scorpion with a Rubbleback Rhino
Deathtouch is still an ability, albeit a static one. Since the wording is "Can't be the target of" not, "can't be targeted". What happens?
112.1a An ability is a characteristic an object has that lets it affect the game. An objects abilities are defined by its rules text or by the effect that created it. Abilities can also be granted to objects by rules or effects. (Effects that do so use the words has, have, gains, or gain. ) Abilities generate effects. (See rule 609, Effects. )
702.2a Deathtouch is a static ability.
The "Target of" is confusing. If they wanted it work on only spells and activated abilities that "Target", why didn't they use the wording of 'protection'?"Hexproof: Creatures with hexproof can't be targeted by spells of abilities your opponent controls"
Instead they used "Can't be the target of". And I know they're pretty picky about the wordings.
ImTriForceGuy says... #2
Then why did they use that specific wording? Why didn't the just use the wording they already have and say, "Can't be targeted by"? Seems illogical to change a wording that was already being used.
November 29, 2012 12:44 p.m.
Epochalyptik says... #3
Also, protection is different from hexproof.
Hexproof just means "this object can't be the target of spells or abilities your opponents control."
Protection means "this object can't be dealt damage by, enchanted by, equipped by, blocked by, or targeted by objects of the relevant quality."
November 29, 2012 12:45 p.m.
Rhadamanthus says... #4
To answer your deeper question, the noun/verb usages of "target" represent the same game concept. They aren't distinct words with separate sets of rules.
November 29, 2012 12:46 p.m.
ImTriForceGuy says... #5
@Epochalyptik I know protection is different, I was referring to the wording of the protection, as it pertained to the 'targeting' part.
Is there some instance where 'Can't be the target of' would be different in effect than 'Can't be targeted by'?
November 29, 2012 12:49 p.m.
Rhadamanthus says... #6
There's no particular reason for the specific wording not matching 100%. It's just the natural language choice that happened to be made at the time each one was published. In English, both sentences mean the exact same thing.
November 29, 2012 12:50 p.m.
Epochalyptik says... #7
No. They mean the same thing. It's likely that protection uses a different wording just for the parallelism with the rest of the elements of protection.
November 29, 2012 12:51 p.m.
ImTriForceGuy says... #8
I knew they were careful on their wording, and the subtle differences made me wonder if there was a difference in effect.
November 29, 2012 12:53 p.m.
Rhadamanthus says... Accepted answer #9
The carefulness in wording is really about the use of the game's unique "vocabulary words" to describe effects. If such a word is present, then you use its specific in-game meaning instead of the conventional English meaning. Any declensions, conjugations, gerunds/gerundives, etc. of that word will also carry the full in-game meaning.
If a particular vocabulary word is absent from a description, its in-game meaning should not be applied to any other words in the description when determining how the effect interacts with other effects referencing the vocabulary word.
Words words words.
November 29, 2012 1:03 p.m.
Also, just to add some extra information, Aura spells like Rancor don't actually use the word "target" on the card, but they are a targeted spell as stated by the official rules concerning Auras.
November 29, 2012 1:48 p.m.
In response to your question regarding deathtouch on a hexproof creature, the hexproof creature will still die to the deathtouch. This is because deathtouch is not an ability affecting the hexproof creature, but the one with deathtouch. Namely, it grants the ability that any amount of damage this creature deals is sufficient to kill other creatures. The hexproof creature is not being affected by an ability here, but merely damage that is at all times considered sufficiently lethal.
Naturally, having protection against the creature with deathtouch means no damage goes through to begin with, and thus the deathtouch is worthless.
Epochalyptik says... #1
A spell or ability doesn't target unless it specifically says "target." If the text of the spell or ability doesn't say "target," that spell or ability is not targeted.
Static effects aren't targeted. Things like deathtouch don't interact with hexproof.
November 29, 2012 12:42 p.m.