Multiple Sacrifice Effects in the Upkeep step?
Asked by cerealkyra 11 years ago
Alright, hopefully you guys can help settle a bet/argument between a friend and I. I played Mogis, God of Slaughter on turn 4. My friend plays Call to the Grave on his 5th turn. He remarks that he only has to sacrifice one creature in order to satisfy the conditions on both of our cards, regardless of any of the terms on either card(as in, ignoring the non-zombie requirement)
I procede call him an idiot, as there are 2 concurrent but separate sacrifice effects in play, he has to pay for both. He disagrees, but in the interest of fun we play on.
As far as the boardstate, He had a Rakdos Cackler he stole from me, 3 zombie tokens and a [[Grimgrin, Corpse Born and I had a single Boros Reckoner and Mogis.
Please help settle this $20 bet, Tappedout.
CamperCarl00 says... Accepted answer #2
Here's the thing, both of you are right in some parts and both of you are wrong. Your friend is definitely wrong that one sacrifice satisfies the effects of both Mogis, God of Slaughter and Call to the Grave . Both of it's effects are put on the stack at the beginning of his upkeep, and both will resolve separately each requiring the desired sacrifice.
Your friend though, is able to stack these effects in any way he wishes since they both trigger at the same time during his upkeep. This means, that if he stacks the effects to where Mogis, God of Slaughter occurs before Call to the Grave , then he may choose to sacrifice Rakdos Cackler first, satisfying it's effect. Call to the Grave then resolves, requiring him to sacrifice a non-zombie creature which he no longer has and then proceeds to fizzle. On subsequent turns, unless he somehow finds himself in the possession of two non-zombie creatures, he will not have to sacrifice more than one creature per upkeep due to the specific sacrifice requirements on Call to the Grave .
March 2, 2014 3:40 a.m.
ZombieBatman_ says... #3
I am the idiot as referenced in the question. Thanks for both answers guys, my argument is completely debunked by CamperCarl00's mention of the stack. I actually wasn't a hundred percent on there being a stack in the upkeep but if that is indeed the case both abilities would go onto the stack and then resolve independently. I honestly don't like the idea of choosing the order in which they resolve, it seems a rather inelegant solution to having abilities trigger at upkeep. It seemed like a cool situation to find yourself, where both abilities happen at the same time with one creature satisfying both, but this is clearly not the case.
March 2, 2014 4:08 a.m.
Epochalyptik says... #4
Technically speaking, CamperCarl00, a spell or ability only fizzles if all its targets are illegal. Call to the Grave 's ability doesn't target anything. It merely resolves and tries to do as much as it can. If the active player controls no non-Zombie creatures, then the ability will do nothing.
March 2, 2014 5:12 a.m.
Minor note, i think CamperCarl00 is slightly wrong. Since the triggered abilities come from different owners, i think they are put onto the stack in the order of priority: so whichever ability you control will go on the stack first, in this case, Call to the Grave , and then Mogis, God of Slaughter triggers, and then resolves first. Someone correct me if i'm wrong, but i think if abilities are controlled by different players, that you don't get to choose the order of resolution.
March 2, 2014 5:52 a.m.
Rhadamanthus says... #6
KingSorin pointed out something important. A player only gets to decide the order of abilities that trigger at the same time if he controls them. Otherwise, all of the active player's triggers are put onto the stack first, then the non-active player's abilities are put onto the stack on top of them. In this case, however, the order just happens to end up being the "best" one described in CamperCarl00's answer.
March 2, 2014 7:40 a.m.
Epochalyptik says... #7
@WotanubisReturned: Check the post dates before commenting. If a Q&A thread has been inactive for a week or more and/or if you have an unrelated question, start a new thread.
Yes. You control the abilities, so you choose the order in which they go onto the stack. If you place Demonic Appetite's ability on the stack last, it resolves first and you can sacrifice your Homunculus token.
Slycne says... #1
You are correct. Each one is a separate ability that triggers on upkeep and each effect requires its own sacrifice - or 2 damage in Mogis's case. Trying to fulfill both with a single sacrifice would be akin to trying to tap the same land for 2 different spells.
If it worked like your friend mused, one of the abilities would need a conditional if in the statement.
March 2, 2014 3:35 a.m.